Are there major changes coming this summer and who will make them?

[Pimlach]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

I totally get the trepidation over Norris’ health, and we all have different valuations on players, but I don’t understand why people don’t see a fit.

They thought they had a long-term 2C in Cozens. They were wrong.

They traded him for what they thought was the best replacement 2C available. 

I mean you needed a centre and you weren’t getting Sam Bennett for Dylan Cozens.

Why doesn’t Norris fit? Or am I just misreading what people mean by fit and they actually just mean his health?

By fit, I mean Norris health is a high risk, if he is not available he has little value.   Is he ever going to be a reliable top 6 center?   The two teams swapped high salaried players that they didn't like anymore.  

With Byram, one year after the trade Adams goes on to say he was sure how to use him.   Did he trade Mitts for him because he would win the trade or did he get a defenseman that he needed?  I do not get any sense of comfort that he is building an NHL roster that can compete. 

I think they had a very weak center spline last season and so apparently did Lindy.   They gave up on Cozens, moved Kulich from wing to center, and moved Tage from center to wing.   One bright spot was McLeod.  

I like Norris when he is healthy but he is a risky player to carry as your 1C/2C.  I just get no semblance of a plan to build a winning team.  

[LGR4GM]

None of those options. I think all coaches stay and they make a few minor defensive tweaks to the roster.

[Flashsabre]

2 hours ago, dudacek said:

I totally get the trepidation over Norris’ health, and we all have different valuations on players, but I don’t understand why people don’t see a fit.

They thought they had a long-term 2C in Cozens. They were wrong.

They traded him for what they thought was the best replacement 2C available. 

I mean you needed a centre and you weren’t getting Sam Bennett for Dylan Cozens.

Why doesn’t Norris fit? Or am I just misreading what people mean by fit and they actually just mean his health?

For me it’s a guy making $8 million a year and has only passed 35 points in a season once. Couple that with a guy who can’t stay healthy to save his life and you are “hoping” that he somehow comes around.

[dudacek]

23 minutes ago, Flashsabre said:

For me it’s a guy making $8 million a year and has only passed 35 points in a season once. Couple that with a guy who can’t stay healthy to save his life and you are “hoping” that he somehow comes around.

35 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

By fit, I mean Norris health is a high risk, if he is not available he has little value.   Is he ever going to be a reliable top 6 center?   The two teams swapped high salaried players that they didn't like anymore.  

With Byram, one year after the trade Adams goes on to say he was sure how to use him.   Did he trade Mitts for him because he would win the trade or did he get a defenseman that he needed?  I do not get any sense of comfort that he is building an NHL roster that can compete. 

I think they had a very weak center spline last season and so apparently did Lindy.   They gave up on Cozens, moved Kulich from wing to center, and moved Tage from center to wing.   One bright spot was McLeod.  

I like Norris when he is healthy but he is a risky player to carry as your 1C/2C.  I just get no semblance of a plan to build a winning team.  

I wouldn't call either of these "fit" in terms of Norris, but valid points nonetheless.

Personally, I see Norris as different than say Samuelsson and Greenway, in the sense that he hasn't been prone to multiple injuries. He had a bad shoulder that wasn't properly treated.

It's either fixed now or it isn't, and if it is (it held up all year) I don't think he's at any more of a risk than Thompson or Tuch, both of whom lost a ton of games as well to shoulder issues earlier in their careers.

You're betting on his surgeon and your doctor.

[Taro T]

3 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

None of those options. I think all coaches stay and they make a few minor defensive tweaks to the roster.

IMHO this is close.  Sadly expect the coaching roster to be what it is, and that is not good.  And it will make it much harder to make the playoffs than it should be.

But also expect Peterka and Byram out the door due to all the smoke surrounding them.  And am HOPING it ends up bringing RobERTson back.

IF those Byram and Peterka moves (or other) bring back a top 4 2 way/defensive D-man expect that Samuelsson also goes out the door.  Sure seemed they were trying to figure out if Samuelsson could handle getting paired with Dahlin when the season was more or less officially toast.  Based on Ruff's comments about the roster down the stretch don't believe he passed the test.

Hoping a goalie gets brought in as well, but not overly hopeful about that.

Edited Thursday at 12:20 AM by Taro T
Typo. D'oh!

[Pimlach]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

I wouldn't call either of these "fit" in terms of Norris, but valid points nonetheless.

Personally, I see Norris as different than say Samuelsson and Greenway, in the sense that he hasn't been prone to multiple injuries. He had a bad shoulder that wasn't properly treated.

It's either fixed now or it isn't, and if it is (it held up all year) I don't think he's at any more of a risk than Thompson or Tuch, both of whom lost a ton of games as well to shoulder issues earlier in their careers.

You're betting on his surgeon and your doctor.

