Casey Mittelstadt's next contract

[Mango]

On 1/23/2024 at 10:02 PM, mjd1001 said:

22 is really young for a forward. Guys taken in the 5-10 range of the first round sometimes they don't get 'it' until they are 23-25 years old.

With that said, Cozens had such a good year last year that its a real disappointment to see this year, espeically with how bad he is in his own zone.  And, you are paying him $7m on his new contract to score you 25+ goals per year, I don't think 10-20 goals is going to cut it starting next year.

It isn’t just a goal issue. I wish he was just “bad in the defensive zone”. But it’s like he actively has no idea where he is supposed to be so he just skates in circles.

Like, Skinner doesn’t play defense. That’s a problem, but he knows how to play hockey and is trying to play the fast break/actively deciding not to play defense. Whereas Cozens looks totally lost in the defensive zone. 

Cozens is being carried by JJP and Quinn at the moment. I think it’s time to push him out to the wing, give him less responsibility, and see if he can be a productive top 6 RW. We have a million center prospects, I’d give it a whirl. The season is lost. 
 

 

[mjd1001]

1 minute ago, Mango said:

It isn’t just a goal issue. I wish he was just “bad in the defensive zone”. But it’s like he actively has no idea where he is supposed to be so he just skates in circles.

Like, Skinner doesn’t play defense. That’s a problem, but he knows how to play hockey and is trying to play the fast break/actively deciding not to play defense. Whereas Cozens looks totally lost in the defensive zone. 

Cozens is being carried by JJP and Quinn at the moment. I think it’s time to push him out to the wing, give him less responsibility, and see if he can be a productive top 6 RW. We have a million center prospects, I’d give it a whirl. The season is lost. 
 

 

I agree with you on a lot of things, the above included.

I really think with Cozens, I don't know....is it that he doesn't know where to be? or just he can't control his urge to chase the puck.  Its like when little kids start to play hockey at a very young age, you TELL them where they should be, but put the skates on and it doesn't matter, they all just chase the puck, ignoring what they SHOULD be doing. With Cozens, I see the same thing. There are times I swear the team is set up in their own zone, Cozens SHOULD be covering the slot, but then he just leaves to chase a puck he can't get to, and the spot he vacates an opposing player steps into and there is a scoring chance.  

Skinner on the other hand, I think he just doesn't want to play defense.  I watched a replay a couple weeks ago where a goal was scored against the Sabres, and as the puck came from the neutral zone to the defensive zone, Skinner was on his way back and he literally slammed on the brakes, he STOPPED at the blue line and didn't enter the zone.  Was he supposed to do that?  Meaning was the 'plan' to have 4 guys in the D-zone and he was supposed to be there waiting for a breakout pass?  Maybe. Its just that when you watch the games, Skinner isn't often noticable in the D-zone.

2 Different issues with both of those players. Honestly, I think Cozens does more harm in the defensive zone.   There hare been discussions lately saying it might be part of the 'system', that the Sabres in their own zone aren't supposed to play 'zone' defense.  Still, even if that is true, Cozens is VERY noticable at doing things that no one else does in the D-zone.  He is Awful.   Move Cozens to wing please where him chasing the puck along the boards in the defensive zone is where he SHOULD be, he hurts this team when he vacates the slot and leaves it wide open.

[Mango]

1 hour ago, mjd1001 said:

I agree with you on a lot of things, the above included.

I really think with Cozens, I don't know....is it that he doesn't know where to be? or just he can't control his urge to chase the puck.  Its like when little kids start to play hockey at a very young age, you TELL them where they should be, but put the skates on and it doesn't matter, they all just chase the puck, ignoring what they SHOULD be doing. With Cozens, I see the same thing. There are times I swear the team is set up in their own zone, Cozens SHOULD be covering the slot, but then he just leaves to chase a puck he can't get to, and the spot he vacates an opposing player steps into and there is a scoring chance.  

Skinner on the other hand, I think he just doesn't want to play defense.  I watched a replay a couple weeks ago where a goal was scored against the Sabres, and as the puck came from the neutral zone to the defensive zone, Skinner was on his way back and he literally slammed on the brakes, he STOPPED at the blue line and didn't enter the zone.  Was he supposed to do that?  Meaning was the 'plan' to have 4 guys in the D-zone and he was supposed to be there waiting for a breakout pass?  Maybe. Its just that when you watch the games, Skinner isn't often noticable in the D-zone.

