oddoublee
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Posts posted by oddoublee
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i am all for this. i do believe KA will keep him one more year - and reduce the buyout to 4 years instead of 6. plus - if he finishes strong this year - and gets hot next year - the odds of getting a draft pick for him go up since his long term cost goes way down. KA will have to retain a little salary - but...could be worth it.
all of that said - if they buy him out this offseason - i will sing to the high heavens.
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36 minutes ago, Pimlach said:
So far, this trade made a bigger hole than what it filled. I think more acquisitions must happen.
We need two more centers. A 4C and a 2/3C. I do not see our prospects pool having NHL ready centers next season.
Our defense with EJ out, Byram in just got younger
Bo Dahlin
Power Muel
Johnson Clifton
Joker Bryson.
couldnt agree with you more. minus a serious move to address the forward position at the deadline or summer - this trade does not improve the team in the near term
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19 minutes ago, Doohickie said:
I doubt it.
while i doubt it as well - i am not 100% certain of that. most lefties struggle to play their best at RHD (which is why right handed defensemen are so coveted and hard to acquire).
i think if power can be moved for a legit top 6/first line forward - that may be hard to pass up, especially if they believe in their new acquisition and see moving power as an opportunity to clear a little salary for other moves.
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24 minutes ago, Sabres Fan in NS said:
Dylan is a reasonably solid #2 centre.
Sorry for the confusion on the salary - I was unclear in my post that Nill responded to.
i like dylan - i just notice he is considerably better on the wing - and legit as a top 6 forward. i dont think he solves our long term issue with solidifying the 'spine' of the forward groups.
but i seem to be in the minority as most fans believe our 1 and 2 C is set
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4 minutes ago, SHAAAUGHT!!! said:
Not sure about that. Byram was a major piece on a cup team, performed exceptionally well, and unfortunately has had a few concussions. The Ave’s already have the best defensemen in the league eating up minutes and they know they will eventually have to pay Byram if he continues his trajectory. The Ave’s also needed forwards badly.
The Sabres have their top 2 centers locked up long-term and Casey isn’t the type of bottom 6 center we need.
I expect both players will do well on and for their new teams, and both teams will be better for it. Plus this finally gets that 10-ply pretender Joker off this team.they have a 1 and 2 center on paper. not in reality. tage is the only legit top 6 center this team has.
5 minutes ago, Buffalonill said:He makes 7.3 a year ? Wtf
no, that was his total contract value. he makes approx 3.8 a year
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I'm going to go out on a limb, just a gut call.
I see the sabres trading someone like mitts. I get the sense we are looking for more young left handed defensemen that have a ceiling yet to be reached.
This take probably doesn't age well...but whatevs. I think it happens.
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15 minutes ago, nfreeman said:
Like most GMs, I think KA is more inclined to trade guys he inherited (like Mitts) than guys he chose -- but would they really reduce their limited supply of RHD? It's an interesting question.
Now if they wanted to trade a RHD -- Power, Savoie and a #1 for Tkachuk?
In any case I would love another big move, although I fear it won't matter until a new coach is brought in.
This thought crossed my mind as well...
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6 hours ago, oddoublee said:
all for the positive take - it is not all gloom and doom. cozens and tage are good - although i am not as high on cozens at center - not higher than casey at center at the very least.
in a nutshell, that is where we differ. I think Casey is our 2 C - and with him we are still a C short.
Now if we take away the C's and the W's in this argument (as mitts and cozens can play both at a top 6 level) - we are still short a legit top 6 player.
At D, feel our biggest problem (pre Byram even) was their age. Very young - and always thought it would mature into a good group in a couple years. Personally feel our top 6 and depth in Rochester/Juniors is overrated, and is now weaker.
Legit Top 6 - Tage, Cozens, Tuch, Peterka and possibly JJ (candidly, we do not know yet with him, it is a guess). Skinner is a 3rd line winger on a good team - getting more than 15 minutes, if, and only if your team is losing going into the 3rd period. Greenway is bottom 6. Krebs is bottom 6. Benson is bottom 6, with top 6 potential in a couple years - we are thinner than people think at Forward.
Feel free to offer your take Hank. More than willing to debate
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6 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:
Byram is so young, but 2 years ago he played great in the playoffs for Colorado. So, without concussions, he could be one of those good-to-very-good D-men at an accelerated age. He has those worrying concussions, but when you watched his entire playoff run 2 years ago, he looked like he could be a star on the back end.
Pluse he's a player. An actual Player who had at least one great playoff run individually, he's not another 'draft pick' that we can look forward to in a few years. He's a guy that has injury issues, but has had some great games as a young guy that we get to see play now.
