Do You Like The JJP for Kesselring/Doan Trade RIGHT NOW?

[OrangeSeatVertigo]

1 hour ago, Turbo44 said:

Robertson have a NMC? I don’t think so

hope not.  trading for him would work for sure

[MISabresFan]

4 hours ago, OrangeSeatVertigo said:

any "big swing" player will have a no trade clause, which means they ain't comin to WNY, so "big swings" are probably not possible

I hope I am wrong. 

I think he (KA) is done with any other "big" moves based on his track record. 

It is not in his DNA.  He made what he would consider a big trade, and he could not handle another one.  All maxed out.  He needs time to rest, grab an IV and recover.  He needs time to absorb what he just did and think about it.  Ponder, reminds me of Eeyore.  Any other moves and it will mess up his plan to do what is best to improve this team.   

It will be fun to watch the rest of the NHL during the next few months as the Sabre's fade into the sunset.  Not to be heard again but to read, they signed "x" to a two-way contract for $950,000.

Oh, and KA might have to talk to Tage about it to make sure it is ok...

Edited yesterday at 12:18 PM by MISabresFan

[JP51]

4 hours ago, OrangeSeatVertigo said:

any "big swing" player will have a no trade clause, which means they ain't comin to WNY, so "big swings" are probably not possible

Yes I know this and have said it before for sure... I think my sentiment was if they are in active shoe string mode that's bad if they are in gather money to try and take a big swing then good the difference is in the attitude not the result. Bottom line is one big hit doesn't change it all... they need consistent transformative positive change in attitude toughness and skill as well as experience

[dudacek]

Not sure if this got posted elsewhere, but Ray Ferraro had an interesting nugget in his podcast with Dreger.

Said he broadcast a game in the back end of the season where Peterka would come off of his shifts and plop down with his body positioned in such a way that he was turned away from the bench like he was checked out.

Not clear if it was aimed at coaches or teammates, just that something was broken.

His take on the trade was that the Sabres are/were getting blown up because people just don’t know the Utah players; not big names, not a big market.

He thinks Peterka is the best player in the deal but people don’t know how good Kesselring is and the Sabres did fine.

[dudacek]

I’ve started to become quite interested in what broke in the JJ/Buffalo relationship.

He previously always came across as boyish and kinda goofy; maybe not the brightest bulb in the room, but a good kid. The body language stuff that got talked about this year was real though and there was a shift in his demeanour, even as his stats and role got elevated.

I wonder now how much of the on-ice stuff I got tired of watching was cause and how much was effect?

I wonder about his relationship with his new coach and that coach’s talk about culture.

I think about the stories on how hard that coach was on Thomas Vanek and how Vanek says it was good for him and how Andrew Peters scoffs.

I think about my perception of how JJ has been put on a pedestal by this organization, how he started the year being celebrated and kinda giddy in the visit to Europe and how Adams seems to be caught by surprise on how this relationship went sideways.

This isn’t an “I’m tired of losing” thing. And I’m pretty sure it’s not a “they won’t pay me” thing. Something changed.

Gotta go back and do a rewatch of JJ’s year-ender.

Edited yesterday at 03:14 PM by dudacek

[Taro T]

33 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I’ve started to become quite interested in what broke in the JJ/Buffalo relationship.

He previously always came across as boyish and kinda goofy; maybe not the brightest bulb in the room, but a good kid. The body language stuff that got talked about this year was real though and there was a shift in his demeanour, even as his stats and role got elevated.

I wonder now how much of the on-ice stuff I got tired of watching was cause and how much was effect?

I wonder about his relationship with his new coach and that coach’s talk about culture.

I think about the stories on how hard that coach was on Thomas Vanek and how Vanek says it was good for him and how Andrew Peters scoffs.

I think about my perception of how JJ has been put on a pedestal by this organization, how he started the year being celebrated and kinda giddy in the visit to Europe and how Adams seems to be caught by surprise on how this relationship went sideways.

This isn’t an “I’m tired of losing” thing. And I’m pretty sure it’s not a “they won’t pay me” thing. Something changed.

Gotta go back and do a rewatch of JJ’s year-ender.

Interesting.

Just for context, Quinn and Peterka were the B&GI players in January of 23.  So, yeah, he wasn't always of the "get me the f out of here, now" bent.

[bob_sauve28]

51 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I’ve started to become quite interested in what broke in the JJ/Buffalo relationship.

He previously always came across as boyish and kinda goofy; maybe not the brightest bulb in the room, but a good kid. The body language stuff that got talked about this year was real though and there was a shift in his demeanour, even as his stats and role got elevated.

I wonder now how much of the on-ice stuff I got tired of watching was cause and how much was effect?

I wonder about his relationship with his new coach and that coach’s talk about culture.

I think about the stories on how hard that coach was on Thomas Vanek and how Vanek says it was good for him and how Andrew Peters scoffs.

I think about my perception of how JJ has been put on a pedestal by this organization, how he started the year being celebrated and kinda giddy in the visit to Europe and how Adams seems to be caught by surprise on how this relationship went sideways.

This isn’t an “I’m tired of losing” thing. And I’m pretty sure it’s not a “they won’t pay me” thing. Something changed.

Gotta go back and do a rewatch of JJ’s year-ender.

I think it just comes down to the "we need to be harder to play against" and not give up as many goals. 

[K-9]

5 hours ago, dudacek said:

I’ve started to become quite interested in what broke in the JJ/Buffalo relationship.

He previously always came across as boyish and kinda goofy; maybe not the brightest bulb in the room, but a good kid. The body language stuff that got talked about this year was real though and there was a shift in his demeanour, even as his stats and role got elevated.

