Thorny

It’s possible - he was certainly well above mid-pack in the sv% rankings in 3/5 seasons, but I didn’t add up each sv% of all the goalies and average it. As far as I know for skaters when comparing points we’re always listing their ranks among their peers (was top 30 in scoring, etc) and not adding up league points and averaging it out. Technically it’s median but that’s the number id want to use anyways

Tage Skinner Eichel and Pominville?

Like I said, he’s not getting moved for a 2nd. We don’t have to like their price or pay it, but the proposals being suggested were never in the ballpark

You still didn’t explain which 3 seasons are below league average for sv% for goalies who started 25 games - I checked and 3 of the 5 are above average, not below

Yup. Even including all teams only Coyotes get added as a team that’s waited longer. Jets arguable but certainly not a continuous drought as you aren’t “waiting” if you don’t have a team

You know what they say, once you drive the new mystery box off the lot... wait, you guys have me mixing metaphors now Wait, I thought you said 13 for Helle was good

This somehow makes the Sabres playoff drought worse. 17 of these teams have made the *final* since the Sabres last played a playoff game, more than half the league absurd

Ya I mean I could be wrong. Somewhat ironically I was just re-reading your other post again as you sent that, because it had been playing around in my mind when I was at the Dentist. It’s arguments you made therein that sorta informs my thinking on why Hart should/will cost: its the games played. He played over 50 last season. That’s a proven model. We can parse numbers all day, and Hart’s sv% was 40th whatever when looking at every goalie that suited on pads last season, but he was *15th among guys that actually... were good cars*. Guys that we know can put up with the mileage. Guys that can hang with the mileage is what you are paying for. Comries are easily had because you have to guess and extrapolate their numbers. What happened when more was wanted from him? Imo there’s sorta a conflation going in and out of frame in real time in various posts along this thread, there are average/mediocre outputs, and then there are average/mediocre outputs within the confines of a starters workload We aren’t allowed to care about the 23-24 Sabres, specifically We are only renting that year of our lives from God

This is such a good post

I’m much more interested in the speculated Hellebuyck proposals, to be fair I like the valuations there, by way of the Sabres, much better

So, switch places in rd 1 and they convert a 3rd into a 2nd? IMO won’t be enough

How did you determine his sv% was below average this season? I have him at 31 / 79 for goalies playing at least 10 games 19th out of 42 playing at least 30 He ranked 15th among goalies with a starters workload, 41 games. Considering his expected goals against ranked him 15th as well, I’d say ~ 15th for this past year seems about fair I mean.. he ranked 44th out of 107 when you include all goalies to suit up for even a moment, which includes a list littered with guys like “Matthew Berlin”, who faced 1 shot and made 1 save

I dunno, there might be a lot of value in a guy looking to secure said future, rather than a guy who knows he doesn’t have one. Hart is playing for $$$ we know we likely won’t feel pressured into giving him. But he knows someone else would

Smells like what, Martin Short?

This trade was my first big “what? We lose our best players?” experience as a kid. Mogilny was my favourite player. Don’t think I know this without looking it up, though was the draft pick Jason Dawe? Philip Boucher? For the players, Peca and.... Wilson? Edit: Damn, wrong.

Take out LA’s 2nd and it’s getting closer I could see them going for Rousek, a 2nd, and 9 spots in Rd1 for Hart, if it’s an exceptionally dry market and they really are shopping him and not just “listening” as they said

I’m good with that being “more than enough” if everyone is good with a run back of what we have in net They may be the ones selling off the “mediocrity”, we are the ones falling well short of that, with what we have currently

OG Kush

Make no mistake, they are laughing at some of our “proposals”, too as far as I can decipher, the only largely common denominator I can glean is that we need to give up assets we don’t care about losing. Which is of course how trades work: you get good stuff and give up your garbage to get it.

Oh, it’s not a prospect we don’t care about, a roster player we don’t care about, and a 5th round pick? There must be some mistake

Winnipegers are notorious for this

But you said Rosen is a comparable in value, for you, and you think he’s worth at least a 1st. Considering the Flyers are reportedly not shopping Hart, if their evaluation lines up with yours I’d imagine they’d also have the barometer at at least a first. Is the implication of your last sentence that Hart is just more of the same to what we have in UPL and Comrie or am I misreading that

What about the 3 bad years thing you said

I think this is still too low but, going with it, is Rosen still worth the first round pick we used to get him? Or would you deal him for a 2nd, a UPL ish goalie? What about if they REALLY wanted to get your attention, by throwing in a 6th round pick, not this draft, but the next. How bout now?

4 of his 5 seasons, as a developing G trying to break into the league, behind a bad team, are at a .905 sv% or ABOVE. .917, .914, .877, .905, .907 Isnt the .877 the outlier? ...I know mystery box thinking is a big thing but I didn’t think it was THIS prevalent. Is the secret just.. not playing? Hart, as a young man, playing really pretty well tanks his value, because if he simply failed to seize a starting role in a decade, he’d be an “unknown” like Comrie with sky high potential retained? It’s just Schrödinger's cat, where we assume the unknown is best case scenario and punish and documented results that aren’t that “Peter Parker. Brilliant...but lazy.”