So, Connolly has a broken rib...

[Bmwolf21]

I just can't fathom it is genetics... Afterall, he made it this far.

I never saw him play at the lower levels - and honestly, until the Sabres traded for him I would't have known the difference between him and Kevin Connolly of Entourage fame - but is it possible that Tim didn't take that many hits in the lower levels because of his skating and stick-handling abilities? I mean for some guys playing in juniors and whatnot - they are really men playing among boys.

[ExiledInIllinois]

What I am also saying is the rest of the league knows that if you pound TC, he won't come back. Now they may take that approcah with others to less avail... They can't keep on doing it because their team will get hurt if the guy isn't taken out... TC gets taken out... He then comes back... The pounding and hits get worse and worse... He can't be given the benefit of doubt by the other team because they keep seeing that TC is getting knocked out... The hitting game agianst TC becomes escalated... ANd this is in stark contrast in what other players go through.

 

And no... I don't blame the league... And the tactics... It is historically why you have fights and enforcers... This is one reason I am against the instigator rule (even know I don't like Prima Donna Gretzky types)... The game should be policed by itself... It is the only way to protect a player like TC that finds himself in this situation of escalating aggression... IMO, the rules now will ride these players (TC's) out of the game... He has no fighting chance to stem the tide of escalating aggression against him. Other teams know it and will always rub him out.

 

He may have to hang them up??... The league bested him.

[ExiledInIllinois]

I never saw him play at the lower levels - and honestly, until the Sabres traded for him I would't have known the difference between him and Kevin Connolly of MTV fame - but is it possible that Tim didn't take that many hits in the lower levels because of his skating and stick-handling abilities? I mean for some guys playing in juniors and whatnot - they are really men playing among boys.

 

Maybe.

 

Read my post above.

 

What was the main reason the Semanko's and McSorley's of the world skated?... To protect their flashy stars. True Gretzky never really got pounded or hurt... Imagine if he did? All hell would break loose. WG enjoyed a nice long career... Could he today? We don't know??

 

Other flashy greats of the past could have equally fell into the problem that TC is having.

 

Why was Mario Lemieux sometimes considered to have been equally as great as Gretzky if he had only played in an era slightly before his?

 

No?

[ExiledInIllinois]

This from Wiki on Mario:

 

Playing only 915 out of a potential 1428 regular season NHL games, Lemieux's career was plagued by health issues. His numerous ailments included spinal disc herniation, Hodgkin's lymphoma, chronic tendinitis of a hip-flexor muscle, and chronic back pain so severe that other people had to tie his skates.

 

He has retired twice because of his health: first in 1997 after battling lymphoma (he returned in 2000), and for a second and final time after being diagnosed with an atrial fibrillation.

 

Orr, along with Bryan Trottier, and numerous fans,[1] speculate that had Lemieux not suffered so many injuries, his on-ice achievements would have been much greater.

 

I would think that Wayne greatly benefitted from the era he played in.

[Bmwolf21]

Maybe.

 

Read my post above.

 

What was the main reason the Semanko's and McSorley's of the world skated?... To protect their flashy stars. True Gretzky never really got pounded or hurt... Imagine if he did? All hell would break loose. WG enjoyed a nice long career... Could he today? We don't know??

 

Other flashy greats of the past could have equally fell into the problem that TC is having.

 

Why was Mario Lemieux sometimes considered to have been equally as great as Gretzky if he had only played in an era slightly before his?

 

No?

I don't know...I think he's just not physically able to handle the pounding. No shame in it, he's not the first athlete to be injury-prone, but who knows where his conditioning is, given all the time he's spent on the sidelines the last few years? Maybe he's gotten into a catch-22 situation where he needs to get in better shape, add more muscle, whatever, but he can't because he's always rehabbing some injury or unable to practice/workout because of soreness. I don't know.

 

I don't know if I can even get into a serious discussion about the changes in the physical play and whether Wayne would be pounded today. The league is not as goon-ish as it used to be, the instigator rule has changed things, and the players today are bigger and faster than they were in the past - even going back to when Mario was in his heyday, and definitely bigger and faster than in Wayne's day.

[Bmwolf21]

I would think that Wayne greatly benefitted from the era he played in.

He absolutely did. And we're not even getting into how bad the goalies were back then.

[DR HOLLIDAY]

This from Wiki on Mario:

 

Playing only 915 out of a potential 1428 regular season NHL games, Lemieux's career was plagued by health issues. His numerous ailments included spinal disc herniation, Hodgkin's lymphoma, chronic tendinitis of a hip-flexor muscle, and chronic back pain so severe that other people had to tie his skates.

