GDT: Avalanche @ Sabres, 12:30pm Oct. 13, 2025, 🎙 📺 ESPN+/MSG

[DarthEbriate]

19 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

That 54 mill goes down real fast when you pay  5 guys 8 mill a year , which they probably will have to do.

True, but does Power need to be one of the five? Or, they can move one of those guys who's not worthy of the full 8 at this time for something they need that is cheaper (and then give Celebrini 10). That's one of those good problems to have.

The problem that Adams saved all his boss' money for only to find...  Cozens on another roster, Samuelsson and Luukkonen on the injured list, Quinn on a bridge (and still on the 3rd line), Byram on a bridge, and Peterka on another roster. Norris on IR. And still paying Skinner anyway.

Edited 3 hours ago by DarthEbriate

[Bangarang]

Quinn should be the next one gone. He's incredibly useless. 

[North Buffalo]

3 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

We didn't trade Peterka for Doan though. We traded him for Doan and Kesselring 

I get that but they didnt add a scorer if they aren't going to call up Helenius or Östlund if they are even ready... 

[JP51]

5 hours ago, inkman said:

That’s just not happening 

Of course it isnt... why would it... it should have been done 2 years ago.

[JP51]

4 hours ago, Pimlach said:

No one can look out 5-10 years, but I get it.  What you are saying is they need another rebuild with a new GM, new coaches, and lots of players need a change of scenery.  

I am saying that... and looking at rebuilding thru the draft like from the ground up 5 years to get good when a lot of those players take 2 or 3 to get here seems like the ball park... and that is if you get it right...  but of course I have no crystal ball... nor do I know the level of competence that Pegula would hire...  but I feel like this is going to go on for a very long time...  JMO... 

but to your main point... yes that is what I am saying... they are ultimately going to need to tear this down...  I think that your core of Dahlin, Thompson, Tuch, etc will pretty much make them tear it down... I think they will want out of here... I cannot see Thompson looking at being 30 years old and never making the playoffs... or Dahlin in his late 20s never in a playoff game...  I think they are going to force their way out... we wont be able to procure NHL players because of no trade clauses and get littered with draft picks and prospects or the odd Josh Norris who looks kinda good on paper but breaks when he sneezes to hard...   

[JP51]

2 hours ago, Huckleberry said:

Would be nice trade partner for Owen power I suppose if we don't wait too long.

Please no more Adams trades... 

[Porous Five Hole]

35 minutes ago, North Buffalo said:

I get that but they didnt add a scorer if they aren't going to call up Helenius or Östlund if they are even ready... 

The concept for making up Peterka’s production was an uptick in team goals with Quinn, Kulich & Benson specifically in mind, and a down tick of goals against with Kess & Timmons in mind (which pushed Glass Sammy to third pair).  
 

That plan can still work, but jeeeeez not so far. 
 

Also, the whole “want to be here” effect our lame duck GM has been spewing for years. 
 

Vibes.  The plan was vibes, I guess.  I cannot wait til GMKA is fired. 

[JP51]

1 hour ago, DarthEbriate said:

True, but does Power need to be one of the five? Or, they can move one of those guys who's not worthy of the full 8 at this time for something they need that is cheaper (and then give Celebrini 10). That's one of those good problems to have.

The problem that Adams saved all his boss' money for only to find...  Cozens on another roster, Samuelsson and Luukkonen on the injured list, Quinn on a bridge (and still on the 3rd line), Byram on a bridge, and Peterka on another roster. Norris on IR. And still paying Skinner anyway.

Can we add the vast overpay for Greenway who is always hurt.. 

Edited 2 hours ago by JP51

[LGR4GM]

35 minutes ago, Porous Five Hole said:

The concept for making up Peterka’s production was an uptick in team goals with Quinn, Kulich & Benson specifically in mind, and a down tick of goals against with Kess & Timmons in mind (which pushed Glass Sammy to third pair).  
 

