gg1 Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 ... oh, never mind. Off to the great white north. Is Drury expendable too now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDS Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 ... oh, never mind. Off to the great white north. Is Drury expendable too now? Lots of talk about that trade in the free agent thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 ... oh, never mind. Off to the great white north. Is Drury expendable too now? Captain of the Rangers....I don't think there is any way he waives that No trade - No-movement clause. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob_sauve28 Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 Gomez had 16 goals and 54 assists in his first season with the Rangers and 16 goals and 42 assists last season. Seven million a year for that? Wow, the Rangers got real lucky dumping that salary! Montreal :wallbash: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carpandean Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 Seven million a year for that? Wow, the Rangers got real lucky dumping that salary! Montreal :wallbash: That's the real problem with that trade; it really helps the Rangers out of a bind. It's probably giving Philly a lot of hope that someone will be dumb enough to take Briere, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 Seven million a year for that? Wow, the Rangers got real lucky dumping that salary! Montreal :wallbash: Gomez is a player. He was just on a very poorly conceived team in terms of line-mates in NY. They couldn't spring anybody with speed through the neutral zone, especially on wing. In NJ he always had Elias, Gionta, etc.... in New York the puck would always end up in the corner. Sather has done a terrible job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 That's the real problem with that trade; it really helps the Rangers out of a bind. It's probably giving Philly a lot of hope that someone will be dumb enough to take Briere, too. Would Briere make the Rangers better? Yes. Does Gomez make the Habs better? Yes. Posters can rant and rave about the money, it doesn't take away that teams in the East are going to get better. With only a few playoff spots for a team like the Sabres to fight for seeing teams in the East load up with talented players is nothing to be happy about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDS Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 Gomez is a player. He was just on a very poorly conceived team in terms of line-mates in NY.They couldn't spring anybody with speed through the neutral zone, especially on wing. In NJ he always had Elias, Gionta, etc.... in New York the puck would always end up in the corner. Sather has done a terrible job. I think it is a very under appreciated fact that hockey is soooo much a team game and it is how the skaters skate as a unit moreso than as an individual. It isn't baseball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 Would Briere make the Rangers better? Yes. Does Gomez make the Habs better? Yes. Posters can rant and rave about the money, it doesn't take away that teams in the East are going to get better. With only a few playoff spots for a team like the Sabres to fight for seeing teams in the East load up with talented players is nothing to be happy about. OK, Mr. Negative, time to take a breath and consider some facts: 1. The Habs are probably going to lose their #1 and #3 centers from last year, one of whom was their captain (Koivu and Lang). 2. In this trade, the Habs are giving up a decent scoring winger in Higgins and their best young defense prospect in McDonagh. 3. The Habs are also probably going to lose their 2nd-best defenseman today (Komisarek). 4. For someone who has been carrying on about Connolly's contract and how it limits the Sabres' ability to make changes, you seem happy to gloss over the fact that Gomez' contract is much, much worse. 5. Gainey and Sather are 2 of the worst GMs in the league. 6. Heatley is probably leaving the division today as well. 7. Yes, in the abstract, it would be a bad thing if other EC teams were making themselves better while the Sabres were sitting around with their thumbs up their butts. Other than Philly, that is not what has happened. If you were a politician I would accuse you of bending the facts to support your preferred narrative. Let's see what happens over the next couple of weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 OK, Mr. Negative, time to take a breath and consider some facts: 1. The Habs are probably going to lose their #1 and #3 centers from last year, one of whom was their captain (Koivu and Lang). 2. In this trade, the Habs are giving up a decent scoring winger in Higgins and their best young defense prospect in McDonagh. 3. The Habs are also probably going to lose their 2nd-best defenseman today (Komisarek). 