msw2112

Well, the theory was that UPL got the start against St. Louis over Ellis because of his strong play against Washington. That theory holds up. If he starts again over Lyon and Ellis, then you are correct that the theory that he's starting because of strong play goes out the window. I think of Ellis making two saves against good players on breakaways in the Detroit game, whereas with UPL, if it's a breakaway or 2 on 1, you know the puck will be in the back of the net. I want to believe that UPL still has room to grow and improve, as many goalies don't peak until late 20's or even early 30's, or that he'll find the game he had for 2 months a couple of seasons ago, but the more I see, the more I doubt. I understand the sentiment on this board that UPL letting in a soft goal, or failing to make a big save when needed, deflates the entire team, which makes progress and success much more difficult. It didn't happen against Washington (playing hard and coming back to win after giving up 2 early goals), but seemed to happen against St. Louis last night. UPL aside, missing open nets, hitting goal posts and crossbars, and helping a subpar goalie look great by shooting it into his glove or pad instead of over the pad or glove can also deflate a team. Regardless of what caused it, the lack of wind in the Sabres sails last night was very apparent. Maybe just too many injuries left an experienced and disjoined lineup? All of the above?

If they make it to OT against a Western Conference team, that's not a terrible result. If they make it to OT and WIN, that's a great result. I'd also "settle" for a regulation win....All of this said, because the Blues appear to really suck this year, a win of any kind is a must.

Had Ellis not had back issues, he would have started the 2nd Toronto game, but UPL played instead and wasn't great. I don't know what Ellis' health was for the Washington game, but UPL got the start and, after bad first few minutes (2 early goals), played very well the rest of the game, and was great in the OT and shootout. I think that's why he's getting the start tonight. Ellis is the victim of some bad luck with the back injury, and UPL playing well in his last start (and Lyon being terrific in HIS last start). Given how well he played in first (and only) game, I would also like to see Ellis get some more opportunities, but if Lyon and UPL keep playing well and there are no injuries or illnesses, he may have to wait.

There's no science or math behind this, but I believe that if they win half of these OT games, which should be a reasonable expectation, they'll be fine as far as how it impacts their final point total. That said, it's clearly more important to get that 2nd point against division and Eastern Conference foes such as Boston, Toronto, Columbus, etc., as ceding the "extra" point to teams they're competing with for the playoffs is a killer. Not as big of a deal to lose the 2nd point to Utah or other Western Conference teams. Given how many they've already lost, it's going to be difficult to win half of their OT games for the entire season, but at this point, I'd take half from this point forward AND we need some of those to come against divisional and Eastern Conference teams. It boils down to individuals stepping up and making a play - a player with a chance in OT has to bury it and/or a goalie with a chance to make a big save has to make it. So far, outside of UPL in the Washington game, neither of those things have happened. If the Sabres continue to play at their current level, and perhaps elevate a bit when all of the injured players return, they should be right in contention for 3rd in the division, or a wild card spot, right up to the end of the season. While I'd love for them to be one of the teams that eventually separates from the pack (in a positive way), I'm not sure they're going to be able to do that. What I believe will be different is that in previous seasons when they've been close and fallen short, they've gotten hot and made a run at the end of the season. This season, I believe they'll be in the mix all season long. If it happens that way and they fall short, it will be a disappointment, but at least we'll have seen an entertaining several months of hockey, rather then sleepwalking through October - February and making a little run in March when it's too late, the fans have already tuned them out, and the building is empty.

These pictures add a lot of color to the discussion. After seeing these, I would agree that Tuch was effectively picked when Keller circled back and that Quinn was in a position to see this develop and should have had the sense to step up and take Keller. Kudos to the UT coaching staff for putting together a nice play - looks like a pick and roll in basketball (except that there was no pass - the "rolling" player kept the puck) - and the opposite to the Sabres coaching staff who did not have their guys ready for such a scenario. Yet another thing for the Sabres to work on in film study and practice.

