Assquatch Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 John Vogl has absolutely no impact on whether Ryan Miller wins another game or ever signs another contract again. I don't think he(miller) cares. Miller seems to be thin-skinned to criticism. He would take less if he didn't piss off the Media, which is at least partially in his control. I'd hate to see this situation turn into Tim Connolly part 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabre4life Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 yeesh. i was specifically asking for back-up on your salvo about how miller needs to balance his personal and professional life and the corresponding implication that miller needs to "stop f'n around." it appears that there is no substantiation for your position, to the extent that i understand it. (why, precisely, should i be looking to woods and mickelson in order to understand miller?) it may be that you're talking about some sort of marriage hang-over. i have heard that point kicked around before regarding athletes, and i would not blame miller if he's a little jelly-legged from marital relations. Phil Mickleson was at the top of his game then came marriage and kids and his play fell it wasn't until he won the Masters when he got over the "mariage hang over", Look at Tiger as well once he put the ring on his game substantially fell, why? Well it's simple really, you devote more time to that than anything else. I gave you two examples of players both in a mentally tough game, the slightest lack of concentration could be fatal. In net the same can be applied just listen to the Ilya Bryzgalov comments from the 9-8 game. It's mentally challenging and if you're thinking about the next time you are going to see your wife because she's in LA and you're Buffalo I'm sure he's off his game or not preparing the same way. Hence the Juggling, he may be a professional athlete but he's also human. Again I'm not saying he shouldn't be #1, I merely stated Ruff is sending a message to him "Stop F'n Around" and get back on your game. And seeing though people are ###### around here about words/quotes the stop f'n around was my impression of the benching, Ruff didn't have to say anything else but "Enroth is starting in Ottawa" for Miller to get the message, Now it's up to Miller and to see how he responds, will he be a baby and pout like he did at first (per Vogl) or will this set him back on track. If you don't agree it's ok, I'm not expecting you or that other clown to do so. It's how I understood the benching and agree with what Ruff did. No doubt Miller's play has been substandard during the 1-4 stretch; and Enroth looks like the real deal, but I think that Ruff is sending a message to the entire team with Miller's benching. Question is... did the Team get the message? We'll see tomorrow night when Miller plays @HOME Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastPommerFan Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Miller seems to be thin-skinned to criticism. He would take less if he didn't piss off the Media, which is at least partially in his control. I'd hate to see this situation turn into Tim Connolly part 2. I don't think there is any evidence that this has any effect on the ice. He's never been on a down swing long enough to let this proposed spiral take hold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dEnnis the Menace Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Phil Mickleson was at the top of his game then came marriage and kids and his play fell it wasn't until he won the Masters when he got over the "mariage hang over", Look at Tiger as well once he put the ring on his game substantially fell, why? Well it's simple really, you devote more time to that than anything else. I gave you two examples of players both in a mentally tough game, the slightest lack of concentration could be fatal. In net the same can be applied just listen to the Ilya Bryzgalov comments from the 9-8 game. It's mentally challenging and if you're thinking about the next time you are going to see your wife because she's in LA and you're Buffalo I'm sure he's off his game or not preparing the same way. Hence the Juggling, he may be a professional athlete but he's also human. Again I'm not saying he shouldn't be #1, I merely stated Ruff is sending a message to him "Stop F'n Around" and get back on your game. And seeing though people are ###### around here about words/quotes the stop f'n around was my impression of the benching, Ruff didn't have to say anything else but "Enroth is starting in Ottawa" for Miller to get the message, Now it's up to Miller and to see how he responds, will he be a baby and pout like he did at first (per Vogl) or will this set him back on track. If you don't agree it's ok, I'm not expecting you or that other clown to do so. It's how I understood the benching and agree with what Ruff did. Question is... did the Team get the message? We'll see tomorrow night when Miller plays @HOME Tiger I'll give you. Mickelson was coping with his wife having cancer and relapsing after some time...just saying, I wouldn't be on top of my game either if I had to worry about the one I loved having a terrible disease... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabre4life Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Tiger I'll give you. Mickelson was coping with his wife having cancer and relapsing after some time...just saying, I wouldn't be on top of my game either if I had to worry about the one I loved having a terrible disease... Phil's play went south after Marriage and going into the PGA... The cancer wasn't diagnosed until 2009, Phil won his first Masters and Major in 2004. The 2010 Masters win was for Amy his wife so it is believed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 I love how people talk of a marraige hangover. I don't think this is your typical marraige. I'd like to think of it as more of a mental and spiritual partnership. We aren't really dealing with June and Ward here folks..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Miller seems to be thin-skinned to criticism. He would take less if he didn't piss off the Media, which is at least partially in his control. I'd hate to see this situation turn into Tim Connolly part 2. How many people do you know that take criticism well? I know I don't. I know if I was an athlete and not playing well, I wouldn't want to talk to any reporter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastPommerFan Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 I love how people talk of a marraige hangover. I don't think this is your typical marraige. I'd like to think of it as more of a mental and spiritual partnership. We aren't really dealing with June and Ward here folks..... Are you saying he's an asexual robot fashion designer who married one of his models for convenience so he had someone to test his latest pair of jeans on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Are you saying he's an asexual robot fashion designer who married one of his models for convenience so he had someone to test his latest pair of jeans on? I would never imply anything of the sort... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qUJk4a2yn_8 NSFW? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Phil Mickleson was at the top of his game then came marriage and kids and his play fell it wasn't until he won the Masters when he got over the "mariage hang over" married in '96, won the masters in '04. was ranked in the top 10 every year from '96 forward. his career doesn't support your theory. Look at Tiger as well once he put the ring on his game substantially fell married in october '04. won 25 titles and 6 majors from '05-'08 (4 seasons), was #1 in the world throughout that period of time, i believe. tiger's game fell apart when he was exposed for scoring more tail than arnold palmer in his heyday. his career does nothing to support your theory. why? Well it's simple really the more you live, the more you discover that nothing is simple. I love how people talk of a marraige hangover. I don't think this is your typical marraige. I'd like to think of it as more of a mental and spiritual partnership. We aren't really dealing with June and Ward here folks..... seriously. isn't she mostly in LA? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Assquatch Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 How many people do you know that take criticism well? I know I don't. I know if I was an athlete and not playing well, I wouldn't want to talk to any reporter. The number of people I know is irrelevant. My point is simply that the guy could do himself a favor by hiding his disdain for the people that are publicly criticizing him since he doesn't take it well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Miller seems to be thin-skinned to criticism. He would take less if he didn't piss off the Media, which is at least partially in his control. I'd hate to see this situation turn into Tim Connolly part 2. Well, he may be giving off a PO'd vibe, but I'd bet quite a bit of $$ that he's PO'd because he got yanked in his last game and then had to watch the next 2 games -- not because of anything Vogl or anyone here has said about him. Phil Mickleson was at the top of his game then came marriage and kids and his play fell it wasn't until he won the Masters when he got over the "mariage hang over", Look at Tiger as well once he put the ring on his game substantially fell, why? Well it's simple really, you devote more time to that than anything else. I gave you two examples of players both in a mentally tough game, the slightest lack of concentration could be fatal. In net the same can be applied just listen to the Ilya Bryzgalov comments from the 9-8 game. It's mentally challenging and if you're thinking about the next time you are going to see your wife because she's in LA and you're Buffalo I'm sure he's off his game or not preparing the same way. Hence the Juggling, he may be a professional athlete but he's also human. Well, Aud Smell has already demonstrated that most of the above is false, but even if it were true, it's just a bunch of random facts that relate to other people -- i.e. it's not evidence to support a "theory" of what's going on with Miller. Not even close. By that "logic," anyone could name a bunch of married athletes who are performing at a high level (like, say, the 2 best players on the current SC champs, Chara and Thomas) and claim it was "evidence" to support the theory that marriage improves athletic performance. I love how people talk of a marraige hangover. I don't think this is your typical marraige. I'd like to think of it as more of a mental and spiritual partnership. We aren't really dealing with June and Ward here folks..... Where does this come from? Any support for this theory? I would never imply anything of the sort... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qUJk4a2yn_8 NSFW? Holy mackerel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabre4life Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 married in '96, won the masters in '04. was ranked in the top 10 every year from '96 forward. his career doesn't support your theory. Being top10 is great but winning a MAJOR! in golf sets you apart from mediocrity... married in october '04. won 25 titles and 6 majors from '05-'08 (4 seasons), was #1 in the world throughout that period of time, i believe. tiger's game fell apart when he was exposed for scoring more tail than arnold palmer in his heyday. his career does nothing to support your theory. I'm sure hanging with porn stars, strippers, waitresses, prostitutes, etc... reflected more towards his implosion... I've watched him since amateur/college, the decline is painfully obvious before/after. And I'll spare you the 10 pages of stats to support my "theory" the more you live, the more you discover that nothing is simple. Good luck with making life difficult then... I'll keep it simple. seriously. isn't she mostly in LA? To further her Hollywood career as she stated, I'm sure... shouldn't she be at the games at least? I understand if she's filming but... come on how big of a star is she really? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Being top10 is great but winning a MAJOR! in golf sets you apart from mediocrity... to be clear: with mickelson, it took 8 years to overcome the marriage hangover? I've watched him since amateur/college, the decline is painfully obvious before/after. And I'll spare you the 10 pages of stats to support my "theory" yes, let's leave it at your subjective perception of when his decline began and what caused it. the fact that he won 25 titles and 6 majors in the 4 years following his wedding should be ignored. Good luck with making life difficult then... I'll keep it simple. on further reflection, i think we're confusing "simple" with "simplistic." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Yup - we get our information through their lens, which colors the the information we receive. The media doesn't like Miller, because he isn't warm and fuzzy and accommodating. He holds the media in contempt, as I am sure most professional athletes do, but isn't very good at hiding it from them. You wouldn't like it if someone who could never, ever do your job at the level you do it questioned your work every day, questioned what time you showed up for work, how productive you were, how much time you spent on the internet, and whether you spent enough off work hours thinking about your work. It's part of the job. The media isn't some new found fad that just burst on the scene. I'm sure Miller, like other athletes, isn't complaining when he is being showered with accolades. Was Miller angry when he did the AMP commercials? Does Miller get angry when he uses his celebrity to raise money for charity? The media is part of the machine that allows Miller to make $6 million a year playing hockey. He needs to get over it and himself and grow-up. That goes for every professional athlete. If they don't like it they should go out and get a real job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwksndmonster Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 5. Did my heart good to see Reghier crush, kill, destroy. That's the second time I've seen this one. Regehr. And I loved watching him crush, kill, and destroy as well :D I don't think it matters either way on how Miller felt, atleast not for the Ottawa game itself. It could be an issue going forward, but what I took away from this was Ruff's decision to go after the win as opposed to attempting to get Miller on his feet again. It really surprised me and kinda said to me that the team is serious about winning right now. The last time we did this Miller v Enroth thing, people got bent out of shape, so let's take a look at it from a different angle for change. Given the inexperience of Enroth and the teams play infront of him as opposed to Miller, I'm asking if the team may get "too comfortable" infront of Enroth at some time and begin to display that lazy play we've seen infront of Miller from time to time? But that aside, like I said, I was suprised at Lindy's decision to go for the win over the player issue, it shows me in any event, some promise. I disagree with you that putting Enroth in is a sure sign that this team will do what it takes to win. Putting in Miller would not be to get Miller on his feet again, rather it would be so Ryan Miller is in the crease. I know you don't believe it to be true, but Ryan Miller is a damned good goaltender, and playing him would not indicate a strategy to overcome a player issue (nor would it indicate a disinclination toward winning). Ruff Quote: "He's been going well. I thought he deserved it. He's given us a lot of good efforts. We won. He's obviously fresh," Ruff said. "We haven't played very much. I just gave him the nod, a little bone for as well as he's been playing." Isn't it obvious what message Ruff sent to Miller? Sure I'm reading into the words a little... But you and your buddy with the Porno avatar need accept the fact Miller is off his game and live with the fact the