Pokey Jones

Sadly, I think this is true.

Dumping Neuvirth was dumb. He was available, cheap and servicable. Better back up than Johnson. maybe even better than Lehner. We could have signed him the next year after dumping him too. McNabb and 2 2nd rounders definitely a bad deal, although the way he drafted those 2nd rounders would have probably been no better than our duds. Kane and Bogo is trickier. Myers probably needed a reset so I'm not sure you could keep him the way things had gone. They basically ruined his development. He has played decent hockey for Winnipeg though and D men with long reach are useful in this league now. Kane was a gamble but I understand it. In his mind this was a guy with huge upside and the ability to play with and protect McDavid (who he counted on getting) so I see the logic and won't fault that deal entirely. Expected more from Bogo obviously. Also Kane's injury made him perfect for the tank and the future at the same time. So a gamble, but a reasonable one, and if we trade Kane for decent assets this year it might still be a decent deal. Not sure how you evaluate the lost picks entirely since you don't know who they would have drafted. Travis Konecny for example is a speedster with decent scoring touch that might have looked pretty darn good on Eichel's wing. White, Boeser, there are players in that area that might have improved us. The real key for me is the total failure to find anybody in later rounds. It seems to me every team has at least a few late round finds but us. i know they won't all be gems, but you have to find a few.

Maybe, but it doesn't mean it's wrong. I saw decent effort levels in the SJ game. But haven't seen that every night and not from all players. It's a building block. You create a hard working culture and mentality first, and then you work on the finer points once you have that culture in place. That leads to success long term.

In theory yes, but Moulson has been in the press box. We are kind of stuck with him though. No way to get rid of him. You can send someone down, but nobody down there has impressed enough to get a call up. They are juggling lines. Okposo is a dilemna. Stuck with the long contract, so you are kind of forced to try to get him going. Sports psychologist maybe? we all know something ain't right there. Just don't envy Housley right now. He is a new coach so he has to balance winning the players over to him with expectations. He has to be careful benching players until he gains authority. It's a tough spot. Like it or not, players do quit on coaches in this day and age and the coaches usually lose. If I were JBot, I'd make it known Housley wasn't going anywhere and had full power to bench and discipline. let the players know he is the boss.

But they didn't really give anything of long term value away in the so called tank. They got draft picks, and then they squandered and wasted them. The tank sets you up for a rebuild, but only if you use your picks wisely.

Consistent work ethic and attitude. I mean we're all frustrated, but I'm glad they're having a "fun" day. http://buffalonews.com/2017/10/29/sabres-take-a-sunday-fun-day-approach-to-stay-positive/

It's kind of an odd question because it gives an implication that 1) there was an alternative and 2) we actually gave a bunch of assets away in order to tank. We were already a really bad hockey team and all they did is trade away a couple b grade goalies to make sure we didn't string a few meaningless wins together at the end of the year. The problem, as mentioned numerous times above was in what Murray did with the draft picks he got, the poor drafting, the non-existent success in late round drafting, and the price he paid for mediocre assets like Lehner. So it's not the tank, it's just bad management. I get a sense here (and correct me if it is wrong) but people think Regier was a good GM? I never thought that myself and maybe I'm misreading it, but I don't think the team has had good management for a really long time.

Just try to remember this is JBot's first year. This team as his team is only a few games in. In his eyes this is a baby and he isn't about to throw it out with the bath water. Hard to think this way after years of futility I know, but this is year one, give him time. My guess is a lot of bodies will be moved this year and maybe even more prior to the draft, but Moulson won't be one of them (not for trying).

100% yup.

Here's the thing on Eichel's stick breaking. Correct me if I am wrong cause I haven't paid attention to this but that camera for the walk off is always there and in the same basic place right? So he knows it will be on camera if he breaks it just at that spot. It's a public display. Is that fake or good I dunno. I'd be more interested to know what happened this evening being his birthday. Did he and whoever go out and party like it didn't matter? Or did it temper the mood? That would tell you more about him than this public display. I'm unsure of how I feel about it, but I'd rather a show of emotion than indifference or acceptance. Watched the Leafs/Flyers tonight. Eichel in our game looked much better to me than Matthews in that one. Flyers have drafted well, especially on D. We should hire some of their scouts. Everyone talks about how much better the Leafs are but tonight anyway, we played better in our loss than they did in theirs. I still think we are on the right path, but I also think it'll be a long and winding road.

Don't know why Murray ditched Neuvirth. That guy is still an underrated cheap back up who steals games now and again. We got nothing for him at the time and trading him away didn't really matter to the tank. Halak? I dunno, don't think he'd be cheap enough to make it make sense.

Well for the first time this year I was actually entertained by a hockey game. I know they lost, but wingers missed some perfect passes from Eichel in this game, a few bad bounces, a post and a whiff, didn't get the luck. But the effort was there and this is the first time we've seen the tempo start to finish that Housley wants. If they keep playing like this every night they will win games. Antipin still continues to show great potential and Pouliot is finally starting to look good which also shows promise. He plays better in a faster paced game. The negatives, Okposo still crap, the 4th line is not good. Griffith rapidly playing his way off this team. Bailey really really really needs to work on the accuracy of his shot. Third game now where he's shot over the net on a perfect set up. Lehner as usual one spectacular play and one kind of iffy goal. Kind of what you expect. overall, I'll say it again, if they played all the games like this one their record would be better. Stay the course and keep Moulson as far away as possible.