 

He has retired twice because of his health: first in 1997 after battling lymphoma (he returned in 2000), and for a second and final time after being diagnosed with an atrial fibrillation.

 

Orr, along with Bryan Trottier, and numerous fans,[1] speculate that had Lemieux not suffered so many injuries, his on-ice achievements would have been much greater.

I would think that Wayne greatly benefitted from the era he played in.

 

That and the extra set of eyes he had in the back of his head........... :beer:

[Bmwolf21]

That and the extra set of eyes he had in the back of his head........... :beer:

I don't want to anyone to think I am taking anything away from Wayne, because he was the best at reading the play and anticipating where the puck would go and where the play was going, and he could thread a pass through traffic like no one's business.

[ExiledInIllinois]

That and the extra set of eyes he had in the back of his head........... :beer:

 

Ya... Dave and Marty...

 

<_< <_<

 

Marty Tells His Side Of the Story

 

"Now more and more you see stars trying to protect themselves," he said.

 

"You've seen it recently with incidents involving (Scott) Niedermayer, (Paul) Kariya, (Alexei) Zhitnik and Rob Blake. If Dave Semenko had the restrictions on him there are now, it would have made life a lot tougher for Wayne Gretzky. The enforcer's job is to keep stars healthy and focussed on the finesse part of the game.

 

"Maybe the enforcer's role will be obsolete, but only when second- and third-line players raise the level of their game to that of first liners instead of hooking, holding and taking liberties.

 

 

I also refuse to put the game on trail... It is what it is!

[ExiledInIllinois]

I don't want to anyone to think I am taking anything away from Wayne, because he was the best at reading the play and anticipating where the puck would go and where the play was going, and he could thread a pass through traffic like no one's business.

 

Want to talk about Toyota engines vs. Domestic products... ;) ;)

 

Amzaing how people just see it one way as TC's problem.

 

And it is amazing how people see it as all Wayne's inherent ability... If Wayne played to today... He would be great... But, he would be paying for it every time he hit the sheets to sleep at night.

 

No if ands and buts about it.

[deluca67]

Do you believe "toughness" can prevent a player from being injured? Are there ribs that are protected by this quality of "toughness." More important, when a player is "weak," or lacks "courage," or "sack," does it make injuries more likely?

Yes and Yes.

 

Players who are used to physical contact know how to take a hit and how to deliver a hit. They have a completely different feel for the game. Connolly being basically a figure skater in a hockey uniform is oblivious to the physical side of the game. He continually puts himself in harms way.

[ExiledInIllinois]

Yes and Yes.

 

Players who are used to physical contact know how to take a hit and how to deliver a hit. They have a completely different feel for the game. Connolly being basically a figure skater in a hockey uniform is oblivious to the physical side of the game. He continually puts himself in harms way.

 

I tend to agree.

 

Do you think there is more of a burden on the flashy skaters in this era of NHL hockey than other eras?

[Claude Balls]

This from Wiki on Mario:

 

Playing only 915 out of a potential 1428 regular season NHL games, Lemieux's career was plagued by health issues. His numerous ailments included spinal disc herniation, Hodgkin's lymphoma, chronic tendinitis of a hip-flexor muscle, and chronic back pain so severe that other people had to tie his skates.

 

He has retired twice because of his health: first in 1997 after battling lymphoma (he returned in 2000), and for a second and final time after being diagnosed with an atrial fibrillation.

 

Orr, along with Bryan Trottier, and numerous fans,[1] speculate that had Lemieux not suffered so many injuries, his on-ice achievements would have been much greater.

 

I would think that Wayne greatly benefitted from the era he played in.

Injuries???? Since when did Hodgkin's lymphoma and atrial fibrillation become injuries? They are conditions that had nothing to do with hockey. Orr and Trottier are morons. He would have played many more games and may have even played a few more years if it weren't for those two conditions.

[deluca67]

I tend to agree.

 

Do you think there is more of a burden on the flashy skaters in this era of NHL hockey than other eras?

Players like Connolly have to be more responsible when they are on the ice. I think players from other eras were more prepared for the physical aspect of the game. This could all go back to the Islanders throwing Connolly in too soon. Maybe if he had spent a few years grinding it out in the AHL he would be more mentally prepared for the physical game.

[JoeFerguson]

Yes and Yes.

 

Players who are used to physical contact know how to take a hit and how to deliver a hit. They have a completely different feel for the game. Connolly being basically a figure skater in a hockey uniform is oblivious to the physical side of the game. He continually puts himself in harms way.