Arizona. The Utah games are blacked out here but I thought I could end around the blackout with a VPN connection. Plus, typically for blacked out games, the game is listed, but it is marked as blacked out. That said, the game wasn't even listed. I looked for it on ESPN+ on my phone, TV, and tablet and it appeared in none of them. I looked at "Live," "Power Play," and "On Demand. I even did a search for "Sabres" and got all previous games, all upcoming games, and highlights from last night's game, but not last night's game itself. This seems to happen to me once or twice every season - a game that undoubtedly is available on ESPN+ just doesn't show up for me. Very strange. I had never tried the VPN before for this, so I didn't know if it would work (sometimes they do, sometimes they don't), but never even got the opportunity to try. Given the blackout to begin with, I wasn't too disappointed, as there was only a chance the VPN would even work, so even if the game had shown up, I still might not have gotten to watch it. I tried it with the VPN on and with it off, and in neither case did the game appear. Of course, it shows up today (see image below), but it was nowhere to be seen last night, and I gave up and saw the result. The only good thing to come out of it was that I slept much better, because I would have stayed up a couple of hours later to watch and would have been pissed off to have invested a couple of hours only to see them lose in OT (again). I'd be interested to know if other Sabrespace members have had this happen - where a game that is supposed to be available on ESPN+ simply doesn't appear (but then shows up the next day).

I was not able to see last night's game. I'm out of market and for some reason, it was not one of the available games on ESPN+. I don't have NHL Network, but I checked online and it wasn't one of their games either, so not sure what the deal was....I was able to see the replay of the OT winning goal and, of course, I'm frustrated to see a Utah player weaving around, through, and by all 3 Sabres to win the game. I don't have any context to what happened before that. What I do know is that the Sabres often get chances to win the game in OT - breakaways, 2 on 1s, 3 on 1s, etc. and can't bury the chance, whereas other teams get one opportunity and the game is over (with the exception of the Washington game in which UPL - of all players - stood tall in OT). Clearly, Tuch lost his man on the spin move and Quinn was not ready to pick him up. I'm assuming that, after all the bad OT losses recently, the Sabres players were instructed to "stay with their man" which may be why Quinn didn't step up and Dahlin wasn't able to pick up Keller either. They were presumably "shadowing" their guys while Keller was Tuch's responsibility. While it doesn't look like it would have broken this way, had Quinn and/or Dahlin stepped up to take Keller, maybe one of the other two Utah players is uncovered, jumps into the play, takes a pass from Keller and they score the winning goal? Speculation and conjecture at this point. It sounds like Lyon played a hell of a game and stole a point. Given the injuries and the fact that Utah has been good so far, maybe that's not a terrible result. On to St. Louis.

Curious who steps in. Does Östlund come back? I assume Benson will still be out.

I agree with this. Sports, like life, is cyclical. In football, it was all passing, and then, a couple of years ago, as defenses changed to defend the pass better, a lot of teams went back to focusing more on the run. The Bills and Eagles are good examples of this. The same types of things happen in hockey. Scoring trends up for a few years, then teams adjust to play more defense, new goaltending techniques and/or equipment emerge, etc. and scoring trends down. I'm curious to see what happens with goalie size. In recent years, the big 6'5" goalies like UPL were in vogue. Now it seems like there are more "average" sized goalies starting to emerge. Not sure if it's reality or just my perception. And in life - moustaches are back in style and beards have been popular in the last few years....argyle socks come and go every couple of decades....wide legged jeans, etc. I'm getting too old to stay on top of the trends (and maybe just don't give a sh*t anymore, but I can see what my kids wear). But hockey, like anything else, will shift in one direction and then reverse the trend in a few years.

This is anecdotal, but it seems to me like they're doing a better job of clearing the front of the net so that the goalies have fewer screens and can see the puck better, leading to more saves. When they don't do it, we see a lot of pucks going in (not necessarily on the PK, but in general). Lyon may also be better at seeing/tracking the puck than UPL. The opposite is true at the other end of the ice, where guys like Doan, Dunne, Kozak and others are establishing position in front of the net, screening the opponents' goalies, and leading to more goals in the net-front area and/or pucks getting through into the net because the goalies are screened.

Quoting my previous post. Finally, Rosen has flashed at the NHL level. Loved seeing him get his first NHL goal, and he overall played much better and was noticeable on the ice. I'm not sure if it's because he was used differently (playing higher up in the lineup, getting PP time, etc.) or if he has just gotten older/bigger/stronger and/or more confident. It would be great if he can maintain it, particularly with injuries to Benson and Norris. It feels odd to even mention Norris, as it really doesn't feel like he's part of the team, but he is technically part of the Sabres' top-6 and he is out with an injury. What has the team gotten from him yet - 3 games last season and two period this season? If he can return and remain healthy for the rest of the season, I would consider that a bonus, at this point. But back to the original point of the post - congrats to Rosen!

The news of Rosen's recall preceded the news of Benson going to IR. The original post was only about the Rosen recall and had no mention of the Benson IR move (it was merged/updated later), hence the banter on Rosen.