Plus Mitts, is he better than Cozens or Tage? To me, when everyone is healthy, I think ultimately he is the 3rd center on this team, which means he isn't going to be a guy that gets 1st line Power play time for the rest of his career. I guess Mitts "may" deserver $6-$7m per year, but I don't want to give that to a 3rd guy who is likely to get closer to 3rd line minutes.
It also seems like there are a LOT of posters here criticizing the Sabres for thinking Cozens and Tage were better than they were, making the case they simply had 'career' years.....can't the same thinking be applied to Mitts this year? Difference is, Tage's 'career' year was almost 50 goals. Cozens was 30+ goals when he was 22. Mitts current season 'could' be a career year when he is on a 20 goal pace already at his age 25 season.
As for the D-group....Maybe Dahlin wears down with his heavy minutes. Power too. Samuelsson is injured all the time. Maybe, MAYBE bringing in another young, highly regarded guy...you can reduce the minutes of everyone (spreading them out among the whole group) and make them all better/less likely to be injured.
I'm trying to look at this in a positive way. The negative thinking (I got negative in a BIG way with Cozens earlier this season) and the negativity of this board finally got to me about 2 weeks ago and I'm choosing to look at the positive side of things.
all for the positive take - it is not all gloom and doom. cozens and tage are good - although i am not as high on cozens at center - not higher than casey at center at the very least.
in a nutshell, that is where we differ. I think Casey is our 2 C - and with him we are still a C short.
Now if we take away the C's and the W's in this argument (as mitts and cozens can play both at a top 6 level) - we are still short a legit top 6 player.
At D, feel our biggest problem (pre Byram even) was their age. Very young - and always thought it would mature into a good group in a couple years. Personally feel our top 6 and depth in Rochester/Juniors is overrated, and is now weaker.
Legit Top 6 - Tage, Cozens, Tuch, Peterka and possibly JJ (candidly, we do not know yet with him, it is a guess). Skinner is a 3rd line winger on a good team - getting more than 15 minutes, if, and only if your team is losing going into the 3rd period. Greenway is bottom 6. Krebs is bottom 6. Benson is bottom 6, with top 6 potential in a couple years - we are thinner than people think at Forward.
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20 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:
I guess I'm almost alone in this, but I'm looking forward to seeing Byram play when he suits up. Makes me want to watch the games a bit more than if no moves were made.
i typically enjoy your takes - and still do! but i dont see it here. this team needs more veteran top 6 players - not less. the pipeline and krebs is all well and good - but they are not, nor guaranteed to be better than mitts.
offensively, as of now, this team is worse off for the next 2 years (based on no additional significant moves being made, of course).
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2 hours ago, mjd1001 said:
I could see Zemgus and Robinson being moved if there is a market for them (not sure what it would be for Robinson but I think Zemgus could get a mid-level prospect or a mid round pick), and I think they could still be resigned next year if they are moved. A player like that, a team isn't going to trade for a 4th liner and then make it a priority to extend them.
Okposo. Yes, I think he has lost a step skating this year, but I actually think he will be in demand. Someone who supposedly is respected around the NHL, a guy that teamates like enough to be captain, on pace for 16-17 goals WITH limited minutes. If you are a playoff team looking for an upgrade on your 4th line...maybe even if you have holes on your 3rd line, he would be someone that might be at the top of lists of shoppers.
Another thing to consider...contracts. The Sabres have a lot of prospects already, and I'm pretty sure the NHL has a limit on the total number of contracts a team can give out. You keep accumulating later round picks....a lot of those are basically going to be thrown away if in a couple years you have a draft class of 10 guys and you only have room to sign a couple. With that said, unless you get a bunch of late round picks, and you take a 6th and a 7th and flip them into a late 5th. You take that 5th and package it with your 2nd to move up 3-4 spots to get the guy you want in that round. OR...I'd almost rather have those picks for 2025 and NOT 2024. If you take 2024 late round picks...they are going to get used this year. Accumulate mid-to-late round picks in 2025, and you can use those to BUY at next years deadline. You aren't buying at this years deadline.
definitely a market for Z - he is a legit 4th liner any good team could benefit from. all the more reason i am cool with the sabres keeping him. if they get a 3rd or 4th - and then resign him, homerun.
great point on contracts and not talked about enough - always been my main concern with GM's who overvalue and/or overprotect their high-level prospects. you cannot keep them all, plus future draft picks. why would a GM want to keep all those gambles anyway?
i do not think KA will do it - but i would be in love with the idea of seeing a couple high draft picks and a few high-level prospects go for a couple vets with 2 years of term. which prospects? candidly, don't care. none are 'sure' things.
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Kyle and EJ.
VO - there will be no takers.
Joker will be to expensive
Girgs and ER stay, as I think KA will want to resign them both.
