Swedesessed Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 It was reported that the Panthers want two young players and a draft pick for Olli Jokinen. Imagine Olli on the top line, moving down the centers again (Roy, Connolly etc, circa 2006-2007)... What do you think about the Sabres maybe taking a run after Olli? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blugold43 Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 i'd love to have him here. AND I'M SURE DARCY WILL GET RIGHT TO WORK ON AN OFFER FOR HIM... :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROC Sabres Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 It was reported that the Panthers want two young players and a draft pick for Olli Jokinen.Imagine Olli on the top line, moving down the centers again (Roy, Connolly etc, circa 2006-2007)... What do you think about the Sabres maybe taking a run after Olli? Get the feeling if the sabres to take a run at him, they're gonna pi$$ off a lot of fans by tossing two of the young players to them. Now if that includes some of our AHL players, maybe they can give it a go. I just dont see that happening. Does it say a specific draft pick or just 'a' draft pick? I'm guessing 2nd round at least. Prolly not worth the cost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 Get the feeling if the sabres to take a run at him, they're gonna pi$$ off a lot of fans by tossing two of the young players to them. Now if that includes some of our AHL players, maybe they can give it a go. I just dont see that happening. Does it say a specific draft pick or just 'a' draft pick? I'm guessing 2nd round at least. Prolly not worth the cost. Darren Dreger on TSN said they want two young NHL roster players and a first-round pick. The cost would probably be Stafford, Paille and a first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROC Sabres Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 Darren Dreger on TSN said they want two young NHL roster players and a first-round pick. The cost would probably be Stafford, Paille and a first. Oh, that's all? Ain't gonna happen. If it does happen, I'm going to be really surprised by the FO. Keep the lines the same and bring in Peca for 2 dollars a game. I don;t care if he doesn't have it anymore but 3 players for 1 doesn't add up for me. I would prefer they give up both first round picks and move up in the top 10 and get a stud if they are gonna blow a first rounder on someone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 Oh, that's all? Ain't gonna happen. If it does happen, I'm going to be really surprised by the FO. Keep the lines the same and bring in Peca for 2 dollars a game. I don;t care if he doesn't have it anymore but 3 players for 1 doesn't add up for me. I would prefer they give up both first round picks and move up in the top 10 and get a stud if they are gonna blow a first rounder on someone. I'd give up the second first rounder and one NHL player or one player and one prospect. No way I'd give up two young NHL'ers and a first rounder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROC Sabres Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 I'd give up the second first rounder and one NHL player or one player and one prospect. No way I'd give up two young NHL'ers and a first rounder. A lot of people keep saying stafford would be the most likely guy to get shipped with a deal but does anyone ever remember buffalo giving up one of their first round draft picks for another player? Give 'em one NHLer and a pick, thats all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stenbaro Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 A lot of people keep saying stafford would be the most likely guy to get shipped with a deal but does anyone ever remember buffalo giving up one of their first round draft picks for another player? Give 'em one NHLer and a pick, thats all. I think they make a deal to bring in a big time center this offseason and it is gonna cost us a player or players we wont like unfortunatly. I think when it all shakes down we will be happy no matter who we deal largely because it will feel like we are moving towards progress rather than the past 2 yrs of digressing.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROC Sabres Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 I think they make a deal to bring in a big time center this offseason and it is gonna cost us a player or players we wont like unfortunatly. I think when it all shakes down we will be happy no matter who we deal largely because it will feel like we are moving towards progress rather than the past 2 yrs of digressing.. Not me. I didn't pay 170 bucks for a stafford jersey for them to trade him.:) You're probably right though. I don't know if it needs to be Olli that we bring in though to be that big time center that we need. I don't think Olli is the right fit for our team. I don't know what it is but there is something i never really liked about him. Maybe if he tries the slug on i will change my opinion a little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stenbaro Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 Not me. I didn't pay 170 bucks for a stafford jersey for them to trade him.:) You're probably right though. I don't know if it needs to be Olli that we bring in though to be that big time center that we need. I don't think Olli is the right fit for our team. I don't know what it is but there is something i never really liked about him. Maybe if he tries the slug on i will change my opinion a little. What do you think of Morrison? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 A lot of people keep saying stafford would be the most likely guy to get shipped with a deal but does anyone ever remember buffalo giving up one of their first round draft picks for another player? Give 'em one NHLer and a pick, thats all. I think that they biggest factor in deciding which player they deal will be the young college guys they just signed - whether someone like Kennedy or Gerbe (hold your laughter, shrader) will make someone like Stafford expendable. Personally I think that Florida might be convinced to take on someone like Max - a little older, but still has a lot of skill, has one year left on his deal so there's not a lot of risk involved, and enough of a name to soothe some ruffled fans' feathers - and then maybe a pick and a prospect. I definitely wouldn't deal off anything like the package Martin supposedly wants, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROC Sabres Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 What do you think of Morrison? Not sure about him. He would definitely add to the veteran leadership that we seem to have misplaced over the past season. It really depends on the numbers. Since nhlnumbers doesnt have his number I don't really know. If we could get him for Max and a 2nd rounder that would be solid. Anyone wanna stick his pricetag on here for me? And wolf, no laughter needed. If either of them can smoke the hell out of him, I would mind less giving him up. I just don't like the idea of tossing 3 players for 1, as I previously stated. Who knows? I'm not Darcy, thank god. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stenbaro Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 Not sure about him. He would definitely add to the veteran leadership that we seem to have misplaced over the past season. It really depends on the numbers. Since nhlnumbers doesnt have his number I don't really know. If we could get him for Max and a 2nd rounder that would be solid. Anyone wanna stick his pricetag on here for me? And wolf, no laughter needed. If either of them can smoke the hell out of him, I would mind less giving him up. I just don't like the idea of tossing 3 players for 1, as I previously stated. Who knows? I'm not Darcy, thank god. I couldnt find any numbers on him either..Curious to see what Langkow is gonna get also... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 And wolf, no laughter needed. If either of them can smoke the hell out of him, I would mind less giving him up. I just don't like the idea of tossing 3 players for 1, as I previously stated. Who knows? I'm not Darcy, thank god. No worries. I'm just waiting for shrader to stop laughing at the concept of Gerbe playing his way onto the Sabres' roster and forcing Darcy's hand. I agree completely. I'd start with an offer of Max, a 2nd-round pick and a prospect like Gragnani, and go from there, see if maybe there is a common ground they can find. I wouldn't go Staff, Paille and a 1st, nor would I go three prospects/young players. Martin is probably going to have to take one veteran with a slightly higher salary (than what a second-year NHL'er would get) in return for Jokinen and his $5.25M cap hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 Not sure about him. He would definitely add to the veteran leadership that we seem to have misplaced over the past season. It really depends on the numbers. Since nhlnumbers doesnt have his number I don't really know. If we could get him for Max and a 2nd rounder that would be solid. Anyone wanna stick his pricetag on here for me? Brendan Morrison? Last year $3.2M cap hit and salary. Signed a three-year deal in Summer 2005. LINK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROC Sabres Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 Brendan Morrison? Last year $3.2M cap hit and salary. Signed a three-year deal in Summer 2005. LINK Way to dig. In that case I would take him for around those same numbers, maybe 3.5-4 if his stock is high right now. Getting rid of Max (and maybe connolly) would free up that space and provide us with a solid number 2 center. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goodfella25 Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 No and No. I don't like Jokinen. Never did. Seems like an a-hole in his interviews, and I thought the rumor was he's not a good locker room guy. Didn't Robitaille mention that when the Jokinen to Buffalo rumors were flying near the trade deadline? I can't wait until he actually does get traded somewhere, because as long as he's in Florida, the rumors will never end. Same can be said for Marleau. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SabresFanInRochester Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 I would have no problem shipping two 3rd or 4th line players for a definite first line player, who just happens to be a center. And with those two players, I would give up the 2nd of our 2 first round picks. I would even consider throwing a prospect in if it sweetened the deal. Jokinen would help Buffalo win now, and in the future. I believe that you should have depth in the farm system, but I love the players that Buffalo just signed. I think Paille and Stafford and Max hanging around make it difficult for the younger guys to break into the system. Thin out the depth by acquiring a play-maker. Would the cap still leave room to acquire a defenseman at $5 million/year and extend Pommer and Miller? If you could do all of the above, I would make the trade in a heart beat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetweenThePipes00 Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 I would have no problem shipping two 3rd or 4th line players for a definite first line player, who just happens to be a center. And with those two players, I would give up the 2nd of our 2 first round picks. I would even consider throwing a prospect in if it sweetened the deal. Jokinen would help Buffalo win now, and in the future. I believe that you should have depth in the farm system, but I love the players that Buffalo just signed. I think Paille and Stafford and Max hanging around make it difficult for the younger guys to break into the system. Thin out the depth by acquiring a play-maker. Would the cap still leave room to acquire a defenseman at $5 million/year and extend Pommer and Miller? If you could do all of the above, I would make the trade in a heart beat. Paille and Stafford are both first round picks who