Defenseman Lawrence Pilut has been called up to Sabres

[RochesterExpat]

1 hour ago, Thorny said:

Fitzgerald suiting up/making the team ahead of Pilut I think says something about how they feel about handedness on D, save Dahlin 

It says more about how they feel about the waiver system and Pilut being waivers exempt.

[Thorny]

9 minutes ago, RochesterExpat said:

It says more about how they feel about the waiver system and Pilut being waivers exempt.

Have to agree, probably wrong to suggest that handedness factored into this particular decision. @Taro Tmade the point, my asking for confirmation thing wasn't snark, I thought maybe there was a quote somewhere about "we need to consider waiver status" or something like that. Obviously not a direct indictment of someone's play on file. 

- - - 

But the biggest factor is still talent analysis. They've been sleeping on Pilut forever, imo - if they felt he was clearly one of their 6 best d-men, he'd be playing. Like clear separation. I feel like you can only default to waiver status over fielding the best team if they didn't actually see much of a gap between Pilut and the Fitzgeralds and Brysons of the world 

They weren't sending a guy down they thought was significantly better. I did/do

Hope to see him make the most of this chance 

Edited October 21, 2022 by Thorny

[SABRES 0311]

11 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

 

I think he broke bones in his face honestly. 

Yeah when he went down it was weird. He was motionless but looked conscious. Like he was afraid to move or in shock.

[Doohickie]

9 hours ago, Thorny said:

Fitzgerald suiting up/making the team ahead of Pilut I think says something about how they feel about handedness on D, save Dahlin 

Fitzgerald is not waiver exempt like Pilut is.  I think that's all there is to it.

[Thorny]

8 hours ago, Taro T said:

Fitzgerald suited up because there was no room to pull up Pilut without waiving someone and didn't get sent down because he (& Bryson too) needed to clear waivers to be sent down but Pilut doesn't this year.

Haven't heard Jokiharju is on IR, but expect he is & he's out until the Chicago game.  (Has to be on IR 7 days from the date of the injury.)  Either that, or Quinn or Sheahan is on a plane back east right now.

We will not see eye to eye on the handedness discussion.  IF Lyubushkin can go tomorrow, we'll get a glimpse at Granato's thoughts on it.  If not, let the discussion rage on.

 

7 hours ago, RochesterExpat said:

It says more about how they feel about the waiver system and Pilut being waivers exempt.

 

3 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

Fitzgerald is not waiver exempt like Pilut is.  I think that's all there is to it.

I’ve been thinking, do you think maybe it had something to do with the waiver system? Just a shot in the dark 

[Doohickie]

7 hours ago, Thorny said:

They weren't sending a guy down they thought was significantly better. I did/do

So in this statement I think you're saying that 1. Adams and Granato don't understand how good Pilut is, but that 2. You do?  That's rich.

 

Just now, Thorny said:

I’ve been thinking, do you think maybe it had something to do with the waiver system? Just a shot in the dark 

I didn't realize there was a Page 2 when I posted that.

[Thorny]

7 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

So in this statement I think you're saying that 1. Adams and Granato don't understand how good Pilut is, but that 2. You do?  That's rich.

 

I didn't realize there was a Page 2 when I posted that.

Lol.

Have I set a Guinness world record for being the first person to ever disagree with their team on a player? Give me a break haha 

If we cant disagree with the team’s evaluation of a player and we need to default to “they must know better” (even though they usually do) then what are we even doing here? There would by default be no basis for questioning anything. 

Come on, man. Like seriously. 

- - - 

Oh and as for the “didn’t see the second page” thing you said, I was just joking around 

Edited October 22, 2022 by Thorny

[Doohickie]

I think Adams/Granato see the same thing you see.  It really did just come down to waiver eligibility at the start of the season.  And it was obvious who the first D callup would be.  His return is actually a blessing for the team; he adds the depth of a seasoned defenseman that is waiver exempt.  They can shuttle him between the teams all season long.

[Thorny]

9 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

I think Adams/Granato see the same thing you see.  It really did just come down to waiver eligibility at the start of the season.  And it was obvious who the first D callup would be.  His return is actually a blessing for the team; he adds the depth of a seasoned defenseman that is waiver exempt.  They can shuttle him between the teams all season long.

I do not believe they think Pilut is significantly better than Bryson and Fitzgerald. You think they think Pilut is significantly better? That they started the D man they believe to be 4th or 5th (at worst 6th, depending on if HJ gets his game back) on the depth chart, as I do, in Rochester due to waiver concerns?

If they think that, yes, we are in the same place. 

Everyone saying the deciding factor was waiver concerns is I believe correct. But that’s a deciding factor between players they view rather closely. 

My initial post had nothing to do with our potentially differing views of Pilut, though. It was about handedness being a factor in the decision and I now believe that to be wrong, that in this case it wasn’t. 

