Sabres have elected arbitration with Byram

[Thorny]

16 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

You keep changing the topic. First it was "he's not addressing goaltending now." Now it's "he didn't the past 5 years" which is also not true.

He did commit to UPL but he also traded for Devon Levi. He's drafted goalies every year. (Leinonen, Ratzlaff, Leenders, Meloche, Prokhorov) So to say Adams is doing nothing is demonstrably false. You may not like it or agree with what he's doing but that's a different argument.

And this year in particular, the Sabres are beefing up their defense which should help the goaltending out considerably. 

Over and over people talk about addressing goaltending in the abstract. Gotta get that magical guy who'll be awesome! Who that is is rarely identified or is a player who's team would never trade away. (Even an offer they can't refuse, which no one ever articulates what that is.)

 

Adams has provided poor goaltending relative to the rest of the league. That’s it: that’s the equation 

No one has to be a professional online to prove Adams wrong. No one has to be as good of a hockey player as Casey Mittelstadt to evaluate him relative to his peers. Adams has demonstrably addressed and assembled the position over the course of half a decade in worse fashion than the vast majority of other teams 

that’s what actually happened: regardless of how hard you describe it to be, or how much magic you think needs to be worked into it

Edited 3 hours ago by Thorny

[Taro T]

3 hours ago, Weave said:

Revisionist history.  We didn’t let Ullmark walk.  Ullmark decided he needed a change of scenery.

Yes, and no.

By bridging him and Reinhart (ostensibly because ownership was worried about cashflow in the heart of the pandemic) the Sabres created the situation where they both decided they needed a change of scenery (and Montour did and McCabe did and ...).  BUT had those 2 been given real contracts at the time, really doubt that they and Eichel all want out that next year.  

Totally get WHY ownership would be hesitant to make the LT offer at that time.  Their wealth was tied up in non-liquid assets.  But had they done so, well rebuild #2 might've actually worked.  Botterill's love of 3rd liners for 3rd rounders wouldn't really have done much, but a team built around Eichel, Reinhart, Dahlin, and Ullmark would have a great core to be building around.

[Thorny]

12 hours ago, Dr. Who said:

Yep, but ours are on the Titanic.

Sabres also don’t have the luxury of pretending they can address their roster with the urgency the teams who haven’t missed the playoffs for 14 years show. Their results are a statistically documented, historical outlier. Their approach to fix it has to be relative. 

4 hours ago, That Aud Smell said:

Lol, Harrington relying on @PromoTheRobot for content.

Either that or Promo is Harrington’s screen name here. That seems unlikely, though. Harrington’s a hack, but be doesn’t generally carry water for the Sabres FO.

He also thinks “ppg forward” means “power play guy forward” lmao

edit: Harrington, that is 

Edited 3 hours ago by Thorny

[Thorny]

3 hours ago, Mr. MVP said:

We could’ve traded him, right?  

Could have traded him, signed him way earlier (from Ullmark’s own account he was negotiating with the team in good faith for a long time before changing his mind), convinced him to stay, or, failing all of that, do the bare minimum as a GM and understand where your player’s head is at if he truly wasn’t interested in staying, and then not back yourself into a corner by leaving yourself literally no other options and having no backup plan to Ullmark if that didn’t work out.

But this is Adams’ documented MO: he doesn’t have a pulse on his players. He blamed them coming into camp “too overconfident” 2 seasons ago and last year he blamed them coming in “out of shape”. He’s always surprised by where his roster is at because, professionally, he’s a buffoon 

“Given the circumstances.”’

Yes, Adams let the Ullmark situation slowly slip away through inaction, found himself in a corner, and did the “best he could”. How many times do we wanna see it eh

[PromoTheRobot]

4 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

BS. It all comes down to Buffalo not winning. Toronto, Edmonton, NYC all have higher taxes and are just as cold if not colder and they get players. Ottawa, Montreal get players. Taxes and Palm Trees is the biggest load of horseshit that Adams has ever tried to sell. Adams can't get players to come here because he is a failed GM, an awful salesmen, and a constantly has a loser tone about "trying to be better"

It has an effect. Losing hurts the most but don't kid yourself. The sunny, low-tax markets have an advantage. This isn't the 1980's NHL anymore.

