PASabreFan Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 I guess it does, because you continually misrepresent the point made by others that Ruff's system requires players to give an honest effort every shift to mean that Ruff needs players the level of Crosby, Malkin, and Ovechkin to succeed. So the "horses" a lot of people think Ruff needs are not thoroughbreds but more plow horses? Ryan Miller and 19 guys named Grier? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 So what you want is a vezina winning team leading the league in goals for? The power play has been an issue for a long time but so has the lack of a true point man. Ruff has won with the talent he has. You choose to pick and choose what years you count, I choose to look at the whole record. Name a coach who has won a championship without overwhelming talent. I can think if two cases in recent (since the 70's)NHL history where a team won a Cup using the team first method. Players win championships. Belichek won nothing until Brady happened along, Shanahan nothing without Elway and Davis, Bowman nothing without Lafleur/ Dryden, Datsyuk, Zetterberg and Lindstrom. Hey, you're the guy who said we had both under Ruff! Ruff had his superstar. Does the goaltender not count? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 Do you think Drury, Briere, Soupy and Dumont constituted "overwhelming talent"? What about Miller? Is he suddenly an "overwhelming talent?" Haven't you beaten the Miller-isn't-very-good drum for the last 3 years? Do you think the Sabres have the same amount of talent as Washington, Philly or Pittsburgh? Or San Jose or Chicago? Stop blathering and add some value to the discussion. Stop trying to help TW. He doesn't need it, especially from someone of your ilk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 So what you want is a vezina winning team leading the league in goals for? I could live with that. ;) Name a coach who has won a championship without overwhelming talent. I can think if two cases in recent (since the 70's)NHL history where a team won a Cup using the team first method. Players win championships. Belichek won nothing until Brady happened along, Shanahan nothing without Elway and Davis, Bowman nothing without Lafleur/ Dryden, Datsyuk, Zetterberg and Lindstrom. Here I go with my nitpicking again. Lidstrom, yes. But not Datsyuk and Zetterberg. Datsyuk was a rookie during Scotty's last year with Detroit and Zetterberg wasn't around yet. If you're going to talk Detroit, Lidstrom is a must, but I can't believe you left out Yzerman, Fedorov, and Shanahan. The other one I'm never sure how to place with Bowman is that cup with Pittsburgh. He was there for such a short time, but that's the perfect example of overwhelming talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 I could live with that. ;) Here I go with my nitpicking again. Lidstrom, yes. But not Datsyuk and Zetterberg. Datsyuk was a rookie during Scotty's last year with Detroit and Zetterberg wasn't around yet. If you're going to talk Detroit, Lidstrom is a must, but I can't believe you left out Yzerman, Fedorov, and Shanahan. The other one I'm never sure how to place with Bowman is that cup with Pittsburgh. He was there for such a short time, but that's the perfect example of overwhelming talent. Pittsburgh? Ruff would have benched that floater 66. Hanging around center ice, waiting for breakaway passes. Lazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Swannie_House Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 Pittsburgh? Ruff would have benched that floater 66. Hanging around center ice, waiting for breakaway passes. Lazy. You Buffalo fans really have an issue if you think Ruff is the problem! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
korab rules Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 I thought this thread was about the magazine. I was disappointed to find out differently. Then again, the sausage grabbing, bi-curious sallies on this team would never appear in a magazine devoted to virile hetero men and their pursuits. Except maybe Hank and his two best friends, they would be Maxim material Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 I thought this thread was about the magazine. I was disappointed to find out differently. Then again, the sausage grabbing, bi-curious sallies on this team would never appear in a magazine devoted to virile hetero men and their pursuits. Except maybe Hank and his two best friends, they would be Maxim material One Night in Linköping :bag: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swedesessed Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 Just to play Devil's advocate: maybe Miller wouldn't look so good behind a team with those players (Max, etc.) and a coach focused more on offense. It seems there are some on this board that are obsessed with bringing down Miller, why is that? The statement you made can be said for almost ANY great goalie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdexchange Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 Except maybe Hank and his two best friends, they would be Maxim material :bag: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stenbaro Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 Ruff is the best thing this team has, why can't you Buffalo fans understand this? You are not a "Buffalo" fan? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteamRoller72 Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 Yeah. And too bad the change of scenery wasn't behind the bench in Buffalo with an offensive revival across the Sabre lineup. Pair that up with Miller's play and, well, we'd be talking instant contender. What part of "have your cake and eat it too" do you not get? Miller wouldn't nearly have his current stats if the Sabres played up-tempo, offense first hockey. It doesn't win in the playoffs in the NHL. I'll take boring, defensive hockey if the end result is a playoff run in spring 2010. I can see all the highlight goals I need on NHL on the fly every night... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 What part of "have your cake and eat it too" do you not get? Miller wouldn't nearly have his current stats if the Sabres played up-tempo, offense first hockey. It doesn't win in the playoffs in the NHL. I'll take boring, defensive hockey if the end result is a playoff run in spring 2010. I can see all the highlight goals I need on NHL on the fly every night... Oversimplification for a simple mind. It suits you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteamRoller72 Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 Oversimplification for a simple mind. It suits you. Personal insults don't help validate your hatred of Lindy. You come off as an old, bitter woman... Maybe you should follow the Flyers as I've suggested before? Goal scoring is at a premium, games are exciting and you can buy an Emery jersey for Christmas. The Thrashers seem right up your alley as well...exciting, offensive hockey. I'll think about this conversation when the Sabres are in the second round of the playoffs in May with Lindy at the helm and the Flyers/Thrashers are adding up their goal scoring totals on the golf course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom webster Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 I could live with that. ;) Here I go with my nitpicking again. Lidstrom, yes. But not Datsyuk and Zetterberg. Datsyuk was a rookie during Scotty's last year with Detroit and Zetterberg wasn't around yet. If you're going to talk Detroit, Lidstrom is a must, but I can't believe you left out Yzerman, Fedorov, and Shanahan. The other one I'm never sure how to place with Bowman is that cup with Pittsburgh. He was there for such a short time, but that's the perfect example of overwhelming talent. There I go trusting a 49 year old memory again. My apologies and of course you are right. What I should have also pointed out was that the only blemish on Scotty's record happened when he was in charge of acquiring the talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Swannie_House Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 You are not a "Buffalo" fan? Was there "purple donkey" involved? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdexchange Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 Was there "purple donkey" involved? There might have been... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wonderbread Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 There might have been... What the deal with the purple donkey? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabre Dance Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 You Buffalo fans really have an issue if you think Ruff is the problem! Of course Ruff is not THE problem... his team is not overly endowed with talent, save a couple of players. (Or maybe they are but they just aren't getting the coaching they need to excel). If you look at last seasons' Penguins team, we knew going into the season that they had Crosby, Malkin, Fleury and a great supporting cast. Yet, part of the way through the season, they were playing badly. Were they going to make wholesale changes to their roster? No. They switched coaches and they started winning. Could they have turned their season around with Therrien still behind the bench? Maybe, maybe not. BUT, they did switch, the team began winning and then their talent AND coaching won them a Cup. So, unless the FO is willing to start dealing players and trying to bring in big talent for the short term (giving up their future in the draft), we have to live with the players we have. If the team begins to lose (they're doing OK for now), what do you do to shake things up? All that's left is to bring in a new coach. (It seems to be working for the Bills, BTW). Lindy is not a bad coach by any means...he just might not be the coach that THIS group of players needs to excel on the ice... For now, the team is winning ugly, but they are winning. If they can continue to do so, arguments for swapping players or the coach is pretty much moot. If they swoon, do they maintain the status quo, change nothing and miss the playoffs again? Do they keep Lindy, bring in a lame-duck free agent or two and see if that works? Or, do they change the one thing that hasn't changed for 12 years and bring in a new coach? If I were making the decisions, I would let Lindy go and bring in someone new. Heck, you can lose with anyone behind the bench. Sometimes, you have to take a chance in life...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 There I go trusting a 49 year old memory again. My apologies and of course you are right. What I should have also pointed out was that the only blemish on Scotty's record happened when he was in charge of acquiring the talent. Good point about Scotty I guess. I don't think he really wanted to be coach and GM here. Whenever I think of him, I think of all the great situations he hornswaggled his way into over the years. Including Buffalo. Now Chicago. The man really is shameless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swedesessed Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 You are not a "Buffalo" fan? Maybe he is Trent Edwards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
korab rules Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 :bag: Please tell me that is a real cover, please! I will buy a lifetime subscription if it is. I know, it isn't. Is this something that existed prior to this thread or did you create it on the spot? Nice work on short order if you did Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
static70 Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 Ruff is the best thing this team has, why can't you Buffalo fans understand this? This statement no longer holds water. Ruff? The best thing this team has? Not hardly. No, as a fan since the team was born I can say without hesitation that Ruff is not the best thing this team has. While your making that statement let us watch another 5 years without serious contention for the Cup. This sport, this game is all about winning the Cup. It has nothing to do with anything else. If you think otherwise, you are not living in reality. Ruff has not won a cup and has had 11 years to do so, regardless of the lockout, bankruptcy..etc..etc. Nope, winners don't make excuses, they make HISTORY! Max is doing just fine, unfortunately for Buffalo no eastern European player would seriously consider playing here, that is sad, us fans who foot the bill for this team don't get a chance to see a real skilled hands guy come in and make the game exciting. Known fact: Miller, although great in net does not draw as much of a crowd to spend money as a scorer, no goalie ever has, not even Hasek. Good for Max, I am happy for him, and Kozlov and other talents that left Buffalo to find success, good for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdexchange Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 Please tell me that is a real cover, please! I will buy a lifetime subscription if it is. I know, it isn't. Is this something that existed prior to this thread or did you create it on the spot? Nice work on short order if you did on the spot, and thanks :bag: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Swannie_House Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 While your making that statement let us watch another 5 years without serious contention for the Cup. Yes...because we have did not "compete for the cup" in 05-06, or 06-07? :blink: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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