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spndnchz

By spndnchz
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Robviously First Liner

Robviously

Posted
Posted

That wouldn't have happened. Sure, Jerry Sullivan would have moaned, Bull Dog would have barked and angry people would have called GR complaining, but then the world would have moved on.

You obviously don't remember Summer 2007. The day Buffalo lost Drury and Briere was "Black Sunday." If you think Buffalo fans would have been cool with losing BOTH captains AND the 23-year old forward who just scored 43 goals and had the highest +/- in the league, you're crazy. Not only would that have killed the fans, it would have destroyed the team psychologically. I can't imagine Ryan Miller re-signing with the Sabres if they let ALL their best players leave via free agency.

 

John Grigg's logic is horrifically bad. He states, "If they had allowed Vanek to go to the Oilers, the Sabres would have Hall, Eberle, Paajarvi or other top prospects and another high pick to come to complement Myers, Ennis, Kassian and everyone else in the fold."

 

Oh, not really, John, I'm so sorry. Because if the Oilers get Vanek in Summer 2007, the entire future for both franchises would be significantly altered. The draft positions for the Oilers and Sabres, not to mention the rest of the league, would be different. Everything would be different. Maybe the Sabres don't even draft Myers in 2008. And the idea that the Sabres would definitely have had the no.1 overall pick last year from the Oilers is especially poorly thought out. The Oilers probably wouldn't have had that pick. Certainly a player like Vanek would have helped them win more games and finish higher in the standings. A team with no first round picks is not going to let itself bottom out.

 

You can't use a static model to compare November 2010 to an imaginary November 2010 in an alternate dimension where the Sabres let Vanek go to the Oilers for four first round picks.

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JJFIVEOH All Star

JJFIVEOH

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You obviously don't remember Summer 2007. The day Buffalo lost Drury and Briere was "Black Sunday." If you think Buffalo fans would have been cool with losing BOTH captains AND the 23-year old forward who just scored 43 goals and had the highest +/- in the league, you're crazy. Not only would that have killed the fans, it would have destroyed the team psychologically. I can't imagine Ryan Miller re-signing with the Sabres if they let ALL their best players leave via free agency.

 

John Grigg's logic is horrifically bad. He states, "If they had allowed Vanek to go to the Oilers, the Sabres would have Hall, Eberle, Paajarvi or other top prospects and another high pick to come to complement Myers, Ennis, Kassian and everyone else in the fold."

 

Oh, not really, John, I'm so sorry. Because if the Oilers get Vanek in Summer 2007, the entire future for both franchises would be significantly altered. The draft positions for the Oilers and Sabres, not to mention the rest of the league, would be different. Everything would be different. Maybe the Sabres don't even draft Myers in 2008. And the idea that the Sabres would definitely have had the no.1 overall pick last year from the Oilers is especially poorly thought out. The Oilers probably wouldn't have had that pick. Certainly a player like Vanek would have helped them win more games and finish higher in the standings. A team with no first round picks is not going to let itself bottom out.

 

You can't use a static model to compare November 2010 to an imaginary November 2010 in an alternate dimension where the Sabres let Vanek go to the Oilers for four first round picks.

 

 

The majority of keyboard warriors think hindsight is legitimate argument when they don't consider the alternative.

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TheChimp Third Liner

TheChimp

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That wouldn't have happened. Sure, Jerry Sullivan would have moaned, Bull Dog would have barked and angry people would have called GR complaining, but then the world would have moved on.

That's pretty much true. Tommy the Hijacker could dress a bunch of dead donkeys in Sabres gear and the fans would still pack the place in fear of the team leaving if they didn't.

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bob_sauve28 All Star

bob_sauve28

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That's pretty much true. Tommy the Hijacker could dress a bunch of dead donkeys in Sabres gear and the fans would still pack the place in fear of the team leaving if they didn't.

Yup, that's about right. Vanek was the least favorite of the fans of those three that left. Ruff, Regier and Quinn panicked. They could have the sweetest deal ever and passed it up. Those four picks plus $50 million to spend on someone else??? Vanek may have scored the biggest goal of his career last night, but he isn't worth passing up all that.

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bob_sauve28 All Star

bob_sauve28

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Posted

You obviously don't remember Summer 2007. The day Buffalo lost Drury and Briere was "Black Sunday." If you think Buffalo fans would have been cool with losing BOTH captains AND the 23-year old forward who just scored 43 goals and had the highest +/- in the league, you're crazy. Not only would that have killed the fans, it would have destroyed the team psychologically. I can't imagine Ryan Miller re-signing with the Sabres if they let ALL their best players leave via free agency.

 

John Grigg's logic is horrifically bad. He states, "If they had allowed Vanek to go to the Oilers, the Sabres would have Hall, Eberle, Paajarvi or other top prospects and another high pick to come to complement Myers, Ennis, Kassian and everyone else in the fold."

 

Oh, not really, John, I'm so sorry. Because if the Oilers get Vanek in Summer 2007, the entire future for both franchises would be significantly altered. The draft positions for the Oilers and Sabres, not to mention the rest of the league, would be different. Everything would be different. Maybe the Sabres don't even draft Myers in 2008. And the idea that the Sabres would definitely have had the no.1 overall pick last year from the Oilers is especially poorly thought out. The Oilers probably wouldn't have had that pick. Certainly a player like Vanek would have helped them win more games and finish higher in the standings. A team with no first round picks is not going to let itself bottom out.