 

I agree and I don't think it requires further explanation. He just doesn't have that sense of self-preservation that you need to survive in the league. I think if you were to watch all the videos of Connolly taking hits that have led to serious injuries you would easily be able to see that the dude doesn't pay attention to where he is skating. A normal person would have figured it out the first time he was plastered by a concussion giving hit.

[ExiledInIllinois]

I agree and I don't think it requires further explanation. He just doesn't have that sense of self-preservation that you need to survive in the league. I think if you were to watch all the videos of Connolly taking hits that have led to serious injuries you would easily be able to see that the dude doesn't pay attention to where he is skating. A normal person would have figured it out the first time he was plastered by a concussion giving hit.

 

Then if that is the case... One can make the argument that he IS fearless... Some have the attitude that makes it seem like he is a coward. Clueless maybe, but not cowardice or lack of "sack." That is the agrument that IMO doesn't jive with what DeLuca67 puts out.

[darksabre]

There is a fine line between bravery and stupidity.

[ExiledInIllinois]

There is a fine line between bravery and stupidity.

 

What are you saying? Bravery and stupidity are mutually exclusive?

 

Bravery knows now distinction between stupid and smart

[PASabreFan]

I agree and I don't think it requires further explanation. He just doesn't have that sense of self-preservation that you need to survive in the league. I think if you were to watch all the videos of Connolly taking hits that have led to serious injuries you would easily be able to see that the dude doesn't pay attention to where he is skating. A normal person would have figured it out the first time he was plastered by a concussion giving hit.

 

This might go to my hypothesis that judgment suffers as a result of a concussion, perhaps leading to another. Or the theory someone else (sorry) espoused that each injury has an incremental effect. Or then again it might be the other theory by, uh, some dude that Connolly is being targeted (The Blood in the Water Theory). Sorry, the brain cells really start to die off at my age. Will the owners of these theories please come forward and receive your door prizes.

[ExiledInIllinois]

This might go to my hypothesis that judgment suffers as a result of a concussion, perhaps leading to another. Or the theory someone else (sorry) espoused that each injury has an incremental effect. Or then again it might be the other theory by, uh, some dude that Connolly is being targeted (The Blood in the Water Theory). Sorry, the brain cells really start to die off at my age. Will the owners of these theories please come forward and receive your door prizes.

 

My treatise is:

 

Blood Frozen on Water: An unshackled Peters, Tim Connolly's blood spilt no more

 

What do I win PA?

 

:lol: :lol:

[darksabre]

What are you saying? Bravery and stupidity are mutually exclusive?

 

Bravery knows now distinction between stupid and smart

 

Bravery is being aware and prepared to accept the consequences of a bold action, whereas Stupidity is being aware and unprepared. I would imagine most brave players are the ones who put their body in harms way to make a play and are physically and mentally ready to be potentially annihilated. I think Timmy just gets so enthralled in making the perfect play that he loses physical and mental preparedness with regards to potential harm.

 

Think of it like this. If I know you're going to punch me in the stomach I can tense up my abs to reduce the effects of a punch, my body is prepared because I'm mentally aware. The human body can absorb ridiculous amounts of force if adequately prepared to do so.

[nobody]

I believe Connolly often does his best to avoid a hit - this actually puts him into a position where when he does get hit; it is worse then just taking the hit straight on.

[PASabreFan]

My treatise is:

 

Blood Frozen on Water: An unshackled Peters, Tim Connolly's blood spilt no more

 

What do I win PA?

 

:lol: :lol:

 

Nothing because you underlined it and I tried to click it! I wanted to read it!

 

Oh, heck, reach in Uncle PA's pocket, there's some change in there for ya.

[JoeFerguson]

As a side bar, has anyone noticed that it is impossible to find videos of any of these hits?

 

I have googled the following and I can't find any videos:

 

"Scott Nichol hit on Tim Connolly"

 

"Peter Schaefer hit on Tim Connolly"

 

"Keith Tkachuk hit on Tim Connolly"

 

The only one I can find is the Kasparaitis hip check.

 

I can also find about 900 videos of Eric Lindros getting nailed by Scott Stevens.

[PASabreFan]

As a side bar, has anyone noticed that it is impossible to find videos of any of these hits?

 

I have googled the following and I can't find any videos:

 

"Scott Nichol hit on Tim Connolly"

 

"Peter Schaefer hit on Tim Connolly"

 

"Keith Tkachuk hit on Tim Connolly"

 

The only one I can find is the Kasparaitis hip check.

 

I can also find about 900 videos of Eric Lindros getting nailed by Scott Stevens.

 

I've noticed. Here's a reverse angle of the Schaefer hit.

 

I can also point you to several comedy routines by Billy Connolly on the subject of the prostate, scrotums and if you're interested. I've already PMed BM with them.