Does the News keep this article as a template?

[PASabreFan]

Seriously. How many times have we read this exact same article during the Ruff Era?

 

http://www.buffalonews.com/2010/03/07/979529/sabres-seek-solution-to-scoring.html

 

By the way, Ruff again promises to "get 'em there." "I think I'm going to win this battle." After the Olympic experience of the past eight months, is this guy just going to be insufferable now?

[static70]

Just shaking my head.

Hey Lindy, how about communicating with Darcy on what this teams needs are. You just had a trade deadline for god's sake.

 

And Darcy, stop attempting to feed us fans the "build from within" line. Its obvious "THE PLAN" you've put in place sucks @ss. You should be fired for not making any moves this past deadline. Raffi Torres? Please man, I can't believe fans still buy into the weak moves this GM makes year in and year out. Now he's actually talking about a few guys from Portland ready to crack the roster. Sounds Great, but after 12 seasons with you Darcy, WHERE IS THE STANLEY CUP BANNER IN HSBC?

 

Thats what I thought. :angry:

[tom webster]

Seriously. How many times have we read this exact same article during the Ruff Era?http://www.buffalonews.com/2010/03/07/979529/sabres-seek-solution-to-scoring.html

 

By the way, Ruff again promises to "get 'em there." "I think I'm going to win this battle." After the Olympic experience of the past eight months, is this guy just going to be insufferable now?

 

 

Here is a clue.

It hasn't been printed when he actually had players that could score, it has been when he hasn't. By the way, I know its all about Lindy with you, but the problem actually started two years before, took a brief hiatus during the "Briere et al" years and has returned during the "our core is going to mature and continue to improve from within" years.

[PASabreFan]

Here is a clue.

It hasn't been printed when he actually had players that could score, it has been when he hasn't. By the way, I know its all about Lindy with you, but the problem actually started two years before, took a brief hiatus during the "Briere et al" years and has returned during the "our core is going to mature and continue to improve from within" years.

 

What you're saying is that anyone can coach scoring in the NHL -- given a perfect situation. More damning Ruff with faint praise.

 

No one's asking for an offensive juggernaut here (and some on this board, BMWolf comes to mind, would question how much of an offensive juggernaut the Sabres really were), just enough goal support for a goalie giving you a Vezina-quality season. The power play is the real killer.

 

Oh well, maybe in 15 years, all the stars will align for the offensive genius again.

[tom webster]

What you're saying is that anyone can coach scoring in the NHL -- given a perfect situation. More damning Ruff with faint praise.

 

No one's asking for an offensive juggernaut here (and some on this board, BMWolf comes to mind, would question how much of an offensive juggernaut the Sabres really were), just enough goal support for a goalie giving you a Vezina-quality season. The power play is the real killer.

 

Oh well, maybe in 15 years, all the stars will align for the offensive genius again.

 

 

The team is going to finish between 4th and 8th in the league with a line up that features one player (Vanek) that has shown in the past the capability of being a top 3 forward and a defense led by a 20 year old rookie. I'd say that's on ###### of a coaching job.

[PASabreFan]

The team is going to finish between 4th and 8th in the league with a line up that features one player (Vanek) that has shown in the past the capability of being a top 3 forward and a defense led by a 20 year old rookie. I'd say that's on ###### of a coaching job.

 

Pat, I'd like to buy a vowel.

[nfreeman]

The team is going to finish between 4th and 8th in the league with a line up that features one player (Vanek) that has shown in the past the capability of being a top 3 forward and a defense led by a 20 year old rookie. I'd say that's on ###### of a coaching job.

Boom!

[deluca67]

The team is going to finish between 4th and 8th in the league with a line up that features one player (Vanek) that has shown in the past the capability of being a top 3 forward and a defense led by a 20 year old rookie. I'd say that's on ###### of a goaltending job.

Fixed it for you.

 

It's pretty silly at this point to keep pretending it's anything other than what it is.

[static70]

The team is going to finish between 4th and 8th in the league with a line up that features one player (Vanek) that has shown in the past the capability of being a top 3 forward and a defense led by a 20 year old rookie. I'd say that's on ###### of a coaching job.

Finishing between 4th and 8th in conference.......yes. Finishing between 4th and 8th in the league...........questionable.

As for Lindy's coaching job, I would subscribe to his system, it works when the players work. But there in lay the real core of the problem with this team. Darcy Regier is completely responsible for the players performance, on a couple of levels.

