Lindy is flat out embarrassing himself

[DR HOLLIDAY]

im sorry but i disagree, i just dont think he has what it takes. a good coach would be able to whip his players in to shape, and ruff has shown that he cant do that. its time for him to leave.

 

Yeah its that easy.......... :wallbash:

[SabresneedaCup]

Ted Nolan. he got a raw deal from us and theres no doubt in my mind that he would have won a cup if he had stayed.

[SabresneedaCup]

Yeah its that easy.......... :wallbash:

im sure it is when your a good coach and your players actually like you, unlike ruff who is a garbage coach.

[theend]

Ted Nolan. he got a raw deal from us and theres no doubt in my mind that he would have won a cup if he had stayed.

 

The same Ted Nolan who lasted all of two years with the Islanders?

 

The same Ted Nolan who hasn't had a single other offer for a coaching job in the NHL?

 

Sorry, try again.

[SabresneedaCup]

nope im not tryin again, he was a great coach for his short time being here, he never took any crap from his players, this is the kind of guy we need here.

[PASabreFan]

I probably shouldn't bite at this...but, here goes...

 

Who, then, is your replacement that will win us the Stanley Cup?

 

Oh, jeez, you're one of those "who's better than Lindy?" people.

[SabresneedaCup]

Oh, jeez, you're one of those "who's better than Lindy?" people.

yeah i know right, well if lindy is so great, then tell me why?

[theend]

Oh, jeez, you're one of those "who's better than Lindy?" people.

 

Not exactly. Though you know I don't think firing Lindy is the answer to all the team's problems, I just want to hear a reasonable suggestion, that's all. It's easy to say cast him aside, but not so easy to come up with an appropriate replacement. We all discuss player movement, trades, etc...but I've yet to hear who to bring in behind the bench.

[SabresneedaCup]

Not exactly. Though you know I don't think firing Lindy is the answer to all the team's problems, I just want to hear a reasonable suggestion, that's all. It's easy to say to cast him aside, but no so easy to come up with an appropriate replacement. We all discuss player movement, trades, etc...but I've yet to hear who to bring in behind the bench.

bring in anybody, lindy has had his shot and has failed. its time to move forward

[TheChimp]

The same Ted Nolan who lasted all of two years with the Islanders?

 

The same Ted Nolan who hasn't had a single other offer for a coaching job in the NHL?

 

Sorry, try again.

Here's one for you, then. How many seasons do you give Lindy to get his team to the Cup?

[theend]

Here's one for you, then. How many seasons do you give Lindy to get his team to the Cup?

 

I don't think Lindy's the problem right now. I, personally, would let him stay until I do think he's a problem. Bill Cowher took 14 years to win a Super Bowl with the Steelers, but they recognized he was a good coach and didn't rush to fire him when he didn't perform. Now, most franchises would bend over backwards to have him lead their team.

 

As many have pointed out, if Lindy was fired, he'd have plenty of suitors by the next day.

 

That said, I defend Lindy a lot on the board, but I am not 100% opposed to replacing him. It just should be with a good candidate...not 'whoever'. I'm still awaiting that answer.

[TheChimp]

I don't think Lindy's the problem right now. I, personally, would let him stay until I do think he's a problem. Bill Cowher took 14 years to win a Super Bowl with the Steelers, but they recognized he was a good coach and didn't rush to fire him when he didn't perform. Now, most franchises would bend over backwards to have him lead their team.

 

As many have pointed out, if Lindy was fired, he'd have plenty of suitors by the next day.

 

That said, I defend Lindy a lot on the board, but I am not 100% opposed to replacing him. It just should be with a good candidate...not 'whoever'. I'm still awaiting that answer.

If you're going to give such a lame answer to MY question, then stop asking yours.

[theend]

If you're going to give such a lame answer to MY question, then stop asking yours.

 

Wow...I was honest and put down my real thoughts on the subject, and took time to answer your question. I'm sorry it doesn't meet your exacting requirements to avoid being termed 'lame'.

[TheChimp]

Wow...I was honest and put down my real thoughts on the subject, and took time to answer your question. I'm sorry it doesn't meet your exacting requirements to avoid being termed 'lame'.

You answered it with no real answer. Lots of nothing in your post. Also, you say you're still waiting for an answer, yet he immediately said Ted Nolan. There's your answer. Just because you disagree doesn't mean it wasn't a clear answer.

[TheChimp]

Here. Randy Cunneyworth. Now we're up on you by two answers. ;)

[theend]

 

You answered it with no real answer. Lots of nothing in your post. Also, you say you're still waiting for an answer, yet he immediately said Ted Nolan. There's your answer. Just because you disagree doesn't mean it wasn't a clear answer.