Östlund was sent down (or "loaned" to Rochester, if there's a difference). I've been unimpressed with what I have seen from Rosen to date. When he's been in Buffalo, he's been fairly invisible on the ice. He doesn't generate offense, he doesn't appear to do anything defensively, he's not hitting people, he's not driving play. Hopefully, he's improved and will add more value on this callup than in previous ones. Typically, I think that patience is required with the development of many young players, but usually they show SOMETHING when they get called up. Guys might not score a lot, but are hitting people, or are making plays, pressuring the other team with their speed, etc. Guys like Thompson and Mittlestadt were not good in their early games with the Sabres, but at least demonstrated something. Thompson has unteachable size and his puck dangling, Mittlestadt showed good hands. Devon Levi has had some sharp games. Ryan Johnson has shown some ability to skate well and to get the puck up ice. Not consistently, but flashes of what might happen in the future when they're more mature and stronger. I have seen no such flash from Rosen.

Sadly, Lyon's performance in the Boston game last night was not a whole lot different from a typical UPL performance. He made some saves, he let in some goals that most goalies would let in. When push came to shove, he was not able to make the biggest saves when needed. He was not a difference maker in the game. I fully agree that Lyon was a difference maker in some of the early games (including games they lost where he kept them in the game when the had no business being in it). That said, Lyon is an OK NHL goalie who had a hot run. I don't think he can be counted on to be the full-time starter for the rest of the season. I suppose that you could argue that what Lyon gives is equivalent to what UPL gives, at a much cheaper salary, and use that to justify trying to move on from UPL. Ellis is interesting, because he's only played 1 NHL game. Nobody really knows what he is or what he could become. He has proven talent at the AHL level and played well in his one NHL start. In the end, I think we're stuck with the 3-headed monster for a while. And while I realize that these guys are largely hung out to dry in the 3 on 3 OTs, wouldn't it be something if a Sabres goalie, ANY Sabres goalie, made a key game-saving save in an OT period? Somehow the opponents are able to get those saves when the Sabres get the breakaway or 3 on 1 in OT, but the Sabres are not. Maybe the Sabres shooters are just not very good....

Interesting take. I wonder if one or more of Ellis, Levi, Leinonen, Ratzlaff, Leenders, and Prokhorov will develop into a quality NHL starting goalie. Ellis and Levi are much further along, so we'll probably have answers on them sooner. If given a shot, Ellis could do so this season. Lyon looks good right now, but is likely to regress to his average, and UPL, people forget, is still only 26 himself, has flashed in spots, and many goalies bloom in their late 20s/early 30s, so he might still have a future. The problem the Sabres have is that they need to get to the playoffs now, or risk their stars wanting to be traded and starting a rebuild all over AGAIN, as has happened with the last couple rounds of stars they've had. They may not have time to wait and see what UPL might develop into, which means that if Lyon doesn't continue his stellar play and/or Ellis doesn't emerge, it could spell trouble.

Agreed. Back to more cliches, you have to learn to walk before you learn to run. Given all the missteps of the recent past, the Sabres have to learn how to walk before they learn to run. Being competitive and consistent, and getting into the playoffs (even as an 8 seed and losing in the 1st round), is to me, learning to walk, and the step this team needs to take. If the younger players develop and/or are flipped for quality veterans, maybe then the team can rise to the next level of being a serious contender down the road. THIS current roster, THIS season, is not going to rise to that level. Sure, there are rare teams that make a huge leap in one season and make a magical run to the finals, but that's an unrealistic expectation for this team. The issue that I have, and I think a lot of fans have, is that with the year under Granato when they finished 1 point out of a playoff spot (which I think was the season ending in April 2023), they looked like they had learned to walk, and taken that step, and were ready to advance to the next steps. Rather than capitalizing on the moment, management sat on its hands and did very little to improve the team to keep the momentum going, instead doing nothing and regressing the next 2 seasons. So now we're trying to work forward, starting from the point they have regressed to, rather from where they were in April of 2023.

Agree. There are several encouraging signs, but they are not "there" yet. In a way, it's a positive that they're getting a couple of "loser" points that they didn't get last season, but they are called "loser" points for a reason, as in the end, they're losing the 2nd point by losing the game in OT or shootout (in both of this year's games so far, OT). In my opinion, they need to win at least half of the OT/shootout games to get over the hump. If they continue to play pretty well, but fail to win some of these types of games, they will fall short of the playoffs again.