 

Someone in here posted most of this roster is secondary type players, thats an affirmative. Since someone else pointed out Vanek as a top line LWer, I'll say yes he is. But thats it. You have to give to get, Darcy put this roster together, by subtraction or addition is completely irrelevant. This current roster lacks scoring depth as well as a prime contribution line. It has since Drury/Briere left. To rectify this problem, Darcy needs to come up with options that are obtainable, but in order to do so, he is going to have to give something in return, he refuses to do this.

 

Darcy could have brought in Horton/Boyes/Penner type RWer for Roy/Vanek line. Would this have given us a sustainable scoring line? Probably. Would the price have been to high? This question is an oxymoron unto itself, the price is never to high, you may have to give more to achieve consistency but pay he should have none the less. I am sick and tired of hearing sound bytes like "mortgage the future" or "askind price is to high". This is pure nonsense. You want to compete at an elevated level, you'll pay to bring the talent in to do so.

 

Its not about Lindy, it never has been, its about Darcy.

[tom webster]

Fixed it for you.

 

It's pretty silly at this point to keep pretending it's anything other than what it is.

 

 

They made a choice, build around an elite goalie. They can't get a Crosby or an Ovechkin. The goalie is part of the team. How many games has Crosby or Ovechkin singlehandedly won? Just cause you don't like the way it looks doesn't diminish the results. They are as good as all but 2 or 3 teams and can beat those teams if the stars align. Would I like them to be better? Of course but in my mind all they need to cpompete with the top 2 or 3 is a true #1 center and a #1 defenseman and there are not a lot of them around. You tell me they wouldn't be a Cup contender with;

 

Vanek - #1 center - Stafford

Torres - Connolly - Pominville

Hecht - Roy - Grier

Kennedy - Gaustad - Kaletta

 

Weber - #1 defenseman

Butler - Myers

Sekera - Montador

 

Miller

Lalime

 

Now go out and find a #1 Center and #1 defenseman and the rest of the roster looks better.

[PASabreFan]

Fixed it for you.

 

It's pretty silly at this point to keep pretending it's anything other than what it is.

Goes the dynamite!

[deluca67]

They made a choice, build around an elite goalie. They can't get a Crosby or an Ovechkin. The goalie is part of the team. How many games has Crosby or Ovechkin singlehandedly won? Just cause you don't like the way it looks doesn't diminish the results. They are as good as all but 2 or 3 teams and can beat those teams if the stars align. Would I like them to be better? Of course but in my mind all they need to cpompete with the top 2 or 3 is a true #1 center and a #1 defenseman and there are not a lot of them around. You tell me they wouldn't be a Cup contender with;

 

Vanek - #1 center - Stafford

Torres - Connolly - Pominville

Hecht - Roy - Grier

Kennedy - Gaustad - Kaletta

 

Weber - #1 defenseman

Butler - Myers

Sekera - Montador

 

Miller

Lalime

 

Now go out and find a #1 Center and #1 defenseman and the rest of the roster looks better.

Don't say they can't get a Crosby or Ovechkin when a legit 50 goal scorer like Kovi went for next to nothing. How many quality defensemen went for picks this deadline? Many better than Lydman, Rivet and Montador. Deals were there to be made that woudl have improved this team this season. Darcy and his minimalist management style has let another deadline go by without doing anything significant. He mortgaged the "now" under the guise of "looking toward the future."

[tom webster]

Don't say they can't get a Crosby or Ovechkin when a legit 50 goal scorer like Kovi went for next to nothing. How many quality defensemen went for picks this deadline? Many better than Lydman, Rivet and Montador. Deals were there to be made that woudl have improved this team this season. Darcy and his minimalist management style has let another deadline go by without doing anything significant. He mortgaged the "now" under the guise of "looking toward the future."

 

I'll give you Kovi but that would have clearly been a 2 month deal. Other then Corvo and Visnovski(who they couldn't afford) no defenseman that moved would have significantly improved this team. I want Montador as the #7 next year and Rivet gone but I didn't see anyone that moved that would have made a difference.

[nfreeman]

Don't say they can't get a Crosby or Ovechkin when a legit 50 goal scorer like Kovi went for next to nothing. How many quality defensemen went for picks this deadline? Many better than Lydman, Rivet and Montador. Deals were there to be made that woudl have improved this team this season. Darcy and his minimalist management style has let another deadline go by without doing anything significant. He mortgaged the "now" under the guise of "looking toward the future."

I'll give you Kovi but that would have clearly been a 2 month deal. Other then Corvo and Visnovski(who they couldn't afford) no defenseman that moved would have significantly improved this team. I want Montador as the #7 next year and Rivet gone but I didn't see anyone that moved that would have made a difference.