4. For someone who has been carrying on about Connolly's contract and how it limits the Sabres' ability to make changes, you seem happy to gloss over the fact that Gomez' contract is much, much worse. 5. Gainey and Sather are 2 of the worst GMs in the league. 6. Heatley is probably leaving the division today as well. 7. Yes, in the abstract, it would be a bad thing if other EC teams were making themselves better while the Sabres were sitting around with their thumbs up their butts. Other than Philly, that is not what has happened. If you were a politician I would accuse you of bending the facts to support your preferred narrative. Let's see what happens over the next couple of weeks. The Gomez contract is larger not worse. The Connolly contract is much more devastating to the Sabres financial structure than a Gomez contract to a franchise with a larger budget. Sure the Habs are going to lose some players. Is there any doubt they are going to be players this off-season and replace those players they lose? The Sabres better hope Heatley leaves the division. Fans better hope he leaves the Conference. Heatley to the Rangers clearly puts the Rangers ahead of Buffalo. I mentioned this early. In the East there are at least five teams clearly better than Buffalo that you can almost write in stone to make the playoffs. Pitt, NJ, Wash, Bos and Philly. That leaves three playoff spots. Montreal has made a significant upgrade and will do more. The Rangers are prepared to make some moves. These are two teams that made playoffs last year and look to improve. If Buffalo doesn't keep pace they can actually see themselves slip back. The Sens are making moves and will be better. Carolina is in a weak division and will always be able to rack up the points. The Leafs will only be better under Brian Burke. If the Sabres sit back and watch this off-season go by they will be hard pressed to get back to 10th place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob_sauve28 Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 Gomez is a player. He was just on a very poorly conceived team in terms of line-mates in NY.They couldn't spring anybody with speed through the neutral zone, especially on wing. In NJ he always had Elias, Gionta, etc.... in New York the puck would always end up in the corner. Sather has done a terrible job. I dunno about that. His career stats are not much better. One year he had 33 goals, but that's about it. He actually had more goals as a Ranger these last two years than his last year with the Devils. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wonderbread Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 I dunno about that. His career stats are not much better. One year he had 33 goals, but that's about it. He actually had more goals as a Ranger these last two years than his last year with the Devils. Nice find. Great point. He is hardly worth the $$ he is getting infact I would argue that he is worth about 1/2 of what he is getting. Leave it to the Rags to continue to increase salaries as it is in their best interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob_sauve28 Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 The Gomez contract is larger not worse. The Connolly contract is much more devastating to the Sabres financial structure than a Gomez contract to a franchise with a larger budget. Sure the Habs are going to lose some players. Is there any doubt they are going to be players this off-season and replace those players they lose? The Sabres better hope Heatley leaves the division. Fans better hope he leaves the Conference. Heatley to the Rangers clearly puts the Rangers ahead of Buffalo. I mentioned this early. In the East there are at least five teams clearly better than Buffalo that you can almost write in stone to make the playoffs. Pitt, NJ, Wash, Bos and Philly. That leaves three playoff spots. Montreal has made a significant upgrade and will do more. The Rangers are prepared to make some moves. These are two teams that made playoffs last year and look to improve. If Buffalo doesn't keep pace they can actually see themselves slip back. The Sens are making moves and will be better. Carolina is in a weak division and will always be able to rack up the points. The Leafs will only be better under Brian Burke. If the Sabres sit back and watch this off-season go by they will be hard pressed to get back to 10th place. I wish he would take Alferdson and Spezza with him too! They can't go far enough away to make me happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 The Gomez contract is larger not worse. The Connolly contract is much more devastating to the Sabres financial structure than a Gomez contract to a franchise with a larger budget. Sure the Habs are going to lose some players. Is there any doubt they are going to be players this off-season and replace those players they lose? The Sabres better hope Heatley leaves the division. Fans better hope he leaves the Conference. Heatley to the Rangers clearly puts the