But no, I don’t think waiver status trumped even talent evaluation as a deciding factor. Not if the talent variable presented a significant difference 

Edited October 22, 2022 by Thorny

[Doohickie]

4 minutes ago, Thorny said:

I do not believe they think Pilut is significantly better than Bryson and Fitzgerald. You think they think Pilut is significantly better? That they started the D man they believe to be 4th, or at worst 5th on the depth chart, in Rochester due to waiver concerns?

I think they know what you know:  That Pilut is better than Bryson and Fitz. 

I think they started him in Rochester anyway based primarily on the fact that he's waiver exempt.  A secondary reason is they wanted him to readjust to the smaller NA ice surface.

Depending on how long Joki is out (pretty sure this is due to Joki's injury and not Boosh's), Pilut may very well seize the opportunity and become one of the top 6, which probably means Fitzgerald is waived and assigned to Rochester (or if he's claimed, meh) and Bryson will be the 7D but will frequently rotate in to give other defensemen rest/maintenance.

[Thorny]

1 minute ago, Doohickie said:

I think they know what you know:  That Pilut is better than Bryson and Fitz. 

I think they started him in Rochester anyway based primarily on the fact that he's waiver exempt.  A secondary reason is they wanted him to readjust to the smaller NA ice surface.

Depending on how long Joki is out (pretty sure this is due to Joki's injury and not Boosh's), Pilut may very well seize the opportunity and become one of the top 6, which probably means Fitzgerald is waived and assigned to Rochester (or if he's claimed, meh) and Bryson will be the 7D but will frequently rotate in to give other defensemen rest/maintenance.

Maybe Fitzgerald? I honestly don’t get that sense with Bryson, even a little bit.

If they do think Pilut is better than the lot: great. Means I’m not just whistling dixie on Pilut’s future 

[Doohickie]

4 minutes ago, Thorny said:

If they do think Pilut is better than the lot: great. Means I’m not just whistling dixie on Pilut’s future 

I think we all agree that Pilut is a solid NHL level player.  The disagreement we've had in this thread is that you don't think that Adams/Granato think he's that good.

[Thorny]

25 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

I think we all agree that Pilut is a solid NHL level player.  The disagreement we've had in this thread is that you don't think that Adams/Granato think he's that good.

But this isn’t what I have said. You are just inventing an argument, no offence.

They brought him over to the Sabres, they obviously think he’s reasonably good/can play for them in the NHL. I just think I have a higher ranking of him on the depth chart than they do. I think they think he’s about as good as Bryson and Fitz

Sorry, is there any player you believe you view somewhat differently than Adams? Do you line up with his evaluations across the board - everything he does you just think, ‘damn, he read my mind!”? Actually asking. 

If me and Kevyn Adams disagree on Pilut, he is, very very likely, the one who is correct. But, no, I do not think GMs are so infallible that the mere act of taking a different position than them is absurd.

- - - 

If you think KA DOES think Pilut is better than them, as I already said - cooll! I think he’s thinking differently, that’s totally fine. I’m certainly not saying I think they have a low opinion of Pilut 

Edited October 22, 2022 by Thorny

[Doohickie]

6 hours ago, Thorny said:

I think they think he’s about as good as Bryson and Fitz

And that's the argument.  I don't agree; I think they know he's better also.  But he's waiver eligible and they wanted to give him a few games in the A.

[Taro T]

8 hours ago, Doohickie said:

I think they know what you know:  That Pilut is better than Bryson and Fitz. 

I think they started him in Rochester anyway based primarily on the fact that he's waiver exempt.  A secondary reason is they wanted him to readjust to the smaller NA ice surface.

Depending on how long Joki is out (pretty sure this is due to Joki's injury and not Boosh's), Pilut may very well seize the opportunity and become one of the top 6, which probably means Fitzgerald is waived and assigned to Rochester (or if he's claimed, meh) and Bryson will be the 7D but will frequently rotate in to give other defensemen rest/maintenance.

Could be.  But, should the F's all be healthy when that point is reached, expect there is a better chance Sheahan is the player they risk sending down or they go off the board and send 1 of the 3 kids down.  There are logistical reasons for why most teams carry 8 D-men rather than 7 in most situations.  

And agree w/ @Thorny that Granato and Adams likely see what we see, that Pilut is better than the official 6 & 7; but that he didn't outplay them convincingly enough to keep from being sent down when keeping him up could've meant they headed out west w/ only 12 healthy F's or would've meant a real possibility of losing their 8th best D-man to waivers when the top 8 are all head & shoulders better than #9.

Believe they don't want to give Fitzgerald away for free and expect waiving him would make that the very likely result.  With Bryson's contract being slightly expensive for a 6 and him being on a 1 way deal would not be shocked to see him to get waived before Fitzgerald; though really don't see either getting waived should they find themselves at 24 healthy players as both have a real risk of getting claimed.