BTW, NJ is now 3-6 since trading for Kovy (and they really should be 2-7 since they beat the Leafs with 3 goals in the last 3 minutes in Kovy's 1st game).

 

And Kovy didn't go for "next to nothing." He went for a package (top 4 defenseman, top 9 scoring winger, top prospect and #1 pick) that 60% of poll respondents on this board (ie knowledgeable hockey fans) felt was too high for the Sabres to have paid. If you want to make a point, make it accurately.

 

Phaneuf was the guy who went for next to nothing -- so if you want to criticize the Sabres for not getting into the mix on a potential impact player (albeit one with plenty of question marks), he's the one. Of course, the Leafs are also 3-6 since that trade (although that really doesn't represent a change from their pre-trade record).

[deluca67]

I'll give you Kovi but that would have clearly been a 2 month deal. Other then Corvo and Visnovski(who they couldn't afford) no defenseman that moved would have significantly improved this team. I want Montador as the #7 next year and Rivet gone but I didn't see anyone that moved that would have made a difference.

One of the Sabres three more reliable defensmen this season is currently benched. To say the Sabres couldn't "significantly improved" their defense at the deadline is ridiculous. I'll take a Andy Sutton or Aaron Ward over Rivet and Montador. Leopold, Seidenberg and Derek Morris are also better. I would have even liked to a have Schneider or Yelle. That's seven defensmen that easily improve this teams defense.

 

With Butler benched and Myers starting to look more like a rookie each game this defense is actually getting worse. Considering it was less than stellar to begin with is a major cause for concern. I don't know what is worse. Regier's failure to be able to read the free agent or trade markets? Or his inability to read his own team. I wonder if he would be better at it if he had anyone to hold him accountable.

[PASabreFan]

BTW, NJ is now 3-6 since trading for Kovy (and they really should be 2-7 since they beat the Leafs with 3 goals in the last 3 minutes in Kovy's 1st game).

 

And Kovy didn't go for "next to nothing." He went for a package (top 4 defenseman, top 9 scoring winger, top prospect and #1 pick) that 60% of poll respondents on this board (ie knowledgeable hockey fans) felt was too high for the Sabres to have paid. If you want to make a point, make it accurately.

 

Phaneuf was the guy who went for next to nothing -- so if you want to criticize the Sabres for not getting into the mix on a potential impact player (albeit one with plenty of question marks), he's the one. Of course, the Leafs are also 3-6 since that trade (although that really doesn't represent a change from their pre-trade record).

 

Easy there.

[inkman]

They made a choice, build around an elite goalie.

This reminds me of all the talk about the Sabres building their team for the "new NHL". They lucked their way into that and right now they are just a team riding a hot goalie. No intentions were there in either case.

 

Don't say they can't get a Crosby or Ovechkin when a legit 50 goal scorer like Kovi went for next to nothing.

Please don't mention those 3 in the same sentence. Kovolchuk has proved nothing in the NHL other than scoring goals as a floater.

 

And Kovy didn't go for "next to nothing." He went for a package (top 4 defenseman, top 9 scoring winger, top prospect and #1 pick) that 60% of poll respondents on this board (ie knowledgeable hockey fans) felt was too high for the Sabres to have paid. If you want to make a point, make it accurately.

As little as I care for Kovolchuk, I would have ponied up any Sabres forward/defenseman combo along with picks just to take a shot. At the very least, it would have shaken up the ranks.

[deluca67]

BTW, NJ is now 3-6 since trading for Kovy (and they really should be 2-7 since they beat the Leafs with 3 goals in the last 3 minutes in Kovy's 1st game).

 

And Kovy didn't go for "next to nothing." He went for a package (top 4 defenseman, top 9 scoring winger, top prospect and #1 pick) that 60% of poll respondents on this board (ie knowledgeable hockey fans) felt was too high for the Sabres to have paid. If you want to make a point, make it accurately.

 

Phaneuf was the guy who went for next to nothing -- so if you want to criticize the Sabres for not getting into the mix on a potential impact player (albeit one with plenty of question marks), he's the one. Of course, the Leafs are also 3-6 since that trade (although that really doesn't represent a change from their pre-trade record).

New Jersey's record since the trade is pointless. I can live with a Kolvachuk trade not working out. Having a General Manager too afraid to even consider it is inexcusable. Oduya is a good blueliner. Are we now describing third liners as "top nine?" If he were a fourth liner would you say he was a "top 12" winger to try to make him sound better? A prospect and a 1st round pick. All of that for a 50 goal scorer and message sent to your team and fans that the goal is the Stanley Cup. The Sabres could have easily sent a better package to Atlanta and not have destroy the team for years to come. Every team has prospects and the NHL gives you a 1st round pick every season. So what are we talking here? Butler and Stafford? For Kolvachuk? I'll make that deal any day of the week. Darcy proved again he is a small time GM.

