Mango

Conner Clifton is on pace for a 32 goal season….against his own team.

I think one thing everybody needs to get over is that if everybody is producing who gives a shirt. The top two lines had a great night. Mitts helps Skinner/Tuch. Greenway helps Thompson/Cozens. We should view it as a positive. As high as we are in Cozens and Thompson, we can be even better with a little more balance to everybody’s skill sets. LFG

I agree; but I think the standard road whites are so good. Classic Sabres look. I am fully behind the goat heads at home. But I like our white road jerseys the way they are.

I think I’m at a point where I’d love this team to permanently wear the black goat heads at home and standard white jerseys on the road.

I knew this game was over when Tucher dropped the gloves. The boss lady is on the west coast, I grabbed a Moe.saic 4 pack, grilled a steak and watched alone at home. AT throwing punches got me fired up which fired up with the doggos. Special shout out to Comrie who played well. I’d like some more rebound control, but the defensive pairings were in sync and cleared quickly. So happy the team played a fun, watchable, fiery game.

If keeping Mitts in the top 6 is part of the plan they should get him extended in short order.

That was a lot of fun. A big part of my frustration was it just wasn’t good hockey and it sucked to watch. Part of the problem with the drought just wasn’t losing it was that it was totally unwatchable hockey. I have had some PTSD the last week or so. I liked this game. I’m also going to pat myself in the back as somebody who has pounded the table for Skinner - Mitts - Tuch and Greenway - Thompson - Cozens.

It changes a bit if/when Benson or Quinn comes back. Not that today is a permanent shake up. But I think these are great lines to have in our pocket.

The crazy part is that as this roster starts to mature and come together, I don’t get the math. We don’t sign any high priced FA because “value” and “saving money to sign our own”. But we have a core signed for another 7 years. WTF are we going to do when Benson, Kulich, Savoie, Rosen, Quinn, and JJP etc. come do? Our top line is more or less set. We’ve been committed to letting the kid line struggle in the name of development. Mitts needs to stay, none of those guys fit Greenway; and Benson is clearly the leader of the prospect pack right now. Our entire 4th line are FA next year, and zero prospects fit there/are ready? We either have to start to move those guys out, or we have to start to think about moving some other more established players for different established players. Otherwise we will either just let them walk or we’ll just recycle dealing with struggling kids for the sake of the future.

It’s early so let me start there. But as I’ve posted post Calgary game, I’m starting to wonder if a lot of this is personnel not system. By that I mean, I think we have a core that plays fast offensive hockey. I don’t know that we need to change that so much as we need to do a better job filling in the gaps. I think we have to accept that even though they’re big Cozens and Thompson aren’t great two way players. And instead of having them shift their game, we need to help support their lines with more/better power forwards. The defense needs a younger version of EJ to play up with Power. If Clifton can figure it out as the season progresses, that third line will be fine. Go move Kulich, Rosen, and RJ. Bring in guys like Mieir and/or Chychrun. (Just throwing out last years names) We don’t need to change everybody’s game. They need to improve, sure. But they need help, not a makeover. We just need better supporting players for our stars. Last year we had a scoring line, a kid/prospect line, a middling line, and a defensive line. Instead of trying to make Thompson a different player just give him more help on the wing. Greenway - Cozens - Thompson was a great line, injured or not.

I don't disagree. But my point is what is that $6M providing to us right now? Would you rather have $6M in cap space or another capable, even often injured goalie on the roster? Even if you pay Ullmark $6M for 35 games. For $6M we could get 35 decent games from an NHL starter and given us the freedom to allow Levi to mature a bit in Rochester, maybe get 20 games this year, before thrusting him into 40, 50, 60 NHL games out of the gate.

I agree with you. I just meant that if Levi plays the lions share of games this year, 50-60 games. I don't know how much going back there is in 24-25. At that point he is the entrenched starter. Of course teams can always do whatever they want, but things do get tricky.

I want (need?) this team to make the playoffs so bad. But if there is a chance that Levi is this generational goalie that some say he could be then we need to protect his progression at all costs. This is less about this "day-to-day" injury and more about the work load we are anticipating for the kid. It feels like Levi is a lynch pin to the whole plan. If we break this kid I think there is a real chance we are back to the Eichel era of selling off all the pieces we acquired to start over.

