Feel free to bash me...I want the Sabres to miss the playoffs!

[fan2456]

But what did he score?

Don't know, didn't see the card. But McCormick, Leopold and Staff played with him and might be able to tell you. I'll leave out the members who took them out.

[JJFIVEOH]

Does size really matter? Been hearing non-stop criticism about the Sabres being too small. Roy this.......... Gerbe that.......... I guess we need to get rid of Ennis then.

[fan2456]

Does size really matter? Been hearing non-stop criticism about the Sabres being too small. Roy this.......... Gerbe that.......... I guess we need to get rid of Ennis then.

Not at all. Good teams have a small player and surround them with size and grit. We have little grit and too many smalll players. I've said it before. To rank our midgets:

1. Ennis

2. Roy

3. Gerbe

 

You may be able to have two at most on a cup winner, but you need size with grit and skill to play with them. We have a paucity of the last three and an over abundance of small and /or soft. Sorry, but that is my objective opinion. Objectivity means not falling in love with a player because he is a good story or he's a great guy. How you can be watching these playoffs and not think that size and nastiness matters is beyond me. Doug Gilmour was small and won a cup and is a hall of famer. He would chop you up with his stick to protect himself and his big teammates would pile in to protect him. So which small guy on the Sabres plays like that, and who will pour in to protect him? Hell, everyone protects their goalie and the refs allow it. Oops, I forgot about Miller and Lucic.

[Trettioåtta]

I am not sure the sabres need a number 1 C now, i think Coho and Ennis are good enough tbh. I would rather spend the money to get Brown (or someone like him) and another top D man. I think a defence core of:

 

XXXXX-Myers

Erhoff - Regher

Mcnabb - Leopold

Sulzer

 

Would really help Miller and help this team

[TheChimp]

Here we go. Vanek-Hodgson-Finley!! :w00t:

[JJFIVEOH]

Here we go. Vanek-Hodgson-Finley!! :w00t:

 

I know there was a hint of sarcasm there, but I am very intrigued about the possibility of him being up next year! I don't know exactly how his development has come along in Rochester. I know he's not that fastest skater on the ice. But, he was a 1st round pick and from what I've gathered the only thing that kept him from progressing was his wrist injury. I wouldn't mind seeing him as a 4th line winger or 8th/emergency D-man if he's improved his game over the course of the year.

[deluca67]

I am not sure the sabres need a number 1 C now, i think Coho and Ennis are good enough tbh. I would rather spend the money to get Brown (or someone like him) and another top D man. I think a defence core of:

 

XXXXX-Myers

Erhoff - Regher

Mcnabb - Leopold

Sulzer

 

Would really help Miller and help this team

Ennis and Hodgson are nowhere near being #1 centers at this point. Hodgson at best is a weak #3, #1 center is an absolute priority. If Regier is unable to get a deal done for a top line center than adding a top line winger becomes the priority.

 

Does size really matter? Been hearing non-stop criticism about the Sabres being too small. Roy this.......... Gerbe that.......... I guess we need to get rid of Ennis then.

Watch the Pitt/Philly series and tell me if you think the soft smallish Sabres forwards would survive that level of physical hockey. The teams have combined for 339 hits through 5 games. You thought the Sabres had injury problems in the regular season. In a series like this the Sabres would have the entire Amerks roster dressed by game 5.

[JJFIVEOH]

 

Ennis and Hodgson are nowhere near being #1 centers at this point. Hodgson at best is a weak #3, #1 center is an absolute priority. If Regier is unable to get a deal done for a top line center than adding a top line winger becomes the priority.

 

 

Watch the Pitt/Philly series and tell me if you think the soft smallish Sabres forwards would survive that level of physical hockey. The teams have combined for 339 hits through 5 games. You thought the Sabres had injury problems in the regular season. In a series like this the Sabres would have the entire Amerks roster dressed by game 5.

 

The Flyers have their fair share of small forwards, and they're still playing. If I remember last years series correctly it wasn't our small players who were getting hurt. I would bet if you looked at all the injuries in the league this year you would find no correlation. We don't need fewer small forwards, we need more tough forwards so we don't have to rely on the little guys if/when the big guys get hurt. Take all the Sabres injuries this year, there was also no correlation with size.