That plan can still work, but jeeeeez not so far. 
 

Also, the whole “want to be here” effect our lame duck GM has been spewing for years. 
 

Vibes.  The plan was vibes, I guess.  I cannot wait til GMKA is fired. 

The scoring isn't down because Peterka is gone, it's down because Ruffs system mixed with Apperts pp doesn't work with this group. Same thing happened to Granato once he forced a "defense first" system into these guys.

Further, before all the victory laps, Benson hasn't played and Norris is injured. Peterka being here doesn't fix that. 

[JP51]

47 minutes ago, Porous Five Hole said:

The concept for making up Peterka’s production was an uptick in team goals with Quinn, Kulich & Benson specifically in mind, and a down tick of goals against with Kess & Timmons in mind (which pushed Glass Sammy to third pair).  
 

That plan can still work, but jeeeeez not so far. 
 

Also, the whole “want to be here” effect our lame duck GM has been spewing for years. 
 

Vibes.  The plan was vibes, I guess.  I cannot wait til GMKA is fired. 

I think the plan was hope for a miracle ... hope isnt a plan...  I have run out of negative adjectives to call this cesspool... Adams needs to go... but if all that happens is they promote internally again... Like Appert for Ruff and Jarmo for Adams... with Adams likely being POHO ... no bueno... 

[DarthEbriate]

42 minutes ago, JP51 said:

Can we add the vast overpay for Greenway who is always hurt.. 

Certainly. I didn't consider him as part of the core Adams was saving cash for as he's a bottom six PK guy (and good at that role, when healthy), but yes. Once you pay that player $4M you're potentially cutting corners elsewhere.

[JP51]

Just now, DarthEbriate said:

Certainly. I didn't consider him as part of the core Adams was saving cash for as he's a bottom six PK guy (and good at that role, when healthy), but yes. Once you pay that player $4M you're potentially cutting corners elsewhere.

Fair I didnt see him a core either... but 4mm is a ton of money to pay a part timer... 

[DarthEbriate]

3 minutes ago, JP51 said:

I think the plan was hope for a miracle ... hope isnt a plan...  I have run out of negative adjectives to call this cesspool... Adams needs to go... but if all that happens is they promote internally again... Like Appert for Ruff and Jarmo for Adams... with Adams likely being POHO ... no bueno... 

The real fix is the one that's least likely for this owner. You get a real NHL GM, with established connections and credibility around the league (note: this could be a multiyear AGM from a perennial contender). Then, you give that GM control of the head coach, interviewing, and hiring so that they are in lock-step of vision from day one. The coach has input but the GM has final say -- and with luck, that prevents nostalgia signings like 2 years for Geertsen who Lindy thought was good at his role 3 years ago, but has since proven to be a bottom 6 AHLer. Then, the GM uses their network and the coach uses their network to go find assistants that align to their combined vision. But the coach's input is foremost because they have to work together on the day-to-day. It's just a hockey staff; it's not rocket surgery.

[JP51]

2 minutes ago, DarthEbriate said:

The real fix is the one that's least likely for this owner. You get a real NHL GM, with established connections and credibility around the league (note: this could be a multiyear AGM from a perennial contender). Then, you give that GM control of the head coach, interviewing, and hiring so that they are in lock-step of vision from day one. The coach has input but the GM has final say -- and with luck, that prevents nostalgia signings like 2 years for Geertsen who Lindy thought was good at his role 3 years ago, but has since proven to be a bottom 6 AHLer. Then, the GM uses their network and the coach uses their network to go find assistants that align to their combined vision. But the coach's input is foremost because they have to work together on the day-to-day. It's just a hockey staff; it's not rocket surgery.

I could not agree with you more, I have said it, as have you, over and over... just firing Adams and Ruff and plucking in Jarmo and Appert isnt gonna do it... you need to go out there and find exactly what you said and pay what you need to pay to get it...  then turn it over to them...  and allow them to assess, create vision, and execute as a cohesive unit...  