I think that if Levi is the generational goalie that the Sabres seem to think he is, you protect his development at all costs. For a regime that has been so long term focused, this one is very desperate and short sighted. We save all of this cap space for "the future". And take a weird moral high ground in not "overpaying Ullmark". I just don't get it. WTF are we using the money we saved for now? Ullmark/Comrie last year and this year. Ullmark/Levi for 2024-25. Levin/??? 26. That feels responsible and still a very quick progression for a goaltender in the NHL. We didn't use the $6M last year and we aren't using the $6M this year. So if we aren't adding anything with it, we aren't saving it either.

I am high on Thompson the goal scorer. I do not like Tage Thompsons 200 foot game. But I can agree that historically Cozens has been a bit better in both directions. Both have played better with a power forward on their line. Part of the top 6 not producing is the top 6 giving up too many chances in their own end. I don't think it is as simple as separating their games in the offensive and defensive zone. We have been among the worst 5v5 teams 4 games in. That is not just a lack of scoring, although it would certainly help. I think we need another power forward to slot into the top 6. In regards to personnel/Adams, I totally agree. There are other issues on the roster that aren't helping. And it isn't just one offseason. Of course there were certain options that weren't available this season. But this roster is a conglomeration of not addressing defense and goaltending for 4 years. I am having a hard time understanding the plan as I start to put together the specific nuts and bolts. I keep hearing "we are young and we need to mature" on repeat. But like....where do all these guys go, and what is their value? I think you have to keep Mitts. So who replaces Girgenson, Jost, Krebs, Okposo next year? Or Greenway in 2025? We don't have anybody in the pipeline. We have better offensive weapons, but these guys fill a different role. What happens in 2025 with Quinn and JJP. This seems to be the easiest swap for some of the prospects. But if we are allowing these two to stumble in the name of progression, and we don't extend (we will), then what's the point of allowing them to stumble? What's the point in protecting the prospects if they never make the NHL roster?

I like this FO and HC. So let me start there. They are really hockey people who have helped stabilize a very unstable hockey franchise. But I have also been open to the idea that they are the Buddy Nix/Chan Bailey’s of the franchise. A necessary force to bring some more hockey respectability to a franchise who lost it a long time ago. Unfortunately they may have taken the franchise as far as they are both capable of. Which sucks. On the plus side, I think this is now an org that more senior hockey execs and HC’s would jump at the chance to be apart of. A lot of good pieces. A great pipeline. But needs a push to get over the top. Too early to commit to that being the case just 2 weeks in. But it’s certainly possible.

It’s possible. It was talked about last year. Something I am and was open to. But I also thought the team showed enough progress last year to give Donnie another season. The roster needed help, so you try and give your guys the tools to succeed and the freedom to fail. I expected the team to at least be a bit more fiery to open the year.

I totally agree with you here. But to answer OP’s question I think if this skid and more importantly this level of play continues we see Adams overpay (like waaaay overpay) to try and fix this in desperation. I think they could end up packaging a few prospects and picks to grab another goalie and/or defenseman. This FO has been open about playoffs, Stanley cup, and getting the fans back in and believing in this core. After 12 years, I don’t think the org can ask the players to ask for the fans trust (and $$$) this year and miss the playoffs.

To this point I think we have enough Ryan Johnson’s, Dahlins, and Powers. We need a blue chip guy who digs his skates in and stands hard at the blue line. Simialryl, we have enough Thompson’s, Cozens, Skinners, who can’t or won’t play both ways. The entire pipeline is chock full of those guys. It’s not a coincidence that Mitts/Greenway are standing out. The team lacks balance in approach and in personnel. Somebody mentioned that Greenway is looking better than Meier right now. Looks like the right decision. But honestly this team could us both Greenway and Meier. We’re just not tough enough in both directions. If we can provide high level support in both directions watch life get easier for Skinner, Cozens, Thompson.

I think that’s the point. OP is saying what we should be doing is asking “what’s best for our best prospect/goalie” and instead we’re saying “what do we have to do to not sink this ship”.

“At least we didn’t over pay” - Team with the most cap space in the league.

This feels like the hockey version of “But Edmunds is so young” that went on for eternity.

If this continues something is clearly broken with the admin and needs to be replaced. But not blown up. I just can’t put my finger on it. On one hand we don’t play any real defense. But this roster has really progressed under his tutelage. On the other hand, we have all these great forward prospects, but no defensive depth, no goalie; and no real plan/attempt to fix them.

The Erik Johnson post game is refreshing.

Finally got around to this. Did anybody else get the vibe that Jerry Forton seems to be doing a lot of the heavy lifting and taking the lead on a lot of decisions and actions. I tend to lead collaboratively but I just got the vibe that Adams was almost looking for approval from Forton rather than bringing him into the fold. Also I think his sister is the one who sells those big fuzzy water buffalo Bills hats.