Sabresince70

The state is bringing the charges. People may file charges at a district justice, but when an officer does it, they are representing the commonwealth. A little further information on this - it is actually the call that inspired this thread. When I recently had this call, I arrested the wife (had too, by law), but the law does not specify what charge needs to be filed. She was arrested for harassment (it is under the assault section in the crimes code) . It is a fine of up to $300 and is a summary offense (ticket). She does not have to be booked, or held for the charge. He was not charged (attempting to DUI is not a crime and the only charge that might have been appropriate was a noise complaint since the neighbors called (but then she would have had to get another citation as well). It was strongly suggested that he stay somewhere else for the night (I provided the ride to his sister's). I did have to clear the charge with the DA's office, but they seldom question the call. The wife was livid that she got a ticket. The husband was extremely upset (he would end up paying the fine since she was a stay at home mom) and the sister was upset that she was woken up to have her brother stay the night. My question to my wife when I got home was "what were they expecting me to do?" so... the topic.

since it 3:45am, and there is nothing moving but deer in the boro, let me give you a scenario that happens more often than you can imagine. you get called for a domestic (husband and wife). On arrival, the wife says they were arguing and when he went to leave, she grabbed his shirt. She scratches him in doing so. clear scratches, not deep, but bleeding,. He has been drinking, she didn't want him to leave and drive drunk. they have kids upstairs, crying and frightened. What do you do? In PA, if you go to a domestic, and there is visible injuries, you must make an arrest. Honestly, traffic stops are usually the easy ones. These can make you sit in your car and shake your head. And it happens just as often that the wife has been drinking and he grabs her to keep her from driving. And remember, you have kids upstairs that will need to be taken care of when the call is over.

Thanks for all responses. If no one minds, I will share with some of my co-workers. I will check back in am (I work nights tonight). Thanks again, Dan

Fair enough -" that guy was speeding" ...... ######## them, I am eating.

No reason to feel bad, I KNOW that personal experience drives our feelings. Wish we could get together at a game and meet not as cop but as fellow Sabre fans. Maybe it would change a little? As far as telling good from bad, it is what makes us fear and react to movements/ certain statements the way we do. We don't know how to tell the good and bad apart, either. At least not until the incident is unfolding/or over. I have had a person call my chief to thank me for arresting him. I really think he meant that it was me and not a certain other officer, but sure gave me a laugh. There are two residents that live in the Boro that really wish for another officer when they see me coming. It happens. Sometimes the mix is oil and water....Not everybody that gets arrested or did something stupid is a jerk. I get that. Most of us do. I worked for the Sheriff's office before the Boro. I watched the "road crew" workers. Some of the most decent people I have ever been around (and some of the worse). Sometimes, people do dumb things. Careful, it is a Republic - one of my favorite Ben Franklin quotes, when asked what kind of government we were going to have "A republic, if you can keep it" (And I am not making this a republican/democrat thing).

I HAVE to give 10 miles an hour for the speed device we use (In PA only radar can be 5 over and only the State Police are allowed to use it). Those extra 5 miles, very seldom are an issue. If they are speeding at 36 - 39, God bless them. Anything at 40, I am stopping you. Our chief recently paid for the "your speed is" signs. It registers speed of each car, ave. speed, no. of cars, etc... He placed it at the spot where we were getting complaints about. less than 2% of the cars that went through the area were over 10 miles. We actually have had our crime watch "Speed timing" one with a robic stopwatch, one just watching. The one without the stopwatch swore people were speeding. The one with the watch could not time one over 10 miles over. I can't speak for everyone, we have only four areas in our entire Boro where we can time (lines need to be on road for our device) and it limits where we can time. I don't "hide" I park in plain view. Most have the sense to slow down (to at least the 10 mile buffer) those that don't are almost always above "my" 15 buffer. It also puts to rest the "you pulled me over because of my..." statements. It has never mattered (even the Flyer plates)

I don't know if it is "cutting breaks" or not escalating it if they don't hit buttons. Everyone is "getting the break" from the beginning. The ones who get personal, use language that I wouldn't use in public or with someone I don't know, or create issues that hadn't existed (Safety wise) Earn the ticket (full price, letter of the law, whatever term you want to use). Breaks, I guess if you refer to someone with (to me) a good reason for whatever they did getting a warning, yep I admit I can be had for certain sob stories (usually won't punish someone trying to get to work, especially if I am aware of traffic problems in the area may have caused him to be late). You don't have to do anything special. I don't need or expect compliments/whatever. I also don't feel I need to be abused for doing my job. That I do not apologize for.

I am true sorry for your experience, and I can again, stress, there are good and bad everywhere.

OK. Can't speak to NY law. It has always been the "gift" ticket here because of lack of points.

In PA?

Not me! I see out of state, and think lost (we are one square mile, with farm land). In PA, if the person is from out of state, you can actually hold the driver for summary (tickets) to ensure payment. Way to much hassle for me. And while I am sharing - there are three things I will always give tickets for, no excuse acceptable. Opening you door into traffic (yep, it is in the vehicle code) and failure to stop for pedestrian in crosswalk - moving violations - and parking in a handicap spot. Automatic. I have a friend who is automatic with inspection stickers, one who is all about your lights (headlights, taillights, brake lights etc....) we all have something.