they spent time and money developing and have already shown they can play a little in the league with the promise of more ... why are you worried about them blocking smaller guys who were drafted much later like Kennedy and Gerbe? Thin out the depth by letting the guys like Max and Kotalik go, not the guys who are just starting to blossom. Plus you would throw in a prospect AND a first round pick? Jokinen is a nice player but he ain't THAT good. Not to mention you are shipping out very little salary and taking on more ... it handcuffs them to make other moves. If they are going to spend $5 million on a new player, do it in free agency where you are not giving up player assets also. Besides, if that's what Martin is asking for, that's where the talks start ... he shoots for the moon and will have to take less ... no need to start throwing him more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 Just the title of this thread gets me excited. I wanted Jokiene at the trade deadline and I want him now even more. Look at his his numbers over the last three years: 38 51 89 39 52 91 34 37 71 And i think he played every game. Even if we had to give up Paille and Stafford(which we would not have to do) their numbers don't equal these combined. I know Goodfella doesn't like him but if he was here he'd be our a-hole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetweenThePipes00 Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 Just the title of this thread gets me excited. I wanted Jokiene at the trade deadline and I want him now even more. Look at his his numbers over the last three years:38 51 89 39 52 91 34 37 71 And i think he played every game. Even if we had to give up Paille and Stafford(which we would not have to do) their numbers don't equal these combined. I know Goodfella doesn't like him but if he was here he'd be our a-hole. Actually, Stafford and Paille just played their first full seasons in the NHL and did combine for more points than Jokinen had last season. But aside from that, it's not fantasy hockey, trade for equal numbers ... Jokinen already makes $5.25 million and has just 2 years left on the deal at which point he'll command a big raise ... Stafford and Paille will be like 24 and 25 respectively still a couple years from possibly hitting the market. By then I am pretty sure they will be outscoring Jokinen combined for about the same money, if not less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 I think that they biggest factor in deciding which player they deal will be the young college guys they just signed - whether someone like Kennedy or Gerbe (hold your laughter, shrader) will make someone like Stafford expendable. No laughter, but I do wonder how two undersized forwards will make a 6'2 forward expendable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SabresFanInRochester Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 Paille and Stafford are both first round picks who they spent time and money developing and have already shown they can play a little in the league with the promise of more ... why are you worried about them blocking smaller guys who were drafted much later like Kennedy and Gerbe? Thin out the depth by letting the guys like Max and Kotalik go, not the guys who are just starting to blossom. Plus you would throw in a prospect AND a first round pick? Jokinen is a nice player but he ain't THAT good. Not to mention you are shipping out very little salary and taking on more ... it handcuffs them to make other moves. If they are going to spend $5 million on a new player, do it in free agency where you are not giving up player assets also.Besides, if that's what Martin is asking for, that's where the talks start ... he shoots for the moon and will have to take less ... no need to start throwing him more. I really do see your point. But, the basis of my argument is that we have too much depth at forward. I know there has been time and money invested into Paille and Stafford, but I don't think Florida will take Peters or another seasoned vet. If they would take Max and Kotalik -- hey, we have a deal. With our depth at forward, I would easily move both Stafford and Paille, who certainly can still improve, for a proven 1st line center. When you look at what is gained versus what is lost, you can't just look at the number of bodies. You have to consider the quality of players. The post above this mentioned Jokinen contributed more points than Stafford and Paille combined. I say good trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 Actually, Stafford and Paille just played their first full seasons in the NHL and did combine for more points than Jokinen had last season. But aside from that, it's not fantasy hockey, trade for equal numbers ... Jokinen already makes $5.25 million and has just 2 years left on the deal at which point he'll command a big raise ... Stafford and Paille will be like 24 and 25 respectively still a couple years from possibly hitting the market. By then I am pretty sure they will be outscoring Jokinen combined for about the same money, if not less. I know there's an unwritten rule that you don't trade away proven talent for prospective talent. But is there also a rule that you have to keep guys that you think are going to good because you'll feel stupid if they get good somewhere else. We've been through that. I want to pay for someone I know is good and have them win for us. I want Jokinen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom webster Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 For the record; Sabres' FO not as impressed with Jokinen as all the internet sites are. Amongst other things, they believe he disappears on the road and has a history of lockerroom issues. To answer someone else's question, Buffalo did trade Keith Ballard, a former number one pick, as part as the Drury trade. I believe that either Bernier or Stafford will be dealt before training camp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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