Jump to content

PASabreFan

Members
 View Profile  See their activity

  • Posts

    43,926

  • Joined

  • Last visited

 Content Type 

Posts posted by PASabreFan

  2. Murray has eye on top pick — in 2016

    in The Aud Club

    Posted

    This thread promises to be a real head-desker because PA and a few others read the quote one way and many other another.

    You can't have a good discussion if you can't agree on the premise of that discussion,

    I guess. There's really nothing else to say. It'll be interesting to revisit this quote after we've heard Murray say more after the season, especially after the draft. I continue to find it puzzling that he'd make a statement like that before knowing if a generational talent the likes of which the NHL rarely sees will be in the lineup on opening day. Or not. Leave it to the Sabres to make Connor McDavid earn his keep in Rochester for a season.

  3. Murray has eye on top pick — in 2016

    in The Aud Club

    Posted

    Day two? OK. I was hoping, this being a major holiday and all, that we'd be like the British and the Germans during the Great War meeting in no man's land and kicking a soccer ball around and singing "We're gonna win that Cup (in 2024)." Thought chz, bio or Jo might even show up with porterhouses.

     

    But if you'd rather have it this way...


    This is a GM who has traded for players like Kane and Bogosian. And has traded draft picks for older prospects.

    But words speak louder than actions here?

    What are you driving at? That Murray's actions signal that he's trying to accelerate the rebuild, maybe even thinking about the Sabres competing for a playoff spot next season, but he wants to keep expectations low, for the benefit of the players, the fans, other GMs who are sizing him up?


    And I don't want one with his head in the clouds unable to acknowledge reality. To expect to make the playoffs he'd have to expect a 40 point improvement. That's insane.

    I might be hung up on two words here, but my problem isn't that Tim expressed a cold analysis of where he thinks the team will be. It's that he thinks of the new lottery rules "selfishly" while he "hope"s that the Sabres are in the running for it. That tells me, even before he knows if he's getting McDavid or Hanifin, before he knows what free agents might be willing to come, before he knows what trades are available, that his mind is set on what he wants out of next season. That smacks of something he said he didn't want to be, that rebuilding GM who milks a situation for job security. It smacks of the use of losing as a means to an end, and that was supposed to end this season.

  5. Murray has eye on top pick — in 2016

    in The Aud Club

    Posted

    Murray talks to much. I think after the honeymoon phase is over here that act will get old. Right now he is enjoying the attention he is getting. I will start paying more attention to what he has to say when he has done more than sell off some UFA'S and be asked to captain the worse team hockey.

     

    Why can't we be next years Calgary or NYI? Why come out and say what he did? I am sick of this loser mentality. If he realistically thinks we are not a playoff team next year THEN DO MORE!! Earn your damn paycheck. Any blind squirrel can sit back and wait for years worth of high draft picks to accumulate.

     

    Expect more from yourself, your coaches, your scouts, and your players. This BS of accepting to not compete for a playoff spot is old. Take TP's nipple out of your mouth and start doing your job. This act is old. What exactly is he saying that DR didn't???? Yet we accept it because Murray GZF's. Give me a break. Put a damn hockey team on the ice and shut the hell up.

  6. Murray has eye on top pick — in 2016

    in The Aud Club

    Posted

    Seriously?

    Of course not. You make this place better, much better. It was just a jab at the CHL thread.

    Finally read the article--context is a beautiful thing. He was clearly talking about the Sabres chances to win the lottery in light of the changes to the format and his expectation that we're not in the playoffs. He may as well have said "I think we're going to be better, but thanks to the bozos around the league, we're going to have a better chance than in the past to win the lottery, and I hope we do." Much ado about nothing.

    You didn't need the article for that context. The first part of his quote that I copied and pasted gave the context. Whatever.

     

    His hoping that they're in the running for a top three pick is what there should be much ado about. That's the story here. I thought it would surprise more people given GMTM's comments about a quicker turnaround than expected, his denials that the team has even been tanking, the trade of a pick and prospects for Kane and Bogosian, etc. The idea that next year is about getting better, but not too much better, by hope/design, is a new twist on the immediate future. At least in my eyes.

     

    Seriously, isn't anyone else down for two more Kane style trades, maybe a Snow-like poaching of a team with cap troubles, a good free agent signing, a decent goaltender and let's go win some hockey games?!