 

Here. Randy Cunneyworth. Now we're up on you by two answers. ;)

 

That goes both ways - I did answer - you also just didn't like the response because I didn't give you an exact figure...which, when you think about it, is kind of silly. "Lindy, you have 2 more years to win the Cup. After that, you're done." The more reasonable assessment (for someone advocating keeping Ruff, that is) is to wait until you see him not doing his job well enough. Which is exactly what I said was my bar.

 

That said, you are right about my dismissal of the Nolan suggestion. He did answer...I just think it was kinda ridiculous. Honestly...who's the next suggestion - John Muckler? Or what about Barry Melrose - he had success once a long time ago, too.

 

Cunneyworth, on the other hand is the first real suggestion I've heard, so thank you for that. Don't know that I'd be comfortable with that decision, but it at least seems like it was thought out.

[TheChimp]

I did answer - you also just didn't like the response because I didn't give you an exact figure...which, when you think about it, is kind of silly. "Lindy, you have 2 more years to win the Cup. After that, you're done." The more reasonable assessment (for someone advocating keeping Ruff, that is) is to wait until you see him not doing his job well enough. Which is exactly what I said was my bar.

 

That said, you are right about my dismissal of the Nolan suggestion. He did answer...I just think it was kinda ridiculous. Honestly...who's the next suggestion - bringing back John Muckler? Or what about Barry Melrose - he had success once a long time ago, too.

 

Cunneyworth, on the other hand is the first real suggestion I've heard, so thank you for that. Don't know that I'd be comfortable with that decision, but it at least seems like it was thought out.

The Ted Nolan choice is one I like alot. He has the right attitude towards players that lollygag, and that's what we have here right now. Lindy gives his top guys too much slack, and they are too secure to play with the desperation they need to. Nolan's firing in NY simply can NOT be used against him, when he was basically given a glorified AHL crew to work with, and he did a halfway decent job with them, IMO. I honestly think he'd have them playoff ready by now if he'd have been allowed to stay.

 

Now, your ambiguous answer about Lindy, forgive me for calling it lame, I apologize. But honestly, have you not seen enough of what he can give YET? Darcy's obviously learning HIS job, as evidenced by his more recent pickups and how THEY are playing. In fact, when Roy and Pominville first got their feet wet, they played with intensity and created alot more opportunities than they do now, and that, to me, all goes back to Lindy not being a good enough coach to get them to elevate from one season to the next. So, again, he's had how many years so far, and you still don't know how many more you wanna give him? How come?

[SabresneedaCup]

The Ted Nolan choice is one I like alot. He has the right attitude towards players that lollygag, and that's what we have here right now. Lindy gives his top guys too much slack, and they are too secure to play with the desperation they need to. Nolan's firing in NY simply can NOT be used against him, when he was basically given a glorified AHL crew to work with, and he did a halfway decent job with them, IMO. I honestly think he'd have them playoff ready by now if he'd have been allowed to stay.

 

Now, your ambiguous answer about Lindy, forgive me for calling it lame, I apologize. But honestly, have you not seen enough of what he can give YET? Darcy's obviously learning HIS job, as evidenced by his more recent pickups and how THEY are playing. In fact, when Roy and Pominville first got their feet wet, they played with intensity and created alot more opportunities than they do now, and that, to me, all goes back to Lindy not being a good enough coach to get them to elevate from one season to the next. So, again, he's had how many years so far, and you still don't know how many more you wanna give him? How come?

 

and to add to your point remember when ted nolan brought the islanders to the playoffs a few years ago with an ahl goalie leading the squad? or was that someone else? i think it was nolan, and it would be great to see him as our coach again.

[DR HOLLIDAY]

and to add to your point remember when ted nolan brought the islanders to the playoffs a few years ago with an ahl goalie leading the squad? or was that someone else? i think it was nolan, and it would be great to see him as our coach again.

 

Better talk to Doc Brown and tell him to get the flux capacitor warmed up.................. :beer:

[theend]

The Ted Nolan choice is one I like alot. He has the right attitude towards players that lollygag, and that's what we have here right now. Lindy gives his top guys too much slack, and they are too secure to play with the desperation they need to. Nolan's firing in NY simply can NOT be used against him, when he was basically given a glorified AHL crew to work with, and he did a halfway decent job with them, IMO. I honestly think he'd have them playoff ready by now if he'd have been allowed to stay.