I thought we heard something that his injury in Buffalo was not the shoulder.   I seem to recall an abdominal injury?   Maybe someone else can remember?  

[Pimlach]

59 minutes ago, Taro T said:

IMHO this is close.  Sadly expect the coaching roster to be what it is, and that is not good.  And it will make it much harder to make the playoffs than it should be.

But also expect Peterka and Byram out the door due to all the smoke surrounding them.  And am HOPING it ends up bringing Robinson back.

IF those Byram and Peterka moves (or other) bring back a top 4 2 way/defensive D-man expect that Samuelsson also goes out the door.  Sure seemed they were trying to figure out if Samuelsson could handle getting paired with Dahlin when the season was more or less officially toast.  Based on Ruff's comments about the roster down the stretch don't believe he passed the test.

Hoping a goalie gets brought in as well, but not overly hopeful about that.

Taro I think your right on the bold but Peterka and Byram will be missed.   

Hard to imagine Adams bringing in two or more players that are actually better. 

A Goalie, two defenseman, more forward help, and they need need more muscle in the line up - but even getting that is hard.  

 

[JohnC]

9 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

I thought we heard something that his injury in Buffalo was not the shoulder.   I seem to recall an abdominal injury?   Maybe someone else can remember?  

It was an oblique injury that sidelined him.

https://www.buffalohockeybeat.com/sabres-josh-norris-says-oblique-injury-sidelined-him-final-18-games/

Edited Thursday at 12:01 AM by JohnC

[Carmel Corn]

5 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

Taro I think your right on the bold but Peterka and Byram will be missed.   

Hard to imagine Adams bringing in two or more players that are actually better. 

A Goalie, two defenseman, more forward help, and they need need more muscle in the line up - but even getting that is hard.  

 

Agree....maybe a different choice of words vs. "better" (IMHO I would be inclined to use "Different").   An example of different might be a top 4 shutdown RHD could be a win for this organization.  Another win might be a package that nets a true 1C or 2C.  To your point, more muscle or better goalie is also a difference....for the better 😉

[JohnC]

1 minute ago, Carmel Corn said:

Agree....maybe a different choice of words vs. "better" (IMHO I would be inclined to use "Different").   An example of different might be a top 4 shutdown RHD could be a win for this organization.  Another win might be a package that nets a true 1C or 2C.  To your point, more muscle or better goalie is also a difference....for the better 😉

The most impactful move that can be made is upgrading the goalie position. There will need to be more moves but addressing that position, and then adding a different mix to the blueline are the priorities. Ullmark in my view can be categorized as a solid #1 goalie. It is essential that entering next season we find someone who can provide that level of play. Penciling UPL in as the #1 goalie without a backup plan is gambling against the odds. 

[Taro T]

24 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

Taro I think your right on the bold but Peterka and Byram will be missed.   

Hard to imagine Adams bringing in two or more players that are actually better. 

A Goalie, two defenseman, more forward help, and they need need more muscle in the line up - but even getting that is hard.  

 

Especially if there is no changes in the coaching staff, really don't have a whole lot of confidence on the team getting improved as much as we all want to see.  But, Peterka, Byram, and pieces becoming Robertson and a GOOD stay at home or 2 way D-man seems to be about the best we can be hoping for as the key moves at this point.

Thing that stinks is for about the 3rd year in a row, it really wouldn't take many GOOD moves at all to get this team back into the dance which brings it back to relevancy.

And, like you and pretty much everybody else here would like to see the rest of that list you brought up happen as well.  But not sure Sabres fans get as many dolls as we want; pretty sure we're in the group that has to be happy with 1 or 2.  And if we only get 1 or 2, want 1 of them to be Robertson.

[dudacek]

1 hour ago, Pimlach said:

I thought we heard something that his injury in Buffalo was not the shoulder.   I seem to recall an abdominal injury?   Maybe someone else can remember?  

That is correct. He was playing through an oblique issue in Ottawa.

The Sabres were aware of it when they traded for him and decided to sit him in order to give it time to heal he wasn't getting by playing.

[Flashsabre]

https://www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/article/gms-and-teams-under-the-most-pressure-this-off-season/

[dudacek]

1 minute ago, Thorny said:

He’s had 3 surgeries on it, and his most recent 18 game injury was an unrelated oblique 

Yes? So 18ish games in his entire career unrelated to his bum shoulder and the initial failed surgery?

Tage Thompson has missed 25 games in his career since surgery fixed the shoulder injury that caused him to miss a year.

As I tried to say above, for me any elevated Norris injury risk is tied entirely to his shoulder and whether it is repaired. That's a real risk where you are trusting your doctors, but outside of that he's no different than any other player.

If you want to make the argument entirely about games missed period, that's valid, but it's not the way i look at it. I think the 'why' is relevant.