[deluca67]

Easy there.

Should I have pointed out the irony that those same "knowledgeable" hockey fans thought Montador was a top four defenseman? Some even thought that Clarke MacArthur was a top six forward. :doh:

[nfreeman]

New Jersey's record since the trade is pointless. I can live with a Kolvachuk trade not working out. Having a General Manager too afraid to even consider it is inexcusable. Oduya is a good blueliner. Are we now describing third liners as "top nine?" If he were a fourth liner would you say he was a "top 12" winger to try to make him sound better? A prospect and a 1st round pick. All of that for a 50 goal scorer and message sent to your team and fans that the goal is the Stanley Cup. The Sabres could have easily sent a better package to Atlanta and not have destroy the team for years to come. Every team has prospects and the NHL gives you a 1st round pick every season. So what are we talking here? Butler and Stafford? For Kolvachuk? I'll make that deal any day of the week. Darcy proved again he is a small time GM.

Why is NJ's record pointless? Isn't the point of a trade to improve a team? Didn't 28 other GMs also consider that price to be too high? And it wasn't trading that package "for Kovalchuk." It was trading that package for 20 games of Kovy plus playoffs -- which, the way NJ is playing right now could easily be one-and-done.

 

A good GM doesn't make big trades to send messages to the fans. Check Montreal, the Rangers, the Leafs and the Flames to see how well that works.

 

Should I have pointed out the irony that those same "knowledgeable" hockey fans thought Montador was a top four defenseman? Some even thought that Clarke MacArthur was a top six forward. :doh:

Careful. Should we go back and exhume some of your observations over the years to see how well they panned out?

[NowDoYouBelieve]

New Jersey's record since the trade is pointless. I can live with a Kolvachuk trade not working out. Having a General Manager too afraid to even consider it is inexcusable. Oduya is a good blueliner. Are we now describing third liners as "top nine?" If he were a fourth liner would you say he was a "top 12" winger to try to make him sound better? A prospect and a 1st round pick. All of that for a 50 goal scorer and message sent to your team and fans that the goal is the Stanley Cup. The Sabres could have easily sent a better package to Atlanta and not have destroy the team for years to come. Every team has prospects and the NHL gives you a 1st round pick every season. So what are we talking here? Butler and Stafford? For Kolvachuk? I'll make that deal any day of the week. Darcy proved again he is a small time GM.

 

The record is everything but pointless. Results are the measure of a trade, not the "message". That's just a truism.

 

If you want to argue that 9 games is too small a sample size to judge, that's fine. But the record isn't pointless.

 

I estimate that you'd be trying to have Darcy torn apart by wild horses if he made this trade and the team started slipping because of it.

[deluca67]

Why is NJ's record pointless? Isn't the point of a trade to improve a team? Didn't 28 other GMs also consider that price to be too high? And it wasn't trading that package "for Kovalchuk." It was trading that package for 20 games of Kovy plus playoffs -- which, the way NJ is playing right now could easily be one-and-done.

 

A good GM doesn't make big trades to send messages to the fans. Check Montreal, the Rangers, the Leafs and the Flames to see how well that works.

What a Regier like response. First off, NO, 28 teams didn't seem the price was too high. Many teams including the Sens made a serious push for Kovalchuk. Even if they did think the price was too high at least they made the call. Regier never picked up the phone so how would he know what the price was? My biggest problem wasn't that Sabres didn't get Kolvachuk it's that they never even considered it. That is the real failure of this front office. Failing to explore all options to improve this team. It's inexcusable.

 

It may turn out that both the Sabres and Devils don't win the Stanley Cup. If I were a Devils fan I can look at the team and least feel that as a organization they gave it a good run. They went and got the best player available at this years deadline. What do the Sabres get? A lecture on how you don't make big moves in season you make them over the summer. Regier says that like there is a chance in ###### he will make any significant move this summer. What were his big moves this past summer? Grier? Montador? Class D free agents? Regier is a minimalist small time GM that will never get a sniff at a Stanley Cup other than the one Hasek carried him to.

[NowDoYouBelieve]

What a Regier like response. First off, NO, 28 teams didn't seem the price was too high. Many teams including the Sens made a serious push for Kovalchuk. Even if they did think the price was too high at least they made the call. Regier never picked up the phone so how would he know what the price was? My biggest problem wasn't that Sabres didn't get Kolvachuk it's that they never even considered it. That is the real failure of this front office. Failing to explore all options to improve this team. It's inexcusable.