[PromoTheRobot]

4 hours ago, JP51 said:

And I think he is there for a reason.. for sure... I think he is Pegula's contingency, I think ultimately he gets this year to really look at our current roster and formulate his own plan should what I think is likely and this is Adams last year... and credit where its due... if indeed that is where we are at then at least Pegula is showing some kind of pulse and prep...  We can debate if JK is the right guy for sure, I am agnostic... I just dont know... but some one will need to set a new course if the reset button is hit and the FO undergoes change after their 15th year of failure...  if Adams proves us all wrong.. well then... he is at least another good asset in the FO...  JK is really no lose for TP. IMO

I think JK is steering most of these deals/signings. Lindy has his input as well. There is a marked shift from speed/skill towards toughness/grit.

[Taro T]

11 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

I think JK is steering most of these deals/signings. Lindy has his input as well. There is a marked shift from speed/skill towards toughness/grit.

Again, we're in Act 2 of a 3 act 1 GM play.  😉 

[JP51]

20 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

I think JK is steering most of these deals/signings. Lindy has his input as well. There is a marked shift from speed/skill towards toughness/grit.

I am not sure, but to your point, it certainly is not in Adams modus operandi.... and further I think that is the great hope... the big improvement "play" this offseason... lets get tougher and play better D and we can finally break out... we shall see. 

[Weave]

2 hours ago, Taro T said:

Yes, and no.

By bridging him and Reinhart (ostensibly because ownership was worried about cashflow in the heart of the pandemic) the Sabres created the situation where they both decided they needed a change of scenery (and Montour did and McCabe did and ...).  BUT had those 2 been given real contracts at the time, really doubt that they and Eichel all want out that next year.  

Totally get WHY ownership would be hesitant to make the LT offer at that time.  Their wealth was tied up in non-liquid assets.  But had they done so, well rebuild #2 might've actually worked.  Botterill's love of 3rd liners for 3rd rounders wouldn't really have done much, but a team built around Eichel, Reinhart, Dahlin, and Ullmark would have a great core to be building around.

i’ll counter with a yes and no.  Yes, bridging him set up the opportunity, but his decision was an outcome of his father’s death.  I can’t speculate on what led to his decision.  

[PerreaultForever]

7 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

@PerreaultForever you think Yzerman is going great in Detroit?

No. I think he's doing slightly better than Adams but he should be fired too. 

Apparently he tried for Ehlers but Ehlers "didn't want to be there". I think Detroit will finish 5-10 points ahead of the Sabres but miss the playoffs. 

[Pimlach]

5 hours ago, Mr. MVP said:

We could’ve traded him, right?  

No, not when he was an UFA.  

5 hours ago, JohnC said:

Ullmark was an UFA. They didn’t know that he was going to walk because they were negotiating with him during that period. What was the backup plan if the UFA goalie couldn’t be signed? There was none, at least an adequate one. 
 

The problem isn’t that a particular player wanted out for whatever reason as it is too many Sabres wanted out and got themselves out. That in itself is a bad indicator.

Good question @JohnC.   Adams acquired Devon Levi and a #1 pick (which became Kulich) for Sam Reinhart, a guy that Boterill did not extend beyond 1 year.  Adams traded RFA Reinhart because his plan was to rebuild with players that "want to be here".  Adams had his goalie in Devon Levi.  

It was just four days after the Reinhart trade (Levi Acquisition)  that they lost Ullmark in free agency when he went to Boston for the same offer that the Sabres made.

There was much turmoil between the Boterill firing and the Adams hiring - Kruger was gone, the Sabres FO and scouting departments were blown up, layoffs impacted long time Sabres rank and file employees, and the Eichel injury and the eventual trade was an on going saga.   If Ullmark was going to remain a Sabre then it probably would have been Boterill that extended him, but Bots was gone the year prior.   

Why do I think that?   Because Adams is partial to Levi, the guy he traded Reinhart away for, and Adams thought Levi could jump in and be an NHL goalie.   No Blockers were his big thing back then.   So during his rebuild Adams let Ullmark go and brought in such goaltending stalwarts as Dustin Tokarski, Aaron Dell, Michael Houser, Craig Anderson, Malcom Subban, Eric Comrie, James Reimer and now Alec Lyon - all with the thought of not blocking Devon Levi from taking the reigns.  

This season we have UPL, Lyon, and Levi vying for 2 NHL spots.  Can Levi vindicate Adams by emerging as good NHL goalie and a true #1?  

[PerreaultForever]

6 hours ago, Weave said:

Revisionist history.  We didn’t let Ullmark walk.  Ullmark decided he needed a change of scenery.

You can phrase it how you want but I think it merely came down to money. They thought he'd take their offer but then Boston swooped in with what (at the time) seemed like an overpay so he took it. There were no indicators that he wanted out at that time. 

