mjd1001

I think I fall someplace in the middle of both of your arguments. Sam has a better pedigree from his draft status, he's probably slightly more talented, and his production has been better. On the other hand, going forward Tuch has a chance to be almost as productive on the score sheet as Sam, and he actually might be a slightly better fit for this team.

I think it's a notable piece of news that players have actually said that... But I also agree with you that it's not an issue right now. By the time the sabres are looking for free agents, it should be a few years down the road.

I don't disagree with you, but I think the significance is your point could be said it would just be common sense.... But here a guy who talks to NHL players his actually come out and said that players have admitted openly that they are going to have second thoughts. It's not something that's common sense to believe it's likely, we now know that players have definitely said it for sure.

One more thing Friedman just brought up, said Buffalo should be worried about how they handled the injury situation and the fact that they wouldn't let Jack get his surgery of choice. When the question was asked to press Frieedman on that, he said that a few players have told him they would have second thoughts about playing for Buffalo because of how they treated Jack regarding the injury. He said behind the scenes the situation between Jack and the sabers was personal and nasty, more than most people know.

A little more info from Friedman on his interview... Said Calgary was very interested but it never got close to closing the deal. He doesn't believe there was any truth to Calgary willing to give up Thachuk. Sabres were more interested in Krebs than any other prospect from Calgary, and more interested in Tuch than any other roster player that was available from Calgary. Calgary definitely willing to give up a future first round pick possibly a 2nd future first, but didn't have the roster players/prospects Sabres wanted. Friedman keeps on stressing over and over how big a part of the deal and how much the Sabres really wanted Tuch.. as a very key piece and a leader of the team going forward. Said the Carolina had interest but they didn't want to give up Jarvis, and there was some concern about how Eichel would fit in with the rest of the team. Mentioned Anaheim dropped out a while ago, they may not have been comfortable with The surgery issue. Montreal was never in it, they also had concerns about whether Eichel would fit in with the team, or as Friedman put it whether he was the 'right play' for them.

590 out of Toronto is playing an interview with Elliot Friedman about the Sabres in general. The events of the past couple of days. I don't know if it's live or not but it's definitely an additional interview to his first one with Jack. Not sure if anyone can find a link to post but it's kind of interesting. A lot of it is his opinion not necessarily fact, but he hinted that ownership/Pegula felt a little bit betrayed by Jack with the trade request 2 years ago and they may have impacted the way things went from there. Also, he said it was important to get a player like Alex Tuch who would come out and openly say how happy he is to be a member of the team. Said he's impressed by how Kevin Adams handled a difficult situation and impressed by his patience. He jokingly called Adams a jerk, because he said Adams didn't leak much information to him or to many people around him so it made it hard on reporters. He said that if there were any leaks, he doubts they came from Adams. Hinted that Jack is very intense and wants things done quickly. Expects a lot of himself and everyone around him including his agent. The reason he made the agent change was strictly to get this moving quickly. That contrasted with Adams who was willing to be his patient as possible with this to get the better deal, which was a point of conflict. The goal of the new agent was to put as much pressure on the sabers as possible.

I don't know what numbers you are looking at, but there are numbers I have seen that support the opposite point of view.

Well, the numbers, the results, and the 'eye test' of many of us say you are wrong.

For some of us, the issue wasn't that the team was not better with him on the ice. It was the 'significant' part. Was Eichel significantly more TALENTED than the rest of the team? Yes. Did he show periods of time where he executed on that talent? Yes. But overall, the team may have been better with him on the ice....but it wasn't significantly better enough of the time. Certainly not to the level that you would expect out of a 2nd overall pick/Semi-generationally labeled talent that was getting paid over 12% of your entire cap space. At least that is how I feel. It might not be all his fault, just when he was drafted a lot of us bought into the hype of 'almost McDavid' and the interview with Tim Murray where Eichel himself said he thought he was the best player in the draft...etc, etc.