I wrote 10 tickets last year. Wasn't even the lowest in the department. We have some that wrote 75. Not judging, we just look at the job differently. Last Friday I held the ladder for two different people that were decorating their house, had two ambulance assists, and made an arrest for illegal fireworks (the first time I get called to your house and say stop, stop. The second time I have to come, it cost you $300)

Randall, Can't speak to him pulling you over (wouldn't be fair without "seeing what he saw", but if you were in PA at the time, the "failure to obey traffic control device pa vc 3111, was the cheapest ticket and carried no points against license. And it would be to the posted speed sign, not the lane change. The state has since made it an expensive ticket (fine went from $25 to $125) but it still carries no points. I will actually ask (If I am giving a ticket - 20 or more over) which one the driver would prefer (as long as he has not hit any buttons). Some would rather have the higher cost and no points, some would take the cheaper ticket. Side note, failure to use turn signals is $25 fine/no points. If you get pulled over for speeding, and the officer talks with you, and all is seemingly going well, how would you react to him coming back with a ticket for turn signals instead of speeding? I know of an officer that (since the state changed the 3111 fine, will issue a ticket for turn signals for when you pulled over to stop instead of the speeding ticket. It would not be what you were "pulled over" for, but would be much cheaper in the long run. Willing to share the municipality? I have no issue with New Yorkers. It's those damn Flyer plates in the front that get me :ph34r:

Seatbelts are strange laws... I know of a chief who removes the "bells" from the seatbelt indicators in the patrol car because he won't wear them. NO ONE in his department will write that ticket. (Unless you hit key words when the officer is at your window...)

Macungie is our "sister". Each department (normally) has only one officer on at a time, so we are each other's back up. I spent more time in Macungie last weekend than in our Boro. If you get pulled over feel free to use "do you know Summy [sum-me] ? For nearly everyone in either department it should help. (Maybe not the chief in Macungie, but that is a long story).

Wait until it is safe! I don't know if you are familiar with Alburtis, but we have very narrow roads. The flashers are a great idea. Atleast we know you see us. And slow down. If your speed remains the same (or worse increases) our reaction will be different! I would rather talk in a parking lot than in traffic. This idea all started with our "new young" guy. He seems much more "hopeful" that each call will bring excitement. I am guessing the paperwork will slow him down. I have three daughters (two in college, one graduated last June) and I have a second job at a college (free tuition is a wonderful thing). I will not discuss my opinion on college.... :cry:

without knowing the area, it would not be fair for me to say, "you should have..." It does sound as though the officer accepted you friend's explanation and reacted "sorry sir, I had no idea where to pull over" and his attitude changed fairly quickly, well. After a mile, he may well have been calling for another car (we expect the worse at that point). Not making excuses, but his "not happy about" might have been his " I m expecting crap" attitude.

Wish there was a way to convince you there are good and bad in every job. I am sorry those things have happened to you. Best advice I was ever given at the academy (nearly 20 years ago) was treat everyone the way you want to be treated. Most of those I work with and know from other departments do this. The others make it harder for us...

It occurred to me I wasn't being fair by not giving at least a little of my view... so When I pull a car over, let's say for speeding, I have choices (every dept. is different, though). If I am timing in a 25 MPH zone, by state law, I have to give 10 over to stop for speeding (state police only need 5). I give 15. So I will not pull someone over for less than 40. If you are going between 40 and 45, and you don't hit certain buttons when I get to the window (and all of your paperwork is good) it is a warning. If you are over 45 and don't , in my mind, have a good reason, you are getting a ticket. It may not be for the full 20 over, but you are getting something. I made this rule for myself shortly after I was hired, my chief has no problems with it, and I stick to it. Race, sex, nothing matters (only attitude). And yes, nervous. every time. I find myself going to the passenger's side more and more these days.

If you all could help me with something.... I am curious to get opinions from people that 1.don't know me and are giving honest thoughts, not what they think I want to hear, and 2. people not associated with law enforcement in any way. I know what goes through my mind when I approach a car on a traffic stop, or a couple that is arguing/fighting and neighbors have called and reported a "domestic", etc.... I am curious as to what the other side is thinking. Even what the caller is expecting. When/If you have been pulled over, and you know that you were speeding/ran a sign,whatever, what are you expecting from the officer? Do you think he is going to give you a ticket no matter the circumstances? Do you expect him to just give a warning? Do you consider that he may not have a choice? If you have ever been involved in a domestic, either an involved party or a reporting person (neighbor/witness/etc...) what have you expected? As I have gotten older, and have seen new and young officers (we recently hired one who views the world much differently than I) it has hit me that we teach fully from our POV as opposed to the publics. We certainly need to be taught to see things from a safety way (that quick movement to your jacket pocket because you just now realized that is where you left your wallet does send signals to us that you do not intend) but I think it would be helpful to have input from "the other side". Mods - feel free to get rid of this if you feel it is not appropriate, I don't intend for it to cause fighting or bad feelings and I know it is no way Sabre related, I just thought it was a good source of "unknown" friends that could help. Thanks, Dan

Absolutely! Still have an Edwards stick from when he played at Hershey!

Think maybe we were all spoiled with Lorentz? I really don't mind Ray, but I used to really enjoy "learning" from Lorentz. He didn't speak just to speak and had an almost teacher like way of explaining things. Also thought Gare did OK the few times he had been on (years ago).

And if Gionta is playing who is sitting?

Any news on D pairings? Kinda disappointed McCabe is gone. Can't believe he would have been worse than some we saw the other night.

I am all for picking up Budaj off waivers as our back up, and letting Johnson get his chance. Does anyone really believe that the difference between whoever Calgary gives up and Johnson would be so great? And letting Budaj sit back up while our young ones keep playing in the AHL would be fine.