Sabres haven't valued goaltending properly for a really really long time. 

[Taro T]

5 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

No, not when he was an UFA.  

Good question @JohnC.   Adams acquired Devon Levi and a #1 pick (which became Kulich) for Sam Reinhart, a guy that Boterill did not extend beyond 1 year.  Adams traded RFA Reinhart because his plan was to rebuild with players that "want to be here".  Adams had his goalie in Devon Levi.  

It was just four days after the Reinhart trade (Levi Acquisition)  that they lost Ullmark in free agency when he went to Boston for the same offer that the Sabres made.

There was much turmoil between the Boterill firing and the Adams hiring - Kruger was gone, the Sabres FO and scouting departments were blown up, layoffs impacted long time Sabres rank and file employees, and the Eichel injury and the eventual trade was an on going saga.   If Ullmark was going to remain a Sabre then it probably would have been Boterill that extended him, but Bots was gone the year prior.   

Why do I think that?   Because Adams is partial to Levi, the guy he traded Reinhart away for, and Adams thought Levi could jump in and be an NHL goalie.   No Blockers were his big thing back then.   So during his rebuild Adams let Ullmark go and brought in such goaltending stalwarts as Dustin Tokarski, Aaron Dell, Michael Houser, Craig Anderson, Malcom Subban, Eric Comrie, James Reimer and now Alec Lyon - all with the thought of not blocking Devon Levi from taking the reigns.  

This season we have UPL, Lyon, and Levi vying for 2 NHL spots.  Can Levi vindicate Adams by emerging as good NHL goalie and a true #1?  

It WASN'T the same offer the Sabres made.  It was better than the Sabres offer and then Adams attempted to match that offer.  So, at the end of the day they both made the same offer; but the order in which the player gets them is significant IMHO.  

And the Sabres should've offered 1 more year than Boston in either case.  Maybe then Ullmark's wanting change at that stage of his life is overrided.  Maybe it isn't.  But if the Sabres make the best offer, and he still leaves, then can absolve Adams for messing that negotiation up.  But Adams didn't, he MATCHED the best offer.

[JohnC]

8 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

No, not when he was an UFA.  

Good question @JohnC.   Adams acquired Devon Levi and a #1 pick (which became Kulich) for Sam Reinhart, a guy that Boterill did not extend beyond 1 year.  Adams traded RFA Reinhart because his plan was to rebuild with players that "want to be here".  Adams had his goalie in Devon Levi.  

It was just four days after the Reinhart trade (Levi Acquisition)  that they lost Ullmark in free agency when he went to Boston for the same offer that the Sabres made.

There was much turmoil between the Boterill firing and the Adams hiring - Kruger was gone, the Sabres FO and scouting departments were blown up, layoffs impacted long time Sabres rank and file employees, and the Eichel injury and the eventual trade was an on going saga.   If Ullmark was going to remain a Sabre then it probably would have been Boterill that extended him, but Bots was gone the year prior.   

Why do I think that?   Because Adams is partial to Levi, the guy he traded Reinhart away for, and Adams thought Levi could jump in and be an NHL goalie.   No Blockers were his big thing back then.   So during his rebuild Adams let Ullmark go and brought in such goaltending stalwarts as Dustin Tokarski, Aaron Dell, Michael Houser, Craig Anderson, Malcom Subban, Eric Comrie, James Reimer and now Alec Lyon - all with the thought of not blocking Devon Levi from taking the reigns.  

This season we have UPL, Lyon, and Levi vying for 2 NHL spots.  Can Levi vindicate Adams by emerging as good NHL goalie and a true #1?  

In any sport, you never really know for sure how your young players are going to develop. Some prospects that you have high expectations end up being miserable failures or simply pedestrian players. And sometimes the player that you don't expect much from become stalworth players. It's the reality of sports that there are few guarantees. The problem (as you noted) is that he had a rebuilding plan and became too committed with it without the flexibility to make adjustments when needed. 

Players are not stupid. They know what is going on and they know the difference between a successful and well operated franchise and a failed and poorly operated franchise. None of the players you listed such as Eichel, Reinhart, ROR and others wanted to get stuck this morass of mediocrity. What's so aggravating is that when you list the players who wanted out and got out, they should have been the foundational players for a winning franchise. 

And to highlight the dysfunction here, is the amateurish way our dullard GM handled the goalie position, the most important position in the sport. (As you noted.) The cycle of foolishness constantly gets repeated. And the owner continues to remain silent. Utter ridiculousness!