Drag0nDan

Top 6 players are tough to find. Makes it way tougher when you have to factor in the trade protection clauses that the majority of veterans have. Then you have to filter out the 22-25 year old cornerstone players who won't be moved. The only like bonafide stud who might be available with no trade protection is Robertson just because they're up against the cap and he's likely to get 10M AAV on his next deal. JJP probably can't be moved in that deal because his contract will likely cost just as much as Robertson. So then you're looking at probably moving Tuch, Rosen/Östlund/Kulich/Benson, and probably a 1st. 12 Players scored more points than JJP that have no clauses and are under contract for next year: Hagel, Suzuki, Necas, Strome, Robertson, Raymond, Stutzle, Marchenko, Boldy, Johnston, Hughes, Caufield. Even in that next window, the majority of players are in their early 20's with outliers like Rust, and keep scrolling and you hit cozens - then you know you cannot scroll any further.

I guess you could argue he won the Jokiharju trade...? I thought for sure the comp would be thomas or kyrou in the ROR trade. Thompson not being good would have made that trade an absolute disaster beyond what it already was.

What do you expect him to say in a press conference?

13 games was just a killer. That was when i made up my mind on UPL honestly. When the team needed a guy to step up, he absolutely collapsed. He's looked way too lost out there for my liking. Levi didn't get a start until a back-to-back away game against toronto, which i think was number 10? .900 SV% on 40 shots. 4 power plays though. And the team just struggled with turnovers pretty much that entire stretch. I know we sent him down as he was struggling with irregular playing time and you want him to get games in. FIne, i get it. But if we're struggling with the NHL goaltending, and the seasons slipping away, why not give him another game? In any case... cya in Seattle in January. 11th game - UPL @ Montreal - 6 goals in 2 periods and got yanked for Reimer - .714 SV% 3... days.. later... 12th game - Toronto at home - 4 goals in 1 period and change - .692 SV%

Not to mention local buffalo press lives to hammer people.

I'm not sure the press conference changes much one way or the other tbh. But both Murray and Botterill were fired after delivering their end of season press conferences in 2017 and 2020.

I've also noticed a lot better hockey IQ with benson. He seems to be finding himself in good areas, creating space, and putting pucks where they should go. He's still only 19 which hopefully means his best hockey is in front of him.

I wonder if he had an inkling of this stadium decision and has made moves to save some cash

Someone mentioned it earlier but shesterkin has not been as sharp. 12 goals in 3 starts against buffalo (pulled twice) is pretty bad - sub .800% and 6.46 GAA.

Throw in Helenius: 13G, 21a, 63games, 0.539ppg, +1 (at 18) drafted shortly before this trade happened. Realistically Savoie wasn't that far from where he needed to be, but in 2 years post-draft he played 7 non-junior hockey games vs. Kulich who played over 100. Benson made the roster outright as an 18 year old a year after Savoie was drafted. Rosen's a year older, but is the leading goal scorer on the amerks this year. Östlund played in Sweden's mens league last year. This team had too many prospects, and he was jumped in development by several. I don't think he was going to gain value by playing a season at the AHL level, and his draft pedigree loses value every year you keep him. Former Top-10 Pick loses its luster when you look at this chart and realize how little he has played: https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/nhl2022e.html

I'd rather strike out on a bunch of options before i end up with reimer again.

but... but... borgen! 🙂

Eh they also have the 27th ranked PP. Zibanejad is having a terrible year, same with Lafreniere, same with Kreider. Tons of cap space tied up in 5 forwards who are all 31+ and have some level of trade protection. I'd probably change coaches first since the roster construction is limited in what you can do.

I don't disagree - i just think the "how would you retool the team?" answer shouldn't start with signing marner as though its just that easy.

All fair points and arguments. I also think its fair to argue that Marner having grown up an hour away.. has very little to do with his free agency decision.

I don't think he's necessarily off the block from a trade perspective, but i don't think he was brought here to be traded either.

It was more of an argument as to the fact that even bad teams have more to offer than buffalo. This is last in the league in destination, and while i think there are opportunities to re-tool with trades - no one is waiving a clause to come here, and free agents will only come here if they are over-paid most likely. I just see people saying "Fire adams. Sign marner" like its just that easy to fix.

I see what you mean, but they have won cups in the past. They are a major media market. Their record is pretty similar to Buffalo, but I'm sure it isn't like playing in an empty building like Buffalo. I mean he's played for Toronto for long enough to view Buffalo as extra home games on their schedule. It's also still very close in proximity to Toronto. Basically it hits on the all the notes of Buffalo but.. it's not Buffalo or NY. Factoring in NYS income tax brackets exceeding 9%, vs. Michigan which is a flat 4.25% - essentially forcing buffalo to overpay by probably close to 1M AAV in order to cover the gap if he chose to come here.

That only goes so far when the organization has proven to be incompetent and inept. Hell even the stadium itself is a dump, and i can't imagine our training facilities hold a candle to the leafs. It'd be one thing to waive a clause to play there for a season or two, but signing the biggest contract of your life with Buffalo? When other options like Pittsburgh or Detroit have championship pedigrees, and organizations with professional hockey brains running them.

I think its unrealistic to expect the #1 free agent to sign in buffalo. I'd say we have a better shot at Tavares, but he's probably chasing a cup. Detroit could make it work by moving tarasenko or debrincat. Chicago would have no issues fitting him in. Literally any team in the running will make necessary moves to accommodate adding a 100 point player.

There aren't any available, unless you had one in mind. The list is basically Demko, and anyone else has some level of clause. I'm sure they'd be interested in sending him to the East, and he was very good in 2023 - but other teams also have goalie needs so that'll drive the price up considerably when you factor in the market Hill extended in Vegas. Thompson and Lindgren were extended in Washington. Blackwood in Colorado. Shesterkin in NY. Oettinger in Dallas. Ullmark in Ottawa. Daccord in Seattle. Swayman in Boston. Lankinen in Vancouver. Saros in Nashville. Woll in Toronto.

Right - so i'd say they're better off finding an upgrade on the wing. If the current Top 3 Centers are Kulich, Norris, Mcleod - with Tage as the... norris injury replacement depth Wingers - Thompson, Tuch, JJP, Quinn, Zucker, Benson - Any changes on the wing basically requires one of these players to be shipped out as none of these players really fit on a 4th line. Realistically moving an RFA JJP contract is probably the best chip since an acquiring team can lock him up for a few years.

He started 8 games this year... if you look at goalies with 10 or fewer games they mostly are either fluctuating in one direction or another.

I just don't see a way to get a 1C anywhere in a trade - so these "Trade Quinn, Kulich whomever" for a new center doesn't really work.

I'm for finding a top 6 center or winger or whatever. Try and use the abundance of picks and prospects to add someone to the team who can make a real impact. And upgrade whatever we have going on in net. You look at all the bad teams in the league, and bad goaltending is a problem for more than half of them. Whats the big trade chip there that goes out to bring in someone new? Is it JJP? Tuch? Quinn? Byram? Once you add someone everyone else slots differently so it probably means a sabre today has to be moving out in that trade.