Enroth is capable of carrying the load, until Miller takes the binky out of his mouth... Enroth was drafted in the 2nd Miller was drafted in the 5th This should tell you something... I'm not advocating Enroth over Miller, all I'm saying is Miller has other things on his mind than Hockey. This isn't obvious? Look what happened to Tiger Woods, Phil Mickelson in a mentally tough game.... Why is it that Enroth is doing better than Miller with the same people in front of him??? Watch the Philly game over again if you can't see this? Let the Columbus game speak for itself... half hearted effort by the forwards and defence yet Enroth won the game??? You can commence your flame now... -Draft status means absolutely nothing. -You're right. He's probably thinking about eating and sleeping too, the lazy punk. Please make sure that what you write has some basis in fact, rather than complete conjecture and anecdotal evidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
korab rules Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 It's part of the job. The media isn't some new found fad that just burst on the scene. I'm sure Miller, like other athletes, isn't complaining when he is being showered with accolades. Was Miller angry when he did the AMP commercials? Does Miller get angry when he uses his celebrity to raise money for charity? The media is part of the machine that allows Miller to make $6 million a year playing hockey. He needs to get over it and himself and grow-up. That goes for every professional athlete. If they don't like it they should go out and get a real job. I agree its part of the job and I agree that it's part of what allows them to make the money they do. I also think that the media members are a smug group of a$$holes. If I was required to talk to them every day, especially after they just wrote a column claiming to know my mind and ripping me over my play in a five minute segment of a game that I find personally embarrassing and which makes me angry to even think about, I would probably be a little snippy, too. The local media are like sharks, led by Sully. When they smell blood in the water, its a feeding frenzy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowmobiler97 Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 From John Vogl OTTAWA — Let the goaltending controversy officially begin in Buffalo. After a week of chatter in Sabreland about whether Jhonas Enroth should supplant Ryan Miller in the Buffalo net, the rookie did just that Saturday night in Ottawa. Enroth started for the second straight night, a shocking appearance that altered the schedule coach Lindy Ruff had set up earlier in the week. How shocking? For the first time in nearly five years, Miller sat out back-to-back games while healthy. He hadn't done so since Jan. 30-Feb. 1, 2007, when Ruff gave the goaltender extra rest upon returning from his start in the NHL All-Star Game. Enroth made 25 saves through regulation and overtime, then he stopped four more in the six-round shootout to lift the Sabres to a 3-2 victory. Derek Roy scored the winner for the Sabres, who won their second straight after a two-game losing streak. Miller got off the team bus and walked alone into the Sabres' dressing room in Scotiabank Place with an angry look on his face. About an hour later, it was easy to tell why. Enroth led the Sabres onto the ice for the pregame warm-up, which is always the duty of the starting goaltender. Soon after, he was officially announced as a starter for the fourth time this season. "He's been going well. I thought he deserved it. He's given us a lot of good efforts. We won. He's obviously fresh," Ruff said. "We haven't played very much. I just gave him the nod, a little bone for as well as he's been playing." *****on a side note***** This did belong in my thread on Miller vs Enroth, but apparantly it's been locked, I have no idea as to why, but I found it interesting the decisions being made by Lindy to go with the "win first" mentality over experience. It is clear I have no idea what I'm talking about and should not be posting threads. Stop making threads about the same thing, you're last sentence was the only correct one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 I agree its part of the job and I agree that it's part of what allows them to make the money they do. I also think that the media members are a smug group of a$$holes. If I was required to talk to them every day, especially after they just wrote a column claiming to know my mind and ripping me over my play in a five minute segment of a game that I find personally embarrassing and which makes me angry to even think about, I would probably be a little snippy, too. The local media are like sharks, led by Sully. When they smell blood in the water, its a feeding frenzy. i don't disagree with this, but i always keep in mind that just like miller has a core job of keeping the puck out of the net, the newspaper (it's funny to type that) guys have a core job, and, IMO, the job ain't accurately and faithfully reporting the facts of the subject matter they're covering -- it's generating readership, traffic, clicks, or however it's measured. having read vogl's treatment of the miller stuff over the past few weeks, i don't think there's any real dispute that he's doing what he can to manufacture a story about a goaltender controversy. someone hit him on that on