 

Now, your ambiguous answer about Lindy, forgive me for calling it lame, I apologize. But honestly, have you not seen enough of what he can give YET? Darcy's obviously learning HIS job, as evidenced by his more recent pickups and how THEY are playing. In fact, when Roy and Pominville first got their feet wet, they played with intensity and created alot more opportunities than they do now, and that, to me, all goes back to Lindy not being a good enough coach to get them to elevate from one season to the next. So, again, he's had how many years so far, and you still don't know how many more you wanna give him? How come?

 

These are the key points for me - I have seen what Lindy can do - he's brought us to our only other Stanley Cup finals since the '70's, and he's had numerous other deep playoff runs. But, just like you're pointing out with Darcy, there's cycles to all of this. Darcy made some great moves bringing in Briere, Drury, and drafting the current 'core' players who made up a nearly great team out of the lockout. The problem is, the core players were great when they weren't supposed to lead. Now that they're supposed to lead, they can't. I think most people would agree with that.

 

Meanwhile, Darcy went through a couple of down years, and now he's showing promise again with the new players. I think Ruff's on that same path - he's had a couple of down years, and with newer, better talent/leadership, he'll have this team in a better place in a couple of years as those younger guys like Ennis, Myers, etc, mature.

 

The fundamental debates we all seem to go back to is who's responsible for the team underachieving? It comes down to this:

 

1 - Darcy

or

2 - Lindy

or

3 - The Core

 

My vote is for #3. I don't think you can get blood from a stone. The Core can't (or won't) bleed, and I don't think any coach can change that. Darcy becomes responsible for that next, if he doesn't replace them with better talent. Finally, when the better talent is here and mature, if Lindy doesn't succeed, it's on him.

 

A little long-winded (sorry)...but hopefully I'm not being ambiguous now!

[theend]

and to add to your point remember when ted nolan brought the islanders to the playoffs a few years ago with an ahl goalie leading the squad? or was that someone else? i think it was nolan, and it would be great to see him as our coach again.

 

Then why has no other NHL team offered him the job? Surely teams like Florida, Tampa, Edmonton, and other cellar dwellers could use someone like that to motivate their guys?

 

I'm sorry, but I feel the same way about Nolan as you do about Ruff. He had one year of success with Buffalo. And he followed up that nice little story with the Islanders the next year with 13 less points, and a last place finish in the division. Add to that his reason for leaving the Islanders - 'philosophical differences'. Namely, his players tuned his brusque manner out in year 2, and the team faltered. When he was in Buffalo, Hasek hated him and loved Muckler, and helped force him out. (NOT saying Hasek was right in that scenario, just pointing it out as more evidence of how difficult he was to get along with.)

 

Though I agree that Lindy can be too soft, Nolan has a reputation for being too difficult.

[TheChimp]

I'll admit it. Lindy's patience with his stars bugs the ###### out of me sometimes. I honestly love the guy's system, and I would miss seeing him in pressers, BIGTIME. But he just seems to let his guys lollygag too much. They're playing balls to the wall tonight, sure. But they take too many games off for my liking. Guys like Roy, Poms, Connolly, Stafford, they could use some tough love, IMO. And the young guns could use not to turn into lollygaggers, themselves. That's my biggest fear with Lindy Ruff as HC.

[DR HOLLIDAY]

I'll admit it. Lindy's patience with his stars bugs the ###### out of me sometimes. I honestly love the guy's system, and I would miss seeing him in pressers, BIGTIME. But he just seems to let his guys lollygag too much. They're playing balls to the wall tonight, sure. But they take too many games off for my liking. Guys like Roy, Poms, Connolly, Stafford, they could use some tough love, IMO. And the young guns could use not to turn into lollygaggers, themselves. That's my biggest fear with Lindy Ruff as HC.

 

So the players take no responsibility for their play? I don't think Connolly or Stafford would be any better anywhere else in the league. I rate Roy and Pommers a lot higher, they usually come to play, are they always effective thats another story.

[theend]

I'll admit it. Lindy's patience with his stars bugs the ###### out of me sometimes. I honestly love the guy's system, and I would miss seeing him in pressers, BIGTIME. But he just seems to let his guys lollygag too much. They're playing balls to the wall tonight, sure. But they take too many games off for my liking. Guys like Roy, Poms, Connolly, Stafford, they could use some tough love, IMO. And the young guns could use not to turn into lollygaggers, themselves. That's my biggest fear with Lindy Ruff as HC.

 

So what you're saying is we need a Ruff-Nolan hybrid!

[theend]

So the players take no responsibility for their play? I don't think Connolly or Stafford would be any better anywhere else in the league. I rate Roy and Pommers a lot higher, they usually come to play, are they always effective thats another story.

 

Definitely agree with this.