Honestly, I think he has been more visible this year than last year. I think his overall play is a bit better this year. However, he still isn't producing many points and is making some mistakes. Send him to Rochester for a few weeks? I'd be OK with that. Maybe sit him in the pressbox for a couple games in a row but still have him practice with the team (not as a punishment, but rather to have him watch the game from a different perspective while getting a 'break'). I'm ok with that too. If I had to choose though, it would be a big stint in Rochester. As long as the 'kids' who are playing there are doing well, add Cozens to the list and let them have fun getting to know each other really well down there. I know Cozens did well in training camp and had a few good games last year, but honestly he should have been in Rochester to begin with.

He will have flexibility in building this roster, that is for sure. I was surprised when I looked into it...the D-men under contract for next year currently with the Sabres? Dahlin and Jokiharju. That is it. Bryson is restricted, but that is all you have. Of the 12 Forwards, you look to bring back, only about half are under contract. Goalies? 2 new ones next year also. This will be a vastly different team next year.

Unless someone comes banging down your door and offers you something absurd, I don't think you make any moves. You have a lot of draft picks coming up already, and remember there are only so many contracts you can give out in a given year. I don't need any more picks in the 3rd round or later. Now, if someone wants an expiring contract off your team, and the offer is something like "Sabres trade player 'x' and a 4th round pick to that team for their 2nd round pick"....then I'll listen. I just don't see the need to shuffle the roster around to extra 4th or 5th round picks.

Defensemen take time. Even the great ones. Charra was awful at times early in his career in NY. It wasn't until the trade to Ottawa that he turned the corner, and even then it took him a few more years to get to Norris trophy caliber. His 3rd and 4th year in the league was a combined -54 for plus-minus and scored a total of 4 goals over 2 seasons. Yes he was drafted a bit lower, but he didn't have his first 'good' year until he was 24 or 25. Erik Karlsson was not only considered bad in his own end, but he was considered a total train-wreck in his own end until he was at least 5 years into his career. How about Victor Hedman? I watched a lot of Lightning games over the years, and by his 3rd or 4th year, there was a LOT of talk that he would be a 'decent D-man', but most had given up hopes of him living up to his high draft status. He didn't have a break-out year putting up points until his 5th year in the league, and he was on better teams than the Sabres currently are.

Those are only 5 highlights, and of course they are picked specifically because he scored....however one thing stands out....he likes to get the puck and go right at the net.

I'm happy for this trade just as much because of Tuch as I am for any of the other parts. I think he is a very good NHL player. He is/has been close to a 20 goal guy per 82 games. Last year he was scoring at a 27 goal/per 82 games. He is a good even strength scorer. He is 25 now, so he is close to his analytical scoring peak but still has a couple years where his numbers might/could get better. He is under contract for a few years at a VERY good rate for his production. He does have playoff experience (quite a bit of it for someone his age) and he has produced/scored in the playoffs. I don't see him as just a 'throw in'. In the next 2-3 years, he can/should be a legit top 6 winger that has an OUTSIDE potential to hit 30 goals in a season, but should be relied on to hit 20 goals while being responsible in his own end and the neutral zone as well as in the offensive zone. The moment he steps on the ice he makes the Sabres better, and should make them better for the next few years. Here is an article I remember reading a few months ago I found about him full article here: https://www.bemidjipioneer.com/sports/hockey/7036557-For-Wild-former-top-prospect-Alex-Tuch-is-the-one-that-got-away Alex Tuch is a foundational piece of the Vegas Golden Knights, a 25-year-old skating savant on the precipice of his prime. He proved as much Tuesday night at T-Mobile Arena, taking over Game 2 of this first-round playoff series down the stretch and leading the Golden Knights to a 3-1 victory over the Minnesota Wild. “He’s got speed, size, grit, and he gets to the net,” Wild coach Dean Evason said. “He’s a real good player. He’s certainly somebody that we have to pay attention to when he’s on the ice.” He used his massive frame and unmatched speed to dominate for prolonged stretches — and he finally got rewarded midway through the game with the go-ahead goal. A few minutes after Jonathan Marchessault scored the first goal of the series for the Golden Knights, Tuch followed it up with a greasy goal on the doorstep that proved to be the game-winner. He crashed the net and Mattias Janmark found him with a pass in close. He’s such a dynamic skater, and when he’s using that size and that speed and getting to those tough areas of the rink, he’s a really hard guy to handle,” Golden Knights coach Pete DeBoer said.