Rangers ahead of Buffalo. I mentioned this early. In the East there are at least five teams clearly better than Buffalo that you can almost write in stone to make the playoffs. Pitt, NJ, Wash, Bos and Philly. That leaves three playoff spots. Montreal has made a significant upgrade and will do more. The Rangers are prepared to make some moves. These are two teams that made playoffs last year and look to improve. If Buffalo doesn't keep pace they can actually see themselves slip back. The Sens are making moves and will be better. Carolina is in a weak division and will always be able to rack up the points. The Leafs will only be better under Brian Burke. If the Sabres sit back and watch this off-season go by they will be hard pressed to get back to 10th place. Repeating something doesn't make it true. The Habs have not made a significant upgrade by subtracting Lang, Koivu, Higgins and Komisarek and adding a decent but overrated and overpaid player in Gomez. Ottawa has not improved by losing Heatley and Neil. As for TC's contract vs. Gomez' -- 2 yrs x $4.5MM as opposed to 5 yrs x $7.4MM. Are you kidding? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 I dunno about that. His career stats are not much better. One year he had 33 goals, but that's about it. He actually had more goals as a Ranger these last two years than his last year with the Devils. The trap in New Jersey is the best explanation. The expectation was that Gomez's stats would skyrocket once he got out of the trap...that didn't happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 Repeating something doesn't make it true. The Habs have not made a significant upgrade by subtracting Lang, Koivu, Higgins and Komisarek and adding a decent but overrated and overpaid player in Gomez. Ottawa has not improved by losing Heatley and Neil. As for TC's contract vs. Gomez' -- 2 yrs x $4.5MM as opposed to 5 yrs x $7.4MM. Are you kidding? You have to take into account all the factors. The Connolly contract within the Sabres financial structure makes it difficult for the Sabres to make any changes even if they wanted to. The Gomez contract didn't prohibit the Rangers from making moves and it won't prohibit the Habs. For what the Habs gave up for Gomez it is an huge upgrade. The rest has yet to be determined. You can rest assured that the Habs will be adding players to make up for any loses they may incur. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 You have to take into account all the factors. The Connolly contract within the Sabres financial structure makes it difficult for the Sabres to make any changes even if they wanted to. The Gomez contract didn't prohibit the Rangers from making moves and it won't prohibit the Habs. For what the Habs gave up for Gomez it is an huge upgrade. The rest has yet to be determined. You can rest assured that the Habs will be adding players to make up for any loses they may incur. Actually, the Gomez contract (and the Redden and Roszeval contracts) did prevent the Rangers from making moves -- that's why they unloaded him. And while the Habs will make other moves today, this is only because they have a ton of guys whose contracts are up, so they have cap room. But the Gomez deal -- which is 13% of their cap -- will absolutely hinder the Habs for this season and the next 4. As for TC's contract, it hinders the Sabres much less than Pommer's and Hecht's, and arguably Tallinder's and Lydman's too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 Actually, the Gomez contract (and the Redden and Roszeval contracts) did prevent the Rangers from making moves -- that's why they unloaded him. And while the Habs will make other moves today, this is only because they have a ton of guys whose contracts are up, so they have cap room. But the Gomez deal -- which is 13% of their cap -- will absolutely hinder the Habs for this season and the next 4. As for TC's contract, it hinders the Sabres much less than Pommer's and Hecht's, and arguably Tallinder's and Lydman's too. Redden is proof that Glen Sather battles with senility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 Repeating something doesn't make it true. The Habs have not made a significant upgrade by subtracting Lang, Koivu, Higgins and Komisarek and adding a decent but overrated and overpaid player in Gomez. Ottawa has not improved by losing Heatley and Neil. As for TC's contract vs. Gomez' -- 2 yrs x $4.5MM as opposed to 5 yrs x $7.4MM. Are you kidding? Gomez isn't overrated in the least. He's a play maker who requires a finisher and needs to be able to carry the puck into the zone with forwards who go to the net. Gomez was the Rangers best player the second half of his first season when they finally took him off Jagr's line and was dominant in the first playoff series against the Devils. He led them in post season scoring last season and was second only to Jagr his first year in NY. The fact is the Rangers didn't do a good job of putting him in a