Kevyn Adams Speaks

[dudacek]

12 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Most is the negativity came from the fact that Kevyn Adams made the picks.

People have short memories.

People who think Kevyn Adams was despised in June of 2023 have short memories.

[Taro T]

11 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Most is the negativity came from the fact that Kevyn Adams made the picks.

People have short memories.

No doubt.  But seriously don't understand your take that "everyone hated" the Benson pick.  Literally went back and reread the 1st 3 pages of the thread dedicated to that pick to see if my impression that people liked the pick was incorrect.  But it doesn't seem to be.

Perhaps you could clarify how you reached that conclusion.

That thread is here:  

And the '23 draft thread is here: 

 

What are we missing that you see so clearly?

[PromoTheRobot]

43 minutes ago, Taro T said:

No doubt.  But seriously don't understand your take that "everyone hated" the Benson pick.  Literally went back and reread the 1st 3 pages of the thread dedicated to that pick to see if my impression that people liked the pick was incorrect.  But it doesn't seem to be.

Perhaps you could clarify how you reached that conclusion.

That thread is here:  

And the '23 draft thread is here: 

 

What are we missing that you see so clearly?

They hated it because of the GM making the pick.

[Mango]

1 hour ago, tom webster said:

Howie Roseman was an attorney before he was the best GM in football. I don’t know what Forton did to you but the guy is responsible for all the depth that everyone is raving about. If Jarmo wants to bring in his own guy, Forton will be hired in a New York minute. His resume is gold.

Was Howie buds with Lurie before he bought the Eagles? And during that time did Rosman float around the organization during one of the worst runs in NHL history for nearly an entire generation.

People continue to take snippets without zooming out to Pegulas full on failures. Forton has been a part of that since the very beginning. 

The guy went from literal volunteer assistant to assistant coach in the NHL purely because he's buddy's with the owner.

For me Forton would have to be a generational talent evaluator to not tear him out of the org. It's bad practice from the top down.

If the org is serious about continuing on with Pegula as the defacto hockey ops guy they'll remove Forton and the like. If they're not they'll keep him around. 

 

[PromoTheRobot]

1 minute ago, Mango said:

Was Howie buds with Lurie before he bought the Eagles? And during that time did Rosman float around the organization during one of the worst runs in NHL history for nearly an entire generation.

People continue to take snippets without zooming out to Pegulas full on failures. Forton has been a part of that since the very beginning. 

The guy went from literal volunteer assistant to assistant coach in the NHL purely because he's buddy's with the owner.

For me Forton would have to be a generational talent evaluator to not tear him out of the org. It's bad practice from the top down.

If the org is serious about continuing on with Pegula as the defacto hockey ops guy they'll remove Forton and the like. If they're not they'll keep him around. 

 

You aren't making a very strong case.

[Mango]

1 hour ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

So I guess this season was just a happy accident.  And Jarmo is just Kevyn 2.0?

This is trash and you know it. Forton was brought on within 600 days of Terry buying the team. He was a BS college assistant coach who became an NHL coach overnight because of who he had Sunday dinner.

A mid season fire isn't comparable.

[LGR4GM]

1 hour ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Most is the negativity came from the fact that Kevyn Adams made the picks.

People have short memories.

You're making ***** about that Benson pick. Also what about Helenius and Mrtka? 

No one gives a ***** that Adams made the picks as long as they are good. Ftr, I don't love the Mrtka pick. 

[Taro T]

30 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

They hated it because of the GM making the pick.

PLEASE show examples of this.  You keep saying that.  But personally didn't see ANY (well, very little, at most) hatred of the Benson pick.  What I didn't recall and upon rereading haven't seen is that "everyone hated" the Benson pick.  Have given you direct access to 2 of the places where the bulk of the immediate responses occurred and, as mentioned repeatedly, have not seen that personally.

If you can show us examples, cool, will freely admit the memory of this kid had been clouded if you can do so.  But, if not, you might consider another question, that of why?

Truly not trying to argue.  Am trying to understand your point of view on this.  But am not seeing what you claim to have seen.  And, when we can't even agree on the facts of the matter, it is hard to have an evenhanded discussion.

[tom webster]

9 minutes ago, Mango said:

This is trash and you know it. Forton was brought on within 600 days of Terry buying the team. He was a BS college assistant coach who became an NHL coach overnight because of who he had Sunday dinner.

A mid season fire isn't comparable.

You keep talking about twelve years ago. Who cares. I’ve hired plenty of people on a hunch, on a belief that they were right for the position. History has shown there’s no science to hiring anyone but especially coaching. Prior experience isn’t always required and sometimes is even a detriment. But again, who cares. He’s been great at the job he is doing right now. 
The only thing about this that intrigues me is wondering if you were personally injured by his initial hiring.

[LGR4GM]

4 minutes ago, Taro T said:

PLEASE show examples of this.  You keep saying that.  But personally didn't see ANY (well, very little, at most) hatred of the Benson pick.  What I didn't recall and upon rereading haven't seen is that "everyone hated" the Benson pick.  Have given you direct access to 2 of the places where the bulk of the immediate responses occurred and, as mentioned repeatedly, have not seen that personally.

If you can show us examples, cool, will freely admit the memory of this kid had been clouded if you can do so.  But, if not, you might consider another question, that of why?

Truly not trying to argue.  Am trying to understand your point of view on this.  But am not seeing what you claim to have seen.  And, when we can't even agree on the facts of the matter, it is hard to have an evenhanded discussion.

Most ppl here don't get to worked up over drafts. Not me, I get worked up. 

Adams drafting was solid, not great but also far from bad. He had some great