[PerreaultForever]

10 hours ago, Kristian said:

At least an expansion team gets to build a roster from NHL players.

They do, and in this case you'd be bad, but it's the only way to reset the culture. You'd have a bunch of AHL vets and hacks to start but you could build the hard to play against lunch bucket type thing and then begin inserting young talent to that base, It would take years but how else are you getting out of it? EVERYTHING has to change. Bandaids and one guy here or there won't get it done. All the guys stuck in this and all the slackers have to go to make it different. 

[Trettioåtta]

5 hours ago, Pimlach said:

I like Doan but we should have guys like Doan in our farm system.   We spent time developing Peterka, and he turns out better than Quinn or Cozens, and now he is gone simply because he was smart enough to want out.   At least they got Kesselring and hopefully he really is a top 4.  

All this obsession with Adams working on the bottom 6 and 4th line is a problem.  Fix the talent on the top 6.  They overrate their young players.   They are now counting on Quinn/Benson/Kulich to emerge - that is not a sign off a playoff ready team.   

Their best forward is Thompson and he plays out of position because they don't have good centers.  Norris was a gamble that is probably going to fail.  

The next best is Tuch and he looks lost.  He is coming off his best season and has no contract.   He appears torn between his internal desire to play at home and his real knowledge of how bad of a decision that will be for his career.  

Can Zucker can play top 6 on Florida, Vegas, Avs?   No. 

Zucker is a valuable guy, a middle 6 that can move up if needed, and we need his vet savvy, but he and McLeod are 3rd line players.  

Lyon is playing well but pretty soon he will buckle under all the games, all the losing, and the pressure of playing in a rotten culture.  

Adams is over his head, but Terry likes him and trusts him.  

This just isn't true. Last season, Zucker (and McLeod) would be 4th on Florida and Vegas and 3rd in Colorado for forwards points. He/They is basically borderline 1st line player (by raw numbers).

I say this because there is often a perception that a first line palyer is 100 points, a second line player is 70 points and a third liner is 50+ and that just isn't true.

Tuch, Tage, Zucker, Norris, McLeod is genuinely 5 top 6 forwards.

Our issue is depth - Quinn, Benson, Kulich, Doan, Krebs need to step up and the whole forward group needs to player better defensively.

The Sabres have actually played pretty well for big chunks of the last 3 games. The issue is that they didn't break through, and then would often give up a goal or major chance on the counter attack and it would sap their will and momentum

[Pimlach]

1 minute ago, Trettioåtta said:

This just isn't true. Last season, Zucker (and McLeod) would be 4th on Florida and Vegas and 3rd in Colorado for forwards points. He/They is basically borderline 1st line player (by raw numbers).

I say this because there is often a perception that a first line palyer is 100 points, a second line player is 70 points and a third liner is 50+ and that just isn't true.

Tuch, Tage, Zucker, Norris, McLeod is genuinely 5 top 6 forwards.

Our issue is depth - Quinn, Benson, Kulich, Doan, Krebs need to step up and the whole forward group needs to player better defensively.

The Sabres have actually played pretty well for big chunks of the last 3 games. The issue is that they didn't break through, and then would often give up a goal or major chance on the counter attack and it would sap their will and momentum

It is all quite true to this day.   Ryan McLeod is still young and is at least top 9 and can handle a top 6 role in certain situations.  But the FACT is he was not top 6 on a Stanley Cup finals team in Edmonton.   

Zucker was top 6 in his prime years at Minnesota but was not in the recent years before coming to Buffalo.   Look at his career stats.  

Both are good hockey players that benefitted from more ice time, power play time, and playing higher in the lineup than they did on past teams. 

They can probably be top 6 on a wild card playoff team, but I specifically referenced contenders like Florida, Avs, Vegas - the top tier teams.