I don't disagree with you, but we can't reverse the trades. They've happened. So the best we can hope for is some kind of positive outcome down the road. There's no question that a roster with all those top players (and a good coach) would be much better than what's on the ice today, but again, the horse is out of the barn. The ship has sailed. Jack Eichel and Sam Reinhart are not going to come walking through that door. (I'm out of cliches...) All we can do is hope that things are better for the current team than they've been in the recent past and that the younger players acquired in past deals will ultimately develop and help the team, or be flipped for assets that can help the current team. A six or seven game stretch is not enough of a sample size to give a definitive answer, but if the team plays the way they have the last 2 weeks for the remainder of the season, they have a good chance of making the playoffs as one of the lower seeds. They're not a legitimate Stanley Cup contender, but can be competitive. It's not necessarily better than what could have been, but it may be a step in the right direction given what we've seen in the last few years. And they still have the 2nd youngest roster in the league, so there's a lot of growth opportunities with the guys they currently have (or, with assets acquired by flipping them for more experienced players).

I agree with most of this post, but I don't think that Levi was the centerpiece on the Reinhart deal. The centerpiece return was a 1st round draft pick, which has turned into Kulich. Levi was a piece of the deal, but more of a throw in because Florida had a glut of goalies, with Bob, Spencer Knight, and I think even Lyon at that point (not sure about the timing on Lyon). They may have had even another young goalie in the system at the time. I'm sure that Levi was important to the Sabres at the time, but I don't think he was the centerpiece. Right now, with Reinhart's success, this looks like a bad deal for the Sabres, but maybe in a few years if Kulich develops into a top flight forward and Levi into a starting goaltender, and Reinhart slows down due to age, it will look better for the Sabres, similar to the O'Reilly trade. In the early years of that trade, O'Reilly was leading the Blues to the Stanley Cup, while Thompson was struggling to establish himself as an NHL player. The other guys the Sabres got from St. Louis were beyond busts. Now, with Thompson being one of the top goal scorers in the league, the trade had aged much better for Buffalo, as O'Reilly is an older player on the downside of his career. It will be a couple or more years before we'll know.

I agree with comments above: if, in fact, he's going to play, and he's going to be in one of the top 3 pairings (there are only 3 that play in the game, which we all know), shouldn't he be practicing with the top 3 pairings, and more specifically, with his defense partner for the upcoming game? Same would apply to any player who is returning from injury and set to appear in a game - practice on your pair/line with your partner/linemates.

In hindsight, most here agree that the Sabres overreacted to UPL's great half-season in 2024 when they gave him the big contract and made him the unquestioned starter. Would it also be an overreaction to dump UPL after Lyon has played well for 3 weeks? And Ellis played well in ONE start? UPL was bad last year, and I just had a feeling that he would not be able to step up and hold the lead in the last Toronto game. Sadly, he proved me right. The Toronto tying goal could have/should have been stopped and, while it's true that stopping a Hall of Fame forward on a breakaway in OT is a lot to ask, sometimes your goalie has to make a big play for the team to win the game, and UPL did not have it in him. So what I'm saying is that I'm not super high on UPL right now, but getting rid of him at this point because Lyon has played well for 3 weeks and Ellis for 1 game would be an overreaction. They need to roll with 3, as bad as that might be, and see how things shake out. UPL is STILL only 25, and many goalies don't hit their prime until closer to 30 (and some after 30).

I think he's going to be a good one and it's a positive that they are giving him the proper time to develop. It's been so rare in recent years to see this organization make a good decision that it's almost odd to recognize it when they do.

And if UPL does NOT regain his 2024 form, the team appears to have solid alternatives (although it's too soon to know much about Ellis and even Lyon's sample size is small).

If UPL regains his 2024 form, it's a good problem to have. Lyon has been great so far and Ellis looked very good in his single appearance. While managing 3 is not great, I'd rather the team be managing 3 good players than having to debate the likes of Carter Hutton, Houser, etc. (no disrespect to Houser intended, who was a good story). Not sure if I want to throw Comrie onto that list, as he's a good fit for Winnipeg as a backup, but he was pretty bad in Buffalo.

The thread is not premature. I wrote it. I used words like "so far," "small sample size," "if...turns out to be," "don't want to be unrealistic," etc. The idea was to take the temperature of the board on the comparison as it sits right now. As a fan that's watched a few games so far, the thought has crossed my mind how Doan's impact & value compares to Peterka's, and based on the responses, it appears to have crossed others' minds too. While Doan is more than a "throw in," it's not really debatable that Kesselring was the main piece coming back to the Sabres in the trade. If Doan brings more to the team than Peterka brought, exclusive of what Kesselring eventually brings (or doesn't bring, as may be the case), it would be pretty remarkable. And, based on what we've seen SO FAR, it's entirely possible.