This team really needs a Top 6 forward. More scoring options needed to free up Tage - and Vet depth is needed for when players like Tuch and Quinn are out - or Skinner is on a cold spell. Our current depth is way way too young.
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1 hour ago, Archie Lee said:
Injuries and poor usage derailed his career; he did not need to be relegated to 4th line duty by the Housley years. We could have used 4-5 more players with his character and skills.
i agree with this - i dont know if we are in agreement with what i am about to say - but i always thought he was under utilized on the power play here. it was one of his strengths early in his career - and always preferred him on the PP over skinner (not interchangeably, but in high level theory). good positioning, angles and possession are key, and he has those. never understood why we didnt use him more.
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5 minutes ago, inkman said:
They can bring in Jesus himself to coach these guys and it won’t matter. They need a heart transplant. The guy relaying the message matters, see Ralph Krueger, but until they bring in players with the guts and determination to do the little things it takes to win, they will be losers.
In fact, if they don’t move out one or more of Tage, Skinner, Dahlin, Power or Mittelstadt, this team ain’t going nowhere’s as my buddy Paul Hamilton would say.
if all of our forwards played the puck as aggressively against the boards as mitts, this would be a different team. That said, i do not disagree on skinner. he is a horrible example for the younger players on how to play complete hockey. move(buy) him out - bring a couple of B level two way players in.....AND add a new coach....AND maybe, just maybe, this team can finish above .500
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5 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:
So, I know that things can change..but...those people who, just a month ago... wanted to sign him/offer him 2-3 years at close to $2m per year....that might not be possible anymore.
It's 3.5 at the floor. Steal some of his ufa, and you are over 5. If I'm his agent, I'm using recent history against this front office. Fan base has no patience regarding the goalie position...and team has signed multiple rfas to good deals.
He's gonna cost more than fans are prepared for...
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6 hours ago, Dr. Who said:
Rosen, Cozens, Kulich, and next years first.
If they feel like they 'have to' move him...this isn't far off. Probably throw in a second rounder as well. The first would probably be a protected first this year.
If they are just getting feelers...it will take that minus one of the prospects and replace them with someone like quinn or JJ.
With the cap issues teams have, it's hard to pay more and expect much more than you proposed.
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2 hours ago, WhenWillItEnd66 said:
A few thoughts and observations:
- I know Skinner and Tuch scored, but that line looks horrible and disorientated on 5v5
- This team needs some serious sandpaper. 1 forward and 1 dman. We were getting physically dominated and that was embarrassing
- 3rd period was weird. We did not get a shot on goal until maybe 7 or 8 minutes left in the period and the Habs had the puck, but there was not many Hab serious scoring chances with the exception of the accidental redirect by our own player that 6K made that beautiful save. Once we got our shot on goal, we wasted a lot of time in the Habs offensive end and it was nice.
- Love to see the wheels that the kids seem to show at short burst, but this team seems overall slower than last year.
- PK looks good and focussed and PP is still a hot mess. I know Skinner scored but when the other team stacks the line, the Sabres are seriously lost. Thompson is going to get his PP goals but the whole PP needs a serious revamp!
- 6K is finally emerging!!! Happy for him. Thought he was done after the double surgery.
It is fun to watch the games now that we are out of the playoff race and just watch with zero expectation. Maybe one year....LOL
good observations - while the fancy stats show the first line played well - they did look out of sync. It does not seem like there is any rhyme or reason to what they are doing out there ( I feel that way about all the lines for what it is worth). The structure is noticeably bad.
So, yes, the fancy stats say you are wrong - but you are right. Their talent bails them out sometimes - but not always...
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9 hours ago, JoeSchmoe said:
After 37 games this year, unless there are active members of the Sabres with burner accounts on here, the entirety of this message board is currently tied with ZG in assists for the 2023-24 season.
the sabres are not paying him for offense. that they pay tage, cozens, skinner, tuch, quinn, jj, mitts to do that. i will give quinn a pass for obvious reasons. if the 4th line combined has 15 goals on the season, i will take it. that line, and z, is not the problem.
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i am too lazy this morning to find the appropriate GIF - but if i wasn't, it would express 'tired indifference' towards this game
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1 hour ago, Doohickie said:
Benson is a curious choice for an untouchable player. Yes, he looks good when he plays, but he's an undersized teen with 4 goals and 10 assists in 40 games. What about that screams "untouchable"?
I agree with you - Benson can be moved if the price is right.
The only players I believe they should be building around are Tage, Mitts, Quinn, Peterka, Dahlin, Powers, UPL and ... that is it.