2 Different issues with both of those players. Honestly, I think Cozens does more harm in the defensive zone.   There hare been discussions lately saying it might be part of the 'system', that the Sabres in their own zone aren't supposed to play 'zone' defense.  Still, even if that is true, Cozens is VERY noticable at doing things that no one else does in the D-zone.  He is Awful.   Move Cozens to wing please where him chasing the puck along the boards in the defensive zone is where he SHOULD be, he hurts this team when he vacates the slot and leaves it wide open.

I agree with this. 

In regards to Skinner, I feel like him hitting the breaks is what he decides to do. Whether he is coached that way, I don't know. But he basically goes "meh, I don't do this" It is pretty reliable behavior. Everybody can try and adjust. 

As for Cozens, it often looks like he is paralyzed by indecision so he circles around and when in doubt chases. Who knows where Cozens could end up. So nobody knows how to cover for his dumb ash. 

[ska-T Chitown]

41 minutes ago, Mango said:

I agree with this. 

In regards to Skinner, I feel like him hitting the breaks is what he decides to do. Whether he is coached that way, I don't know. But he basically goes "meh, I don't do this" It is pretty reliable behavior. Everybody can try and adjust. 

As for Cozens, it often looks like he is paralyzed by indecision so he circles around and when in doubt chases. Who knows where Cozens could end up. So nobody knows how to cover for his dumb ash. 

It is really quite odd. If the Sabres are indeed playing a system where the folks who are not on the puck are supposed to be in specific areas (and from what I have seen - most very successful D-Zone teams employ this strategy in some form) - then they are just not good at it. I feel like I have seen beer league teams (definitely not mine, but that is for another thread) implement it better. Most D-zone strategies involved out-numbering the other team at the puck and then playing 'zone' behind that to prevent the cross-ice killer.

Regardless of what system they employ - having ANY system implies every player has a role. If a player decides to play hero, then at least one other player has to now decide whether to cover for The Hero or to do their own job - a complete lose/lose situation. Even worse is if there are two players who recognize The Hero has gone rogue and both decide to try and cover and now you have two roles neglected.

It must be "ok" within the system for The Hero ... otherwise every single video session would be some coach circling Cozzy off in his own world in like fifteen squiggly red circles and saying "Cozzy! WTF was going on here??" And if that is happening (and has been happening) and he keeps doing it ... then he is hopeless.

[Mango]

4 minutes ago, ska-T Chitown said:

It is really quite odd. If the Sabres are indeed playing a system where the folks who are not on the puck are supposed to be in specific areas (and from what I have seen - most very successful D-Zone teams employ this strategy in some form) - then they are just not good at it. I feel like I have seen beer league teams (definitely not mine, but that is for another thread) implement it better. Most D-zone strategies involved out-numbering the other team at the puck and then playing 'zone' behind that to prevent the cross-ice killer.

Regardless of what system they employ - having ANY system implies every player has a role. If a player decides to play hero, then at least one other player has to now decide whether to cover for The Hero or to do their own job - a complete lose/lose situation. Even worse is if there are two players who recognize The Hero has gone rogue and both decide to try and cover and now you have two roles neglected.

It must be "ok" within the system for The Hero ... otherwise every single video session would be some coach circling Cozzy off in his own world in like fifteen squiggly red circles and saying "Cozzy! WTF was going on here??" And if that is happening (and has been happening) and he keeps doing it ... then he is hopeless.

I think it is likely that video sessions spend a lot of time lighting Cozens up. He moves up and down the roster more than just about anybody on the team. He gets Quinn/JJP to try and recreate last year. Then he gets Skinner/Tuch because they have been our best wingers at times. Sometimes he is moved all the way down the roster. 

Sometimes I feel like I am taking crazy pills because the line up seems dedicated to "getting Cozen's going" instead of putting Cozens where the roster best fits. I would give him a go at RW with Tage and see if he can get going there since he is too stubborn to get off the boards in the defensive zone. If not I would likely move him down to the 3rd line, maybe even on the wing, and let him live there until he gets his game right. He has been given all the training wheels possible.

Throw Mitts in with JJP/Quinn. Hell, if we are going to sacrifice JJP's and Quinns game to get one player up to snuff we might as well try Kulich there and move Cozens to wing on the third line. 