If you are holding out hopes that this team will at least compete for a wild card spot, they yes, this is a very big game. However as others have said, its great they started out well, but many of us think this team tops out at 80 points and is more likely to finish below that than above that. We want the team to win and to be entertained, but we expect a few 3 or 4 or 5 game losing streaks this season. So as others have said, we will enjoy the wins, but this is just another game in the big picture of the season.

I don't want the Sabres to retain salary, but there are so many shades of grey here... -Did they want the Sabres to retain something like $5 million per year? -Was it retaining $1m or $2m per year, along with taking back a salary that would be on the Sabres books? -If there was the Sabres taking back a big salary, how long of a contract would that player be for? Its a message forum so we speculate....I just with there was a time, maybe 2 years..where after that time was up ALL the details of possible trades present would be released to the fans. If the NHL wants to have a hit/moneymaker, how about netflix series that gets access to teams across the league on trade deadline day?

I think many of us would have been content/happy with that deal. There is no saying the Sabres are the ones backing out.....but maybe, just maybe they did back out because they are talking to another team with the possibility for a better deal in return?

Why? Simply the emotional part of being a fan, not the logical part. I agree the 'logical' part of being a fan is everything you say it is....but emotionally we want something new to think about.

As a fan base, I think in general many of the fans have been tolerant of waiting out a trade on Eichel, mostly because the team is winning. However, once we hit that 2-3 game losing streak (or more), things are going to get pretty ugly with a lot of fans wanting something done. I'd like to say personally I understand the 'big picture' and I'm better than that, but honestly I'm probably not. As long as the team gives me something good to watch I'm content, but if the on-ice product starts getting bad to watch, I'm going to really want something else to think about regarding this team. 5 wins in 8 games has gotten Adams a little space with the fanbase regarding the Eichel trade, but when that record turns a bit south that may not be the case anymore.

I guess it depends on what you mean by the player who will 'develop into Eichel' -If you are looking for someone who has played 5 seasons (not counting last year's 6th shortened season) and scored 30 goals a total of 1 time, who is 33rd in the NHL in points since he came into the league, tied for 43rd in goals, and even is his very best year, his 'elite year he was tied for 10th in points.....if THAT is what you consider Eichel, you have a chance (small one) of getting a team to give you a player that develops into that. -If you are thinking Eichel is a top 5 player in the NHL, a 'generational' talent, a 1b to McDavid's 1a, a guy who would have a LOT more production if not for the bad players and coaches around him.....no chance at all you get anything close to that.

I'd be very happy with Krebs as a big part of the return for Eichel. From the little I have seen of him, but read a lot, he seems to be a very good skater, relentless back-checker, decent shot, better playmaker, hard worker. Not likely to be a 30+ goal scorer (maybe 15-20 goals, 50 point potential), but a player that works hard and has enough talent to play anywhere (1st, 2nd, 3rd line, pp, pk, etc). You are not going to get a younger/healthier version of Jack Eichel in return for him, You just have to make sure you get quality young NHL players.

Please no, as much as this thread is out of hand, it is the place many of us go to out of habit now. We have gone this far, I say stick it out and just plow through all the bad posts here until a trade happens.

For the first time this weekend, I actually got the feel from the reporters that a trade was close were true. I think Friday was the first time I thought a trade was imminent. Oh well, we continue to wait.... I think it is even odds this thread gets to 400 pages before Eichel gets traded.

So basically these 'insiders' view it this way: -If a phone call or converstation was had in the last 5 minutes or is currently going on, things are 'heating up' -If it has been more than 5 mintues since Adams spoke the name "Eichel" to another team, things have cooled.