twitter as follows: kpiatek19 Keith Piatek @BuffNewsVogl Why be the catalyst for a goaltending controversy when there isn't one. Just for a story? No wonder why Miller hates the media 12 hours ago @BuffNewsVogl John Vogl @kpiatek19 catalyst? I didn't sit the franchise goalie for first time in five years. that's weak sauce right there, john boy. a "controversy," by definition, arises when 2 sides hold directly opposing views. are there really 2 sides on this issue? (and we're excluding the opinions of those who rely on a mom or dad to pay for the wifi connection at home.) a bad patch for an established #1 and a hunch/bone start for the #2 doesn't a "controversy" make -- unless vogl wants to say it does. which he does. now, if miller continues to stink up the joint and enroth continues to be lights out for an extended period of time, and people within the organization and/or people who know a thing or two about the game start saying it might be time to view the guys as 1A and 1B, then that might be a controversy. but we ain't there, and i don't think we get there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 i don't disagree with this, but i always keep in mind that just like miller has a core job of keeping the puck out of the net, the newspaper (it's funny to type that) guys have a core job, and, IMO, the job ain't accurately and faithfully reporting the facts of the subject matter they're covering -- it's generating readership, traffic, clicks, or however it's measured. having read vogl's treatment of the miller stuff over the past few weeks, i don't think there's any real dispute that he's doing what he can to manufacture a story about a goaltender controversy. someone hit him on that on twitter as follows: kpiatek19 Keith Piatek @BuffNewsVogl Why be the catalyst for a goaltending controversy when there isn't one. Just for a story? No wonder why Miller hates the media 12 hours ago @BuffNewsVogl John Vogl @kpiatek19 catalyst? I didn't sit the franchise goalie for first time in five years. that's weak sauce right there, john boy. a "controversy," by definition, arises when 2 sides hold directly opposing views. are there really 2 sides on this issue? (and we're excluding the opinions of those who rely on a mom or dad to pay for the wifi connection at home.) a bad patch for an established #1 and a hunch/bone start for the #2 doesn't a "controversy" make -- unless vogl wants to say it does. which he does. now, if miller continues to stink up the joint and enroth continues to be lights out for an extended period of time, and people within the organization and/or people who know a thing or two about the game start saying it might be time to view the guys as 1A and 1B, then that might be a controversy. but we ain't there, and i don't think we get there. Well, I don't disagree that Vogel's job is to generate readership, but I also don't think it's fair to say that Vogl manufactured a goaltender controversy. This board has been going nuts about this issue for a week and I think would have been doing so if Vogl hadn't written a word about it. It was a pretty major development, IMHO, for Enroth to get back-to-back starts, just as it would be for any of the teams with a clear-cut #1 "franchise" goalie. And if Enroth starts tomorrow night? That's an earthquake in Hockey Heaven, regardless of what any of the media members say or don't say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wonderbread Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Stop making threads about the same thing, you're last sentence was the only correct one. Seriously who the ###### are you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
korab rules Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Seriously who the ###### are you. He's a 14 year old kid who gets his kicks from embarrassing hself on the Internet. He has previously admitted the 97 is his birth year. Because of his age, I take pity on him, and don't engage. Ignore him. He will go away when no one pays attention to him any longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DR HOLLIDAY Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 He's a 14 year old kid who gets his kicks from embarrassing hself on the Internet. He has previously admitted the 97 is his birth year. Because of his age, I take pity on him, and don't engage. Ignore him. He will go away when no one pays attention to him any longer. There about 3 or 4 of them floating around the board and I think some of them have two accounts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowmobiler97 Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 He's a 14 year old kid who gets his kicks from embarrassing hself on the Internet. He has previously admitted the 97 is his birth year. Because of his age, I take pity on him, and don't engage. Ignore him. He will go away when no one pays attention to him any longer. Nahh, I'm going to stay. It's funny watching and reading how these ppl on the board try to communicate and think their points are better than someone else's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowmobiler97 Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 There about 3 or 4 of them floating around the board and I think some of them have two accounts. You have two accounts? Damn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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