I wonder now how much of the on-ice stuff I got tired of watching was cause and how much was effect?

I wonder about his relationship with his new coach and that coach’s talk about culture.

I think about the stories on how hard that coach was on Thomas Vanek and how Vanek says it was good for him and how Andrew Peters scoffs.

I think about my perception of how JJ has been put on a pedestal by this organization, how he started the year being celebrated and kinda giddy in the visit to Europe and how Adams seems to be caught by surprise on how this relationship went sideways.

This isn’t an “I’m tired of losing” thing. And I’m pretty sure it’s not a “they won’t pay me” thing. Something changed.

Gotta go back and do a rewatch of JJ’s year-ender.

I’m convinced he chafed against Lindy’s tough love coaching style. And I have to believe that included calling JJ out during video reviews. JJ had been coddled by Granato’s TLC approach and just wasn’t prepared for the complete 180 by Lindy. 

[Archie Lee]

16 hours ago, K-9 said:

I’m convinced he chafed against Lindy’s tough love coaching style. And I have to believe that included calling JJ out during video reviews. JJ had been coddled by Granato’s TLC approach and just wasn’t prepared for the complete 180 by Lindy. 

I personally doubt that Peterka or most modern players have great issues with tough coaching. It is a misconception in my view, that the modern star athlete has been coddled by parents and coaches through their young lives. I actually think the opposite is more likely to be true and that they have been driven hard. My best guess is that Granato said things in meetings, practices, and games, that if said to us at work would have most of us calling HR. Sometimes it’s not the message but the delivery. 

I’m not a Ruff fan. I admire what he did as a Sabre coach a generation ago.  I don’t think he is currently the right guy for this or any NHL team.  He comes across as fake tough to me. I think players see through his bluster and that there is little substance there. System and structure are just slogans and catchphrases.  

Maybe Peterka is just a chronic pouter. For now though, when it comes to the question of where the blame lies in the erosion of a relationship between the Sabres and a young player, I see no reason to give the benefit of the doubt to Pegula or Adams. I’ve seen multiple young players who didn’t  want to be here go on to better things.  I’ve yet to see Pegula and Adams do the same here. 

[Pimlach]

I think Kesserling and Doan will help the team round out the roster - but neither are proven at the roles projected for them.  
 

A scoring top 6 winger should be worth more IMO.  I hate the fact that another home grown talent like Peterka asked to leave and got his wish.   

[Pimlach]

23 hours ago, dudacek said:

I’ve started to become quite interested in what broke in the JJ/Buffalo relationship.

He previously always came across as boyish and kinda goofy; maybe not the brightest bulb in the room, but a good kid. The body language stuff that got talked about this year was real though and there was a shift in his demeanour, even as his stats and role got elevated.

I wonder now how much of the on-ice stuff I got tired of watching was cause and how much was effect?

I wonder about his relationship with his new coach and that coach’s talk about culture.

I think about the stories on how hard that coach was on Thomas Vanek and how Vanek says it was good for him and how Andrew Peters scoffs.

I think about my perception of how JJ has been put on a pedestal by this organization, how he started the year being celebrated and kinda giddy in the visit to Europe and how Adams seems to be caught by surprise on how this relationship went sideways.

This isn’t an “I’m tired of losing” thing. And I’m pretty sure it’s not a “they won’t pay me” thing. Something changed.

Gotta go back and do a rewatch of JJ’s year-ender.

I hardly noticed the body language to be honest.  

He didn’t care for Ruff, and he really should be sick of losing, and he could have hated the “solution in the room” dysfunctional speech, and maybe he was looking for another city with more to offer?  

When he changed agents that said it all. 

I think his career will take off, he defensive game will improve.  

[K-9]

3 hours ago, Archie Lee said:

I personally doubt that Peterka or most modern players have great issues with tough coaching. It is a misconception in my view, that the modern star athlete has been coddled by parents and coaches through their young lives. I actually think the opposite is more likely to be true and that they have been driven hard. My best guess is that Granato said things in meetings, practices, and games, that if said to us at work would have most of us calling HR. Sometimes it’s not the message but the delivery. 

I’m not a Ruff fan. I admire what he did as a Sabre coach a generation ago.  I don’t think he is currently the right guy for this or any NHL team.  He comes across as fake tough to me. I think players see through his bluster and that there is little substance there. System and structure are just slogans and catchphrases.  

Maybe Peterka is just a chronic pouter. For now though, when it comes to the question of where the blame lies in the erosion of a relationship between the Sabres and a young player, I see no reason to give the benefit of the doubt to Pegula or Adams. I’ve seen multiple young players who didn’t  want to be here go on to better things.  I’ve yet to see Pegula and Adams do the same here. 

I’m not giving anyone in this organization the benefit of the doubt, especially the inept front office. But where the blame lies is irrelevant, anyway. There may be a million reasons why players no longer want to be here. 

But Ruff’s coaching style is a complete 180 from whatever Peterka and others have experienced in the past. Whereas both Granato and Ruff look at mistakes as “learning opportunities” for young players, Ruff is far less patient in that regard and I suspect that as the season wore on repetitive mistakes became less teaching moments and more “get your head out of your a$$ and fix it or take a seat” moments. And Ruff has never had any compunction about calling players out in front of the team during film sessions. Mature pros can handle that better than younger players and many don’t need the coach to point out their poor play as they are usually the first to see it themselves and cry “mea culpa” in front of the group. 

We will just have to agree to disagree about this new generation of young players being able to handle criticism like generations before them. We see the difference manifest across multiple facets of modern life, not just pro sports. But that’s a discussion for another time.