 

It may turn out that both the Sabres and Devils don't win the Stanley Cup. If I were a Devils fan I can look at the team and least feel that as a organization they gave it a good run. They went and got the best player available at this years deadline. What do the Sabres get? A lecture on how you don't make big moves in season you make them over the summer. Regier says that like there is a chance in ###### he will make any significant move this summer. What were his big moves this past summer? Grier? Montador? Class D free agents? Regier is a minimalist small time GM that will never get a sniff at a Stanley Cup other than the one Hasek carried him to.

 

I disagree. I say they make the Finals this year.

[nfreeman]

What a Regier like response. First off, NO, 28 teams didn't seem the price was too high. Many teams including the Sens made a serious push for Kovalchuk. Even if they did think the price was too high at least they made the call. Regier never picked up the phone so how would he know what the price was? My biggest problem wasn't that Sabres didn't get Kolvachuk it's that they never even considered it. That is the real failure of this front office. Failing to explore all options to improve this team. It's inexcusable.

 

It may turn out that both the Sabres and Devils don't win the Stanley Cup. If I were a Devils fan I can look at the team and least feel that as a organization they gave it a good run. They went and got the best player available at this years deadline. What do the Sabres get? A lecture on how you don't make big moves in season you make them over the summer. Regier says that like there is a chance in ###### he will make any significant move this summer. What were his big moves this past summer? Grier? Montador? Class D free agents? Regier is a minimalist small time GM that will never get a sniff at a Stanley Cup other than the one Hasek carried him to.

 

1. 28 teams absolutely thought the price was too high, regardless of how many teams actually called to inquire. And do you think Detroit called? San Jose? Chicago?

 

2. Regarding the teams like the Sabres who didn't call about Kovy -- do you think it's possible that they evaluated Kovy and thought he wouldn't be a good fit for their team and accordingly weren't interested in giving up a roster player, a top prospect and a #1 pick for him, which is the minimum it would have cost (and this was well known before picking up the phone)? Do you think it's possible that this is the correct hockey decision? Remember -- we're talking about a guy with zero career playoff wins.

 

3. If the Sabres make it to the 2nd round and NJ gets bounced (again) in the 1st round -- will NJ have made the right move? Will their fans be happy when Kovy is in L.A., there is no #1 pick in the spring (to either pick with or trade with), no top prospect to make the team next year and no Oduya on D?

 

4. Look around the NHL and tell me which consistently good teams make big, splashy moves. Chicago has turned into a great team by being crappy for years and drafting high. They've grown to regret their splashy move (a $50MM redheaded defenseman). Detroit's nucleus is all home-grown. Same with Pittsburgh and Washington. NJ made the trade for Kovy, which was well out of character for them, and so far it's not working.

 

5. Just so we're clear, I'd like to see more from Darcy too. The team is dying for a #1 center. But I have no problem with sitting out the Kovy sweepstakes, and I (like many hockey writers) like his moves at the deadline this year.

[static70]

Why is NJ's record pointless? Isn't the point of a trade to improve a team? Didn't 28 other GMs also consider that price to be too high? And it wasn't trading that package "for Kovalchuk." It was trading that package for 20 games of Kovy plus playoffs -- which, the way NJ is playing right now could easily be one-and-done.

 

A good GM doesn't make big trades to send messages to the fans. Check Montreal, the Rangers, the Leafs and the Flames to see how well that works.

 

 

Careful. Should we go back and exhume some of your observations over the years to see how well they panned out?

Why is NJ's record pointless? I'll tell you why, the New Jersey Devils "ARE NOT" the Buffalo Sabres. Kovalchuk would have improved the Buffalo Sabres more so than the NJ Devils. In case you haven't noticed the Devils already had 3 offensive players at the 50 point mark. There offense is more "consistent" then Buffalo's, thats why they have been the better defensive team out of the 2.

 

Kovalchuk was worth the rental to bring in additional firepower on the offense. And I'm sure come playoff time, he won't dissappoint. As for Buffalo, ya, they should have landed him, if not him, than Darcy should have pitched for Boyes/Sharp/Penner/Horton and the list can go on, but the point is there for all to see. Raffi Torres? Come on man, this is another one of Darcy's "MINOR MOVES" that was more to get something for Paetsch, but not really. Its for the fans, and this time, from what I can see at the games, speaking with fans and countless forums, the fans aren't biting this season.