situation to succeed. The first season they tried to play him with Jagr and the second they brought in Zherdev. The issue is that both of them want to have the puck on their sticks and that removes Gomez' primary skill of drawing and dishing. That's the equivalent of bringing in Joe Montana to do nothing but hand off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 You have to take into account all the factors. The Connolly contract within the Sabres financial structure makes it difficult for the Sabres to make any changes even if they wanted to. The Gomez contract didn't prohibit the Rangers from making moves and it won't prohibit the Habs. For what the Habs gave up for Gomez it is an huge upgrade. The rest has yet to be determined. You can rest assured that the Habs will be adding players to make up for any loses they may incur. Montreal fans seem pretty high on McDonagh, but then again, I wouldn't expect you to look beyond the two names you actually know. Then there's Higgins who is essentially a younger, less expensive version of Gomez. Both are going to provide more defense than offense. I really don't see how this is a huge upgrade for Montreal. They'll have to do something else before that's the case because after Gomez, they've got absolutely nothing up the middle. Gomez is no #1 center, let alone a #1,2,3 and 4 center. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 Gomez isn't overrated in the least. He's a play maker who requires a finisher and needs to be able to carry the puck into the zone with forwards who go to the net. Gomez was the Rangers best player the second half of his first season when they finally took him off Jagr's line and was dominant in the first playoff series against the Devils. He led them in post season scoring last season and was second only to Jagr his first year in NY. The fact is the Rangers didn't do a good job of putting him in a situation to succeed. The first season they tried to play him with Jagr and the second they brought in Zherdev. The issue is that both of them want to have the puck on their sticks and that removes Gomez' primary skill of drawing and dishing. That's the equivalent of bringing in Joe Montana to do nothing but hand off. Zherdev has that magical Afinegenov gene that makes Russians indifferent to their center. Not all of them have it, but it is common. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 Actually, the Gomez contract (and the Redden and Roszeval contracts) did prevent the Rangers from making moves -- that's why they unloaded him. And while the Habs will make other moves today, this is only because they have a ton of guys whose contracts are up, so they have cap room. But the Gomez deal -- which is 13% of their cap -- will absolutely hinder the Habs for this season and the next 4. As for TC's contract, it hinders the Sabres much less than Pommer's and Hecht's, and arguably Tallinder's and Lydman's too. What's the saying. The proof will be in the eating of the pudding? We'll see at the end of the year which team is in the playoffs and which team is sitting in 10th place again. We will also see who does a better job of living up to their contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 Montreal fans seem pretty high on McDonagh, but then again, I wouldn't expect you to look beyond the two names you actually know. Then there's Higgins who is essentially a younger, less expensive version of Gomez. Both are going to provide more defense than offense. I really don't see how this is a huge upgrade for Montreal. They'll have to do something else before that's the case because after Gomez, they've got absolutely nothing up the middle. Gomez is no #1 center, let alone a #1,2,3 and 4 center. That's the advantage of having a front office willing to make moves. When you have needs they can be addressed. Buffalo needs to be concerned about their centers as well. They have Roy as a #2 and nothing else. We are talking about a team that has played Hecht as a center. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 Montreal fans seem pretty high on McDonagh, but then again, I wouldn't expect you to look beyond the two names you actually know. Then there's Higgins who is essentially a younger, less expensive version of Gomez. Both are going to provide more defense than offense. I really don't see how this is a huge upgrade for Montreal. They'll have to do something else before that's the case because after Gomez, they've got absolutely nothing up the middle. Gomez is no #1 center, let alone a #1,2,3 and 4 center. I'm scratching my head why Gainey threw McDonagh in. I don't think he needed to do that. Disagree on Gomez. Upgrade on Koivu. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 What's the saying. The proof will be in the eating of the pudding? I'm really starting to tire of all this pudding consumption talk. :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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