  10. Murray has eye on top pick — in 2016

    in The Aud Club

    Posted

    I think it's totally reasonable to question the tone Tim uses with the media.  I don't think that it will have any effect on the players long term.  

    Have you thought of it as if you were a player? You can argue it should light a fire under their to hear what their GM thinks of them. But it could easily have the opposite effect. After what we've endured, and seen the players endure, for two years, I can't believe some people have no problem with Murray said — or even what he might be proposing out loud.

  11. Murray has eye on top pick — in 2016

    in The Aud Club

    Posted

    I think this was a case of Murray being his literal, grumpy, mad hockey scientist self.  He knows that with another top 3 pick next year, he could really build a special team. Next year, the rest of us would take a youngin-led playoff team with a first round exit and be very happy.  TM would rather have a top 3 pick, so he says so.  I would be shocked if he used "roster manipulation" to get it done, though.  He already traded for Kane, he wants to be better next year.  He just sees the world differently than we do.

    Very well said. I just don't like the idea of "self-fulfilling prophecies."

  12. Murray has eye on top pick — in 2016

    in The Aud Club

    Posted

    How will this play in the lockerroom? Guys read the papers (OK, they go online). How much stench of losing can you dump on young guys before they start believing it? As far-fetched as the playoffs might be next year, this is sports. Unexpected things happen. As much as #analytics wants us to believe players are machines that, if placed in the right locations on the ice to accomplish certain recordable tasks, can increase the chance of winning measurably — they are human. What did Mucks think of the 96-97 Sabres' chances of winning a round? What chance did Regier give the 05-06 Sabres of being within a microbe of a Cup final?

     

    These Sabres aren't those teams, and they aren't this year's Islanders either. But consider some of the things that went into making the Islanders believe. Snow keeps his pick, making a huge statement to his players that he believes they won't be anywhere near the McEichel sweepstakes. Wang sells the team and will be out the door in two years. Snow trades for Leddy and Boychuk, taking advantage of cap space to take players off the hands of cap-strapped teams.

     

    Again, no way am I arguing that the Sabres are those teams. I just question the wisdom of being Debbie Downer all the time. Didn't we have enough clinicial depression with Lindy and Darcy?

  13. Murray has eye on top pick — in 2016

    in The Aud Club

    Posted

    Here's the quote, again: 

     

    "Selfishly, for the Buffalo Sabres, the first three picks (in ‘16) will be part of the lottery as opposed to just the first pick,” Murray said. “We’re not going to be a Stanley Cup contender next year but I hope we’re on the way up while still having a chance to win the lottery.

     

    So, to review: He does not expect the team to contend for a Cup next year (um, yeah), so he hopes they are on the way up (sure!) and, even though he disagreed with configuring the system this way, also have a shot (but probably not a great one (given a finish in/around 20 (?))) at one of the top 3 picks (okay).

     

    Seriously.

    Exactly. No need to gild the lily with superfluous parentheses. Apparently we agree he said what he said. He hopes they have a shot at one of the top three picks. He hopes they are not a playoff team. I hate that. I mean, you can only demoralize the fan base so much. Jesus, he doesn't have to be so cold and calculating. They take too much advantage of the fact that the fans will fill that building no matter what. Throw us a bone. Say, "We're not going to contend, but I hope we're on the way up, even make a run at the playoffs. If we fall short of that, although I disagree with the new lottery rules, at least we'll have a shot at a top pick. I hope it's a small shot, because no way do we want to be in the running for 30th again."

  15. Murray has eye on top pick — in 2016

    in The Aud Club

    Posted

    I love Timmy but I don't like that quote and while he may have misspoken I think PA's take on it jives more with what was said than everyone else's and I think the content of this thread would be a lot different if he wasn't the one to start it.

    Thank you!

    Do we really need a poll to prove that this is a gross mis-characterization? Why anyone would think that when the opportunity for the best players was in this year's draft? Did anyone really think signing Gionta and Gorges was signaling that we were going for it this year? Benoit and Mezaros?

    Do you know what year it is?

  17. Murray has eye on top pick — in 2016

    in The Aud Club

    Posted

    I love Terry !