Antipin showed more bright moments again in this SJ game. I think he's just finding some difficulty in adjusting to NA and learning English etc. At times he makes a great play but then just goes to the wall and waits, looks like he is unsure of what the rest of the guys are doing. Maybe they should trade for a Russian that speaks really good English to room with him. Give him time, I think Antipin is a perfect fit for Housley's system and will be great in a year or so.

lol - and you call me negative!!!!!! His line was out the minute before that.

Guess it was the word "frequently" that made me wonder.

No, not until they unload bodies. We are in the accepting reality phase. The realization that the team Murray left us with is much worse than we thought it was. Randall Flagg, it's interesting you say my posts have changed, cause I'm not doing anything different. I think first, there is a little bit of getting used to a new voice, maybe a different style, a different way of writing maybe, style you aren't used to. There's a few older posters who have frequent sarcasm that you guys spot right away. Those took me a while and I probably still miss some. It's just familiarity. One cuts the people they know more slack. The second is I think my view was less optimistic to start and now that we have lost a bunch of games the gap between us has narrowed. In any event, we have a common interest. We all want this team to be better.

Scandella is a bright spot, totally agree on that, but not Redmond, I thought he was awful. Maybe it's just getting used to your partner etc. but he made a lot of mistakes.

It's kind of amusing the "right" thread has 2 pages, and the "wrong" thread has 10, we shall see if the 5-1 ratio continues.

I'm just curious, but when has Kane been "frequently put on teams third lines" ?

I knew Montreal made a big mistake when they hired Julien. He is total old school and it's a new era. This was only a matter of time. I agree that JBot and Phil should get time, but I'm a little discouraged with some of Housley's we were so close type of rhetoric. I know he is trying to win over the locker room, but I'd like to see a little more of a this isn't acceptable any more kind of attitude. A "revolt" is unrealistic, I know that, but complacency is even worse. If you tweak it it'll take a long time, if you make big moves you'll take a step back but then a leap forward. Not a tank, but a full reset.

Well, the fact that despite this team being a losing s###show for years, I have been viewed as too pessimistic and so on from day one. This illustrates clearly to me that many of you have lowered the bar quite a bit. This team reminds me of the Harold Ballard era Leafs when fans had just given up..........but they went to the games anyway and so nothing changed for ages. I don't do any other hockey sites but have been on many football ones. An example of a team that expects winning is the Steelers. They lose 2 in a row on those sites and all hell breaks loose. There is a culture and an expectation and it shows on the field. Players become Steelers. Eichel has said Buffalo has been good to him and he wants to do more, but I think Pominville is the only other guy on the roster who has talked like he wants to bleed blue and gold. Honestly for me, it all starts with Moulson. He should simply be removed from the equation. You can't have a $5 million dollar man floating around the roster doing nothing and expect to develop a hard working effort filled culture of hockey. You get rid of the crap even if it means taking a step back and you build with an attitude first. So he goes - anywhere but on the ice - and then you keep removing the slackers and the primadonas for as long as it takes.

Ok, before the season started Housley stated emphatically he wanted this team to be fast, he believed Eichel was at his best playing fast, and he wanted the top line to up it's tempo. This is why Reinhart has not played with Jack aside from the PP and Jack has been paired with the best skaters on the team. This won't change. This is also why I liked the move of Bailey on that line, they just need him to use his body more and get in the dirty areas more. He has the size and speed, he just needs more fearless desire and animosity to be a good compliment for them. and yes, if you want to trade Kane you want his numbers as high as possible but you also see if he is a compliment for Jack and if they are amazing together maybe you sign him (I still wouldn't) but either way, there are few alternatives. I am sure you won't see a slower player on that line.

I just think if the fans demand more they get more. Especially from the players themselves. As an example. The hated Bruins. I remember reading an interview with Krug, a little guy, who dropped the gloves his first time saying words to the affect of I felt, as a Bruin I had to, i had to stand up, it's what the fans expect here and after I did that I felt i won them over. maybe its a silly example, and its a hated team, but that is the idea. In Buffalo they get bored with booing rather quickly.

I agree with that, but it has to be on him. He has to earn it at this stage. Every step of the way he has not lived up to expectations right from the first year when he looked totally lost to now where he cannot find a niche or role. He simply has not delivered on his draft status.

No way of knowing who the real problems are, it'd just be speculation. Maybe its the fans not demanding more? The city? The source of this losing culture might have many forms. As for the players, its anyone who has been here a while and gotten used to losing as something acceptable. It's often the same, if the guy beside you makes twice your salary and he's not busting his butt every night maybe you start taking a little time off too. I don't have all the answers to this situation, but I will insist the culture of this team is the biggest problem. If you don't change it, nothing will ever change as a whole. And the proof is in the endless futility we see year after year.