Cozens, Tuch, Samuelson, Benson, Savoie, Kulich, Rosen, Levi, Östlund are all term players we should consider moving if the return is right. Any players with FA pending goes without saying - although a Girgs trade and resign would be good by me.
If three of the mentioned players above plus a few draft picks can be turned into 4-6 legit NHL ready players - go for it. The teams veteran depth is putrid enough to warrant it.
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Awesome idea for a thread!
Better: Girgs. Perfect 4th line player. His stone hands are real...but he skates fast, to the net, and gets back on D. Sign him again this off-season.
Better: Power. His contract is a Trainwreck. Not his fault. Not our fault. He has the body of a teenaged giraffe. His best hockey for us is 2 or 3 years away.
Better: Only because it seems 50% of the board is ready to move on still...Mitts. So much so, I think he is the teams best all around center. Which leads me to the next...
Worse: Cozens. Contract was a massive overreaction by the front office. To be fair, not his fault. He should have been bridged at best. Or Mitts should have been given 7 million, with Cozens being used to solve our top 4 D and/or bottom 6 lack of depth issue. He is a 3 C/ top 9 F on a playoff team as of now. We over committed.
Worse: Dahlin. Although based on the posts, I am not as alone as I thought. His D responsibility is poor. Not being cruel...it is simply poor. He hangs on in the offensive zone way to long. He is virtually useless during important D zone faceoffs. Thank God he is still young and can improve still.
Worse: Skinner. Wonderful goal scorer. But he is horribly irresponsible on both ends of the ice. Terrible on ice role model on a young team. On a good team, he is a 5 million dollar player getting 12-13 minutes a night. I was a defender of him in the past... watching him more closely, I have soured this year.
Worse: Levi. Been saying it since the summer. He belongs in Rochester for 1-2 years. He is all about habit and structure. College hockey allows that more easily. The NHL does not. Always was going to be a rude awakening for him and his desire for zen. He needs time to learn to be an adult pro. (If the Sabres don't F it up, I'm bullish on him).
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1 hour ago, PerreaultForever said:
Tear out all the luxuries in the locker room. No ipads. No games. No between the stalls. No frills. No spas. You want it? You f'n earn it and then it'll come back and not before.
Half agree with you on #5. Not sure nice ***** needs to be taken away. In terms of education and physical health - they should have top of the line and readily available equipment.
That said - always felt the lockerroom and entry way to the ice was a bit too country club in its design. I am more on board with workman like aesthetics - but high level treatment and equipment.
Create an environment that makes the players more excited to take the ice than hangout in their lounge with the boys. State of the art system that creates best ice in the league? I would put more money into that than even making the fan experience better. Fans will come if you are winning...even if the beef on weck sucks!
I digress...
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3 hours ago, phil_soisson said:
"...behind the scenes, they should be strongly evaluating...". Who is "they"? The deep state? I suspect "they" is, and has been, the problem.
sure. but who else is going to do it? hope is all we have - that and bitching and complaining!
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I don't know if a 100% blowup is necessary with this team - but a shot across the bow would be hard to argue against.
Head Coach - let him finish out the season. But behind the scenes, they should be strongly evaluating what they want out of a head coach - and create a list of people who fit their defined criteria.
Current Players - IMO, I believe Cozens is their best trade chip. I like him. He will do well. But I believe Mitts is better - more well rounded - and at a perfect age. If Skinner can be moved at a 50% retention - they should do it. So fun to watch him score goals - but he plays irresponsible hockey. He is not a good playing role model for the young players. EJ and OX will be gone next year - so be it. Devon - KEEP HIM IN ROCHESTER. Let him have a year, or two, where he is the leader and getting all the reps on a contending team. He is not going to get that in the NHL. Is he better than Comrie? Sure, by a little. But not enough so that he should skip the proper development stages.
Future Players - Vets are good to have. But they have to be Vets who can produce. OX and EJ are no different than Gionta. You can only lead so much if you cannot produce on the ice at a high level. This team needs 2-3 players - aged 29-33 - that can produce. A veteran mix of players that the young players can role model themselves to ON THE ICE. Probably have to overpay by 15-20% - but that is the cost until you become a proven winner.
GM - I would keep KA for one more offseason. But the management of Devon - and his inability to close on producing vets via free agency is a red flag. Not talking about 35 goal scorers - talking legit bottom 6 players that can slide into the top 6 when necessary. We are lacking that...
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Buyout of Jeff Skinner Numbers
in The Aud Club
Posted
good assessment. i still struggle to think of him as a top 6 winger in terms of minutes. my impression has always been he is a 3rd line minutes guy....UNLESS...your team is down 2 goals going into the 3rd. then you play the living crap out of him looking to strike gold.
his style of play would make a head coach in the playoffs go absolutely nuts.