[dudacek]

Interesting listening to Rick Dhaliwal (Vancouver radio guy with good agent contacts) this morning.

He said the Canucks were desperately trying to add Norris at the deadline to the point of where they had trades lined up to bring in players to flip to the Sens to seal the deal.

Their bid failed because “they didn’t have a Dylan Cozens to offer”

We’ve always questioned why the Sabres threw in a 2nd in the deal. This may be part of the answer 

[Thorny]

3 hours ago, dudacek said:

Yes? So 18ish games in his entire career unrelated to his bum shoulder and the initial failed surgery?

Tage Thompson has missed 25 games in his career since surgery fixed the shoulder injury that caused him to miss a year.

As I tried to say above, for me any elevated Norris injury risk is tied entirely to his shoulder and whether it is repaired. That's a real risk where you are trusting your doctors, but outside of that he's no different than any other player.

If you want to make the argument entirely about games missed period, that's valid, but it's not the way i look at it. I think the 'why' is relevant.

Yes, roughly the first 18 he had a chance to play since “recovering” from his shoulder 

Honestly, though if im the sabres (not you)  - I’d be comfortable penciling him in for top 6 duty for 70-80 even though he’s never done it because why not? honestly a gamble here makes sense, we have some runway to work with. And he can snipe. 

Edited 13 hours ago by Thorny

[dudacek]

37 minutes ago, Thorny said:

Yes, roughly the first 18 he had a chance to play since “recovering” from his shoulder 

Honestly, though if im the sabres (not you)  - I’d be comfortable penciling him in for top 6 duty for 70-80 even though he’s never done it because why not? honestly a gamble here makes sense, we have some runway to work with. And he can snipe. 

Glad to see I’m not the only one around here stooping to using sarcasm.

On that note, they probably would have been much better off just sticking with Dylan Cozens, or trading Cozens for Filip Chytil instead.

Edited 13 hours ago by dudacek

[dudacek]

On 6/12/2025 at 8:09 AM, dudacek said:

Can't trade the good guys because we need them

Can't trade the bad guys because nobody wants them.

Can't sign free agents because nobody wants to come here.

Can't really do anything because Kevyn Adams is the GM and Terry Pegula is pulling his strings.

Pretty much where every conversation around here ends up.

 

[Thorny]

9 minutes ago, dudacek said:

 

There’s tons of things they can do. They can trade their first round pick 

The things they can do fall under the category of “well, WELL, no one else does that so”

..so they don’t get considered. But the sabres RECORD is something no one else does. They should trade their first, trade Konsta H, any future asset they can in the name of competing this year: there will be a draft next year, you’ll get your 7 picks people, it’ll be ok 

[Weave]

20 minutes ago, Thorny said:

There’s tons of things they can do. They can trade their first round pick 

The things they can do fall under the category of “well, WELL, no one else does that so”

..so they don’t get considered. But the sabres RECORD is something no one else does. They should trade their first, trade Konsta H, any future asset they can in the name of competing this year: there will be a draft next year, you’ll get your 7 picks people, it’ll be ok 

They also need to trade rostered players to make room for the guys coming in through the trades you are suggesting.

[Archie Lee]

45 minutes ago, Thorny said:

There’s tons of things they can do. They can trade their first round pick 

The things they can do fall under the category of “well, WELL, no one else does that so”

..so they don’t get considered. But the sabres RECORD is something no one else does. They should trade their first, trade Konsta H, any future asset they can in the name of competing this year: there will be a draft next year, you’ll get your 7 picks people, it’ll be ok 

I have zero expectations that they will act responsibly and effectively, but if I'm in the "they should" mode, then they should act like a normal NHL team and keep the players who are good and can help them win now (see: Byram, Peterka), and move out some younger NHL assets that are not helping them win now and that are, in some cases, a bit over-priced or about to be a bit over-priced (see: Power, Kulich, Quinn, Samuelsson, perhaps Luukkonen, combined 20 million in cap for the coming season), for players who can help them make the playoffs now.  Attach a prospect or draft pick to these players if needed, but don't toss away the future. 

The Sabres can't bring in veteran contracts without sending contracts out. If they want to win now, the contracts that are leaving should be the ones that are least likely to help with that goal. 

 

 

  

[Flashsabre]

 

[Night Train]

I would not miss Power or Muel.  Both overpaid for big pacifists

Just get a return of useful help. 

[LGR4GM]

you may think this post is about gt, it's not. The bottom axis shows xG against/faced. Buffalo, while not unique needs to be far better at being lower there. 

But also yes gt was awful and UPL was bad. What's also of note is that Reimer is kitty corner to UPL. I'd guess they played better team defense down the stretch but also Reimer let it fewer goals.

So it's just confirmation they need to overhaul defense and gt.