 

You can't use a static model to compare November 2010 to an imaginary November 2010 in an alternate dimension where the Sabres let Vanek go to the Oilers for four first round picks.

The fans were not going to be cool? What are you talking about? What were you going to do Sliver, run down and start a riot? :rolleyes: :w00t:

 

And things wouldn't be exactly the same in draft order? OMG, really??? Imagine that. Still, eight first round picks in four years. I'll take that. The way I looked at it at the time, was I'm going to be a fan for my whole life, and those draft picks will help the team for a long time. All that young talent coming in at once, heck, that might be the makings of a great team.

 

And another thing, this all smacks of defending yet another bad [cowardly?] decision by this organization. Everyone defending this always leave something out of the equation. You leave out the fact that Vanek cost $50 million. Some of you ignorantly state that I shouldn't care about Tommy's money. You are right! But for $50 million we could have signed, and yes, overpaid, someone else, or several players!

 

 

They crapped the bed by keeping Vanek. Not that I have anything against him personally at all, but they should have let him go. That's all I'm saying, its over and no arguing can change anything now

 

 

Go Sabres

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Robviously First Liner

Robviously

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Posted

And things wouldn't be exactly the same in draft order? OMG, really??? Imagine that. Still, eight first round picks in four years. I'll take that. The way I looked at it at the time, was I'm going to be a fan for my whole life, and those draft picks will help the team for a long time. All that young talent coming in at once, heck, that might be the makings of a great team.

Apparently you didn't "imagine that" because you linked an article implying the Sabres would have the exact players Edmonton drafted these last few years had they let Vanek go (most notably Taylor Hall).

 

There's no guarantee how much extra draft picks would help a team. Assuming the Oilers don't decide to bottom out (which seems likely if they don't have their top picks), those are probably mid-first rounders -- so anything from Persson, Kruikov, and Zagrapan to Myers, Ennis, Paille, Stafford, Kalinin.

 

And another thing, this all smacks of defending yet another bad [cowardly?] decision by this organization. Everyone defending this always leave something out of the equation. You leave out the fact that Vanek cost $50 million. Some of you ignorantly state that I shouldn't care about Tommy's money. You are right! But for $50 million we could have signed, and yes, overpaid, someone else, or several players!

Fine, so who did you want the Sabres to sign with that $50M dollars? Or, which free agents have the Sabres missed out on because they didn't have the money? Remember, the team has room under the cap right now and the only reason they couldn't sign Koivu or Cullen last summer was because neither player wanted to come here (not money).

 

And would it be easier or harder to sign free agents for a team that has a history of NOT paying its best players and is openly letting them go for draft picks? You might as well include the money we'd saved by not re-signing Miller in this scenario because there's no way he'd want to stick around if we're going in full rebuilding mode starting in 2007.

 

They crapped the bed by keeping Vanek. Not that I have anything against him personally at all, but they should have let him go. That's all I'm saying, its over and no arguing can change anything now

Yes, he's such a terrible player that you're arguing that he should be the team captain in other threads. Epic logic.

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Robviously First Liner

Robviously

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Relax, chief, we all just want Vanek to start earning his money, is that so wrong?

 

OK, chief, let's simplify things. Here is a comprehensive list of Sabres who have scored more goals than Vanek since summer 2007:

 

Oh, that's right, no one. Did it ever occur to anyone that he's the best forward on a lousy team?

 

And enough with the "overpaid" argument. You could say every star player in the NHL with a big contract is overpaid. Based on how the playoffs have gone, maybe Ovechkin and Miller are overpaid. Is it really hurting the team or your enjoyment of the team that Vanek makes $7M/year instead of $6M/year or $5/year? What is the right amount of money to pay Vanek that will help you sleep at night?

 

And, again, someone give me some evidence that Vanek's contract has prevented the Sabres from bringing in other, better players via free agency.

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spndnchz All Star

spndnchz

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per Vanek site:

 

 

Thomas and Ashley Vanek are now proud parents of twin boys. Ashley gave birth to the babies on Monday noon.

Shortly after 1 pm EST Thomas sent us a SMS bearing the happy news. Just as planed the Ashley had a Caesarean around noon. The couple already has a boy. Blake Thomas is 3 years old.

 

Luka Robert weighs in at 6 pounds and 12 ounzes and is 20 inches big.

 

Kade Ashton is 5 pounds 18.5 ounzes and is 18.5 inches big.

 

Both are healthy and Ashley is doing well. We wish the Vanek family all the best!

 

 

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TheChimp Third Liner

TheChimp

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OK, chief, let's simplify things. Here is a comprehensive list of Sabres who have scored more goals than Vanek since summer 2007:

Oh, that's right, no one. Did it ever occur to anyone that he's the best forward on a lousy team?

 

And enough with the "overpaid" argument. You could say every star player in the NHL with a big contract is overpaid. Based on how the playoffs have gone, maybe Ovechkin and Miller are overpaid. Is it really hurting the team or your enjoyment of the team that Vanek makes $7M/year instead of $6M/year or $5/year? What is the right amount of money to pay Vanek that will help you sleep at night?

 

And, again, someone give me some evidence that Vanek's contract has prevented the Sabres from bringing in other, better players via free agency.

What part of "relax" has you stumped, there, killer?

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Robviously First Liner

Robviously

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Oh to you that's whining. Thank you for clearing that up. Looks like you really got me, there. :ph34r:

You show up in the "Vanek blog" thread and all you have to say is that he "needs to start earning his money." Yes, I can't imagine why anyone would think that was whining. :rolleyes:

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