     

    I have no issues with the rebuild at all

    Everyone loves a rebuild. But at some point they have to end. 95% of the people here insisted that the rebuild/tank was over on draft day... 2015. Then the fun starts, despite the end result in the standings. Can you imagine Darcy saying, "Well, looks like we're getting a top pick. Now prepare to suffer again as we angle for another one, albeit with a better than 30th place product. But we'll see continuous improvement."

  18. Murray has eye on top pick — in 2016

    in The Aud Club

    Posted

    Keep in mind Tim said this before he knows what the draft will bring. And, if it brings McDavid, what agents will be knocking at the door hoping to get their clients on the kid's wing. Maybe if he's reading this, Tim is chuckling at getting me all excited. Maybe the message was intended for his fellow GMs. Don't try to take advantage of me — we're not even trying to make the playoffs next year. Maybe Tim's the real troll.


    I love Terry !

     

    I have no issues with the rebuild at all

    So you do hate Taro.

  19. Murray has eye on top pick — in 2016

    in The Aud Club

    Posted

    If you play/show those quotes to 100 high school educated people, 90+ will come away with what the consensus here is: He doesn't want to be a non-playoff team next year, he just recognizes that, in the process of getting better, the team probably will fall a bit short. It's a process, dude. Becoming a contender takes some time -- it's not a "just add McEichel" recipe.

     

    Your understanding of what he's saying is (*sigh*) a distortion of the language's plain meaning.

    Tim doesn't do nuance like that. That's why so many like him. Hell, even I like him. He spoke his mind. I don't think anyone likes the message. Right now, they're taking it out on the messenger. Funny that I would have to be the one to bring the quote to the board's attention. Was everyone else covering their ears and screaming "lalalalalalalalala"?

    No, it has a great deal to do with you.  The type who posts crap taken way out of context and then goes " who meeeeee?"  

    How's it out of context? The quote is in context.

  22. The tank is 1/2 over...

    in The Aud Club

    Posted

    I'm with you guys on this.  I have a feeling TM is going to be very active this offseason.  That doesn't mean just FA but also trades, particularly around the draft.  McEichel or not, I think Tim wants this team to make some big strides next year and will be in on ROR discussions and others who can help right away.

    Maybe GMTM is sandbagging, but he told a Toronto paper he hopes next year's team is better but still out of the playoffs and in the lottery for the top three picks.

  23. Murray has eye on top pick — in 2016

    in The Aud Club

    Posted · Edited by @fakegorbyportwinestain

    Aud, I'd hate to say I told ya so...but I did tell ya ;)

    It's OK. You can bop me on the nose instead of Tim. I know you don't like what Tim said, but you won't admit it. No one should like it. It's an affront. It's disgusting. But... let the great SabreSpace Backtracking begin, in the fine tradition of this board.

    Amazing how this s### still works.

    Talking to me? I'm the problem? The GM just said he wants his team to miss the playoffs again next year, and I'm the villain?

  24. Murray has eye on top pick — in 2016

    in The Aud Club

    Posted

    We won't be. This year we're a bad by design. Next year we'll just be a bad team.

    I don't see how you can possibly separate the design of a team from the explicit, expressed goal of that team's general manager. ZFG? Great. Then Murray should design a non-playoff team. The problem is what if that team overachieves and is on the playoff bubble come next February? Is there more roster manipulation to get worse? Should fans root for losses again, to avoid that awful fate of playing well into April and maybe May? We're down the rabbit hole here.

  25. Murray has eye on top pick — in 2016

    in The Aud Club

    Posted

    I don't think this is a troll by PA, and I think those saying that are reacting to past provocations.

     

    It's a fair question. I happen to think it has a very straightforward answer.

     

    The team's path back to respectability is likely sloped a bit like a sine curve, not like some jagged cliff. Murray seems to be saying that they will be better next year, but maybe not yet a playoff team. So, in theory, he would want the bottom teams to get the top picks, but, selfishly, realizes that next year a team (like his) that just misses out on the playoffs will also get a shot at one of the top 3 picks. TM does not think that should be the case, but allows that his team may still benefit from it.

    You're softening his rhetoric. He wants to be a lottery team next year. "Lottery team" is the new DFL. According to the cold way of looking at things around here, Murray should do whatever he can to accomplish this goal, and the smart fans will be pulling for just enough losses to get there. Why make the playoffs? Short-term pain for long-term gain.

     

    The Lottery Hockey League. Enjoy.

×
×
  • Create New...