If we are going to bench Benson and put Okposo on the first line, might as well try this. 

[Doohickie]

What the hell?  SIGN HIM.

 

[Sabres Fan in NS]

A big fat one.

[GASabresIUFAN]

On 1/27/2024 at 5:51 PM, Doohickie said:

What the hell?  SIGN HIM.

 

No pressure on either side to get a deal done yet.  Casey’s incentive is to continue to play well, rack up points and know that every point is probably worth another $100,000 per season here or elsewhere.  Buffalo’s incentive is to let this play out see where Casey ends up, how the team end up, and how a probable extension fits into their cap and budget long-term. His trade value maybe it’s highest right now in terms of picks and prospects, but Buffalo doesn’t need those. If the Sabres chooses to move him, the odds of a hockey trade such as Casey for a top 4 D are probably easier in the off-season.

[JohnC]

18 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

No pressure on either side to get a deal done yet.  Casey’s incentive is to continue to play well, rack up points and know that every point is probably worth another $100,000 per season here or elsewhere.  Buffalo’s incentive is to let this play out see where Casey ends up, how the team end up, and how a probable extension fits into their cap and budget long-term. His trade value maybe it’s highest right now in terms of picks and prospects, but Buffalo doesn’t need those. If the Sabres chooses to move him, the odds of a hockey trade such as Casey for a top 4 D are probably easier in the off-season.

I consider Mitts to be a valuable core player for this team, now and in the future. His value to the Sabres is enhanced by his versatility. He can play wing or center on any of the three top lines. Look what happened when Tage was hurt last year and was struggling. The coach moved Mitts up to the first line resulting in it playing as well, if not better, when Tage was healthy. 

If I could get a top 4 defenseman for Mitts in a trade, I would still be dead set against such a deal. I would rather go out and get a Clifton caliber defenseman (who is playing well after an adjustment period) from the market and retain Mitts. When you are building a team the smart approach is to add talent, not subtract it. 

[inkman]

5 hours ago, JohnC said:

I consider Mitts to be a valuable core player for this team, now and in the future. His value to the Sabres is enhanced by his versatility. He can play wing or center on any of the three top lines. Look what happened when Tage was hurt last year and was struggling. The coach moved Mitts up to the first line resulting in it playing as well, if not better, when Tage was healthy. 

If I could get a top 4 defenseman for Mitts in a trade, I would still be dead set against such a deal. I would rather go out and get a Clifton caliber defenseman (who is playing well after an adjustment period) from the market and retain Mitts. When you are building a team the smart approach is to add talent, not subtract it. 

The Sabres are fast approaching we have so much talent 🤣, we can’t possible pay everyone while still having a terrible team.  This is supposed to be where you’ve already achieved post season success and can start parlaying the guys you can’t pay into younger more affordable options. The Sabres just skipped GO and are nearing cap jail.  I can’t take this team’s ineptitude much longer. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

30 minutes ago, inkman said:

The Sabres are fast approaching we have so much talent 🤣, we can’t possible pay everyone while still having a terrible team.

Correct.  At some point, someone has to go.  You can't pay everyone 7 million per season or more.  Vancouver sent Horvat packing and were the better for it.  Horvat is an excellent player and I have never seen a word against him, but Van needed to change the dynamic on the roster and Horvat was traded.  

I'm actually for re-signing Mitts as I think he is the only Sabre with his tool kit; strong on the boards, has strong two-way play, is the most versatile positionally and maybe our best pure playmaker.  

Where I suggest the substractions in the top 9 are the wingers.  This doesn't have to come next season, but given our pipeline of forwards, Savoie, Kulich, and Rosen specifically, moving a winger is the most replaceable piece internally.  The logical target for trade is Skinner.  Unfortunately, he isn't tradeable.  The next most logical tradeable piece is Cozens if management believes Kulich or Östlund could step in as an NHL center in fall 2025 or fall 2026.  I have also raised the idea of moving Quinn.  He and JJP are in line for huge raises after next season.  It may be smarter to move on from one of them instead of adding another big contract and replacing them with a prospect.  

None of this changes the need for a top 4 D.  Ryan Johnson maybe one such player, but we still need another as Samuelsson and Clifton look like a good 3rd pairing.  One other thought, once we get a top 4 D, do we trade Samuelsson and give his job to Novikov when the Russian Bear is ready?

Edited February 3 by GASabresIUFAN