[fan2456]

The Flyers have their fair share of small forwards, and they're still playing. If I remember last years series correctly it wasn't our small players who were getting hurt. I would bet if you looked at all the injuries in the league this year you would find no correlation. We don't need fewer small forwards, we need more tough forwards so we don't have to rely on the little guys if/when the big guys get hurt. Take all the Sabres injuries this year, there was also no correlation with size.

Yes they do. Name them and more importantly, their linemates.

[bunomatic]

You want the odd small forward mixed into a lineup of big powerful gritty players not the odd big powerful gritty player mixed in with a lineup of small forwards which seems to be what Regier envisioned when he drafted some of these guys. Mind you he has drafted for size in the last few years but he seems to be playing catch up now. The league seems to be trending to a bigger meaner brand of hockey.

[LGR4GM]

The flyers have 6forwards under 6foot. The Sabres have 3. Now can we move on? It isn't size its toughness. Foligno is tough. Stafford is not. Both are bigger guys but only one uses his size. Most of the flyers use their size where the sabres have only a few.

[X. Benedict]

Vanek could be a superstar in the league if the Sabres would just allow him to be. The forwards should be built around him. He should be the team's leader in minutes and should be playing on both the #1 PK and #1 PP on a regular basis. The #1 focus should be finding a center to feed Vanek the puck and a big RW to help create space for Vanek. If Rick Nash could be had, than go get Rick Nash to play opposite of Vanek.

 

The Sabres have built around Vanek. The trouble is that teams built around the wing are generally flawed.

 

I would be very excited if Rick Nash came to the Sabres. But there was a reason Rick Nash on Columbus was a flawed team too.

It is hard to build teams around the wing position.

[fan2456]

Yes we should move on, as your point to Stafford/Foligno and how a player uses their dimensions is the most poignant observation. But stats are a funny thing and depend how you use them. The flyers have no forwards under 5'10, we have three. The flyers have no forwards under 5'7, we have two.

 

As we all know Briere isn't 5'10" like their website says. But we inflate our roster sizes also.

[LGR4GM]

We have 1 forward under 5'7"... Ennis n Roy are 5'9" and so even though u r bitching about an inch of height you completely ignore the fact that the fliers are physically the same size as buffalo up front. Manipulate the stats all you want. All I know is your making crap up to prove a point that's false. The sabres have players who play small. Not small players. I'm done with this. Its pointless.

[TheChimp]

You want the odd small forward mixed into a lineup of big powerful gritty players not the odd big powerful gritty player mixed in with a lineup of small forwards which seems to be what Regier envisioned when he drafted some of these guys. Mind you he has drafted for size in the last few years but he seems to be playing catch up now. The league seems to be trending to a bigger meaner brand of hockey.

Yup.

[deluca67]

The Sabres have built around Vanek. The trouble is that teams built around the wing are generally flawed.

 

I would be very excited if Rick Nash came to the Sabres. But there was a reason Rick Nash on Columbus was a flawed team too.

It is hard to build teams around the wing position.

If the Sabres were built around Vanek, wouldn't getting a #1 center have been a bigger priority?

[fan2456]

We have 1 forward under 5'7"... Ennis n Roy are 5'9" and so even though u r bitching about an inch of height you completely ignore the fact that the fliers are physically the same size as buffalo up front. Manipulate the stats all you want. All I know is your making crap up to prove a point that's false. The sabres have players who play small. Not small players. I'm done with this. Its pointless.

My bad, I misread Ennis's height on roster. It's a rainy Saturday and I already worked out, so I wasted 15 min searching every NHL forward roster as linked thru Sares home page. We have the distinction of having the shortest(Gerbe) and lightest(Ennis) forwards in the NHL. And as you have said, a bunch of soft players at forward. I contend we have soft players all over this roster. I'm not bitching about anything. Sabres have players who play small for sure. And when you get to the last two rounds when it's balls-to-the wall and that big guy plays as hard as your small guy, you lose. I've been watching it for years. We have a GM with a vision problem, plain and simple. Spend 15 minutes and look at the size of some of these forward rosters that are in the playoffs and winning their series. THe NHL rules do not favor the small or soft.

 

Yup.

Second that YUP! And it kills me. LOL

[JJFIVEOH]

Yes they do. Name them and more importantly, their linemates.

 

I think that would go along with my point about the Sabres needing tougher forwards to complement them. Not the need to decrease the number of small forwards we have. ;)

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Interesting stat. Of the top 30 highest scoring centers in the league, 7 of the top 10 are in the playoffs, 7 between 11-20 are in the playoffs and 6 between 21-30 are in the playoffs. I don't see any correlation between high scoring centers being on more successful teams.

 

My bad, I misread Ennis's height on roster. It's a rainy Saturday and I already worked out, so I wasted 15 min searching every NHL forward roster as linked thru Sares home page. We have the distinction of having the shortest(Gerbe) and lightest(Ennis) forwards in the NHL. And as you have said, a bunch of soft players at forward. I contend we have soft players all over this roster. I'm not bitching about anything. Sabres have players who play small for sure. And when you get to the last two rounds when it's balls-to-the wall and that big guy plays as hard as your small guy, you lose. I've been watching it for years. We have a GM with a vision problem, plain and simple. Spend 15 minutes and look at the size of some of these forward rosters that are in the playoffs and winning their series. THe NHL rules do not favor the small or soft.

 

Second that YUP! And it kills me. LOL

 

And yet those two players aren't the issues we have with toughness. Ennis didn't get hurt because he was too small. In fact if he was bigger his ankle injurt probably would have been worse. Gerbe got hurt because of a concussion from a hit that would have given a big man a concussion. Plus, there is no questioning Gerbe's toughness, he has more of it than most of the team. So the obvious issue isn't the size of our players, it's the toughness of a select few. And I don't even think that's as much of a factor as the style of play which lands on the coach.

 

Another thing to consider, as has been mentioned, the direction of the league. Somebody said that DR was behind the ball when he decided he needed to draft size. With the league cracking down on so much physical play in this years playoffs, who's to say the direction won't change again in the very near future? What's to say teams will get away from the physical aspect because they know they can't get away with it any longer?

[fan2456]

I would like to think the league would change, but 2006 was the aberration, not what we are seeing now. As long as it's a Canadian game, and the old boys network runs it, this is what it wil be. Mario Lemieux called it a garage league in the early 90's. Look, I loved the game of 2006 and have nothing against skill guys. To me it should be a game of skill and speed, like it was in 2006. It's back to systems, interfering and impeding, all of which work against the skill player. I'm not saying these guys aren't tough. Hell, what guy could get to the NHL at 161lbs. if he didn't have exceptional skill, speed and toughness. I'm not complaining about hits. I'm talking about the small or soft skill player having to fight through the impeding, holding etc., which are PENALTIES the way the rules are written. But the NHL, has a very long history of ignoring their rule book,thus neutralising the skill guys. It's not the physical hitting as much as the impeding. So, you need guys who are able to impede and guys who can fight through the impeding.

 

I pretty much agree with your first paragraph. However, Gerbe's height puts his head in a very vulnerable position, even if a guy doesn't raise an elbow. My son was always one of the smaller skilled players on the ice and he'd take a lot of hits around the head, just because of the size disparity.

[Jsixspd]

Some of the Sulzer lovers here should prepare themselves for disappointment.

I like the guy, but as a 6/7.

 

I'm not in the bag for Sulzer by any means. We had only seen him play 15 games for the Sabres - but what I saw was generally positive. I would have liked more games to evaluate him, particularly the playoffs - he also missed the last two games of the regular season due to that personal emergency.

 

I guess we'll have to wait until October for new information to discuss concerning Alex. Que sera, sera, I guess. Just a terrible let-down to this season... seemed so promising at the start.... then disintegrated in December, then all of a sudden they're back in the playoff hunt only to blow it at the end. Yet another in an increasingly lengthy list of Buffalo sports disappointments and heartbreak for fans.

[TheChimp]

And yet those two players aren't the issues we have with toughness. Ennis didn't get hurt because he was too small. In fact if he was bigger his ankle injurt probably would have been worse. Gerbe got hurt because of a concussion from a hit that would have given a big man a concussion. Plus, there is no questioning Gerbe's toughness, he has more of it than most of the team. So the obvious issue isn't the size of our players, it's the toughness of a select few. And I don't even think that's as much of a factor as the style of play which lands on the coach.

Yup. I tell ya, watching Tropp play, my only feeling is what a shame it is he doesn't carry another 2 inches in height and 30 lbs in weight. His temperament is perfect for his role on the Vanek/Hodgson line, mirroring Foligno on Ennis and Stafford's line. Heck, who knows, maybe Tropp will hit the weights and eat a half a cow this summer....

[JJFIVEOH]

Yup. I tell ya, watching Tropp play, my only feeling is what a shame it is he doesn't carry another 2 inches in height and 30 lbs in weight. His temperament is perfect for his role on the Vanek/Hodgson line, mirroring Foligno on Ennis and Stafford's line. Heck, who knows, maybe Tropp will hit the weights and eat a half a cow this summer....

 

Like I mentioned, I don't think teams are succesful lately because they build around a center. In fact I'd rather have 3 good centers as opposed to one superstar. Arguably the best centers in the league are out of the playoffs now. Not sure what the plans are for Roy, but with Hodgson, Ennis and Roy (or whoever takes his place) is just fine as long as we have another Foligno. Our centers can do just fine with one more physical winger. With Hodgson and Foligno here, I think the addition of a Nash would be perfect for next year. Hopefully Tropp can continue to improve.

[X. Benedict]

If the Sabres were built around Vanek, wouldn't getting a #1 center have been a bigger priority?

The lines were certainly created with Vanek in mind.

 

They don't grow #1 centers on trees. If you have a #1 center that is one way to do it.

They didn't ....and never really had great options in the draft for immediate help. Hard to

say if a trade was ever there.

 

If the Sabres had a #1 center and Vanek, the Sabres could have bullied through most top pairings in the NHL.

They have never had that center...so they have generally tried to roll 4 lines and create mismatches with depth.

 

But really with all the juggling over the years, Vanek has been the constant on the #1 line and #1 PP unit.

[TheChimp]

Like I mentioned, I don't think teams are succesful lately because they build around a center. In fact I'd rather have 3 good centers as opposed to one superstar. Arguably the best centers in the league are out of the playoffs now. Not sure what the plans are for Roy, but with Hodgson, Ennis and Roy (or whoever takes his place) is just fine as long as we have another Foligno. Our centers can do just fine with one more physical winger. With Hodgson and Foligno here, I think the addition of a Nash would be perfect for next year. Hopefully Tropp can continue to improve.

Wild, you said "another Foligno" and I just posted an idea in the 12-13 roster thread that gives us just that! I think you might even like it!! :w00t:

[fan2456]

The lines were certainly created with Vanek in mind.

 

They don't grow #1 centers on trees. If you have a #1 center that is one way to do it.

They didn't ....and never really had great options in the draft for immediate help. Hard to

say if a trade was ever there.

 

If the Sabres had a #1 center and Vanek, the Sabres could have bullied through most top pairings in the NHL.

They have never had that center...so they have generally tried to roll 4 lines and create mismatches with depth.

 

But really with all the juggling over the years, Vanek has been the constant on the #1 line and #1 PP unit.

No they don't grow number one centers on trees. Many on this board yearn for Briere, yet he has never been a 1rst line player in Philly. I listen to the xm broadcast from Philly when in the car, and they refer to the Giroux's line is their number one. Yes Vanek has been a constant on the number one line here. Is the lack of a number one center an excuse, or is he just not first line talent? As I said earlier, the bulk of those who post on this board hate Roy, but would Roy be better if he had two stud wingers. Of course he would. The bulk of the last few years he's had skilled soft wingers in Vanek and Stafford. Then the GENIUS pairs him and Gerbe. Wow, that would scare me if I was Chara and going back to retrieve a puck. OH, but we don't dump it in cuz we know we can't retrieve.LOL Vanek would be better if he had a true #1 center and a physical stud on the other wing without a doubt. Bottom line is Regier has not put together a good team of top line talent. He drafts well? Girouix was #20 overall, at 178lbs, has size and great skill on his wings. Their GM churns his roster like crazy since 2006. While not winning a cup, they certainly have a better playoff record than us in that time period. Every player in this organization whether in the NHL, AHL, Juniors or Europe are his picks. Regier has to go, and the lawyer Black and our owner are being snowed.

 

If bullied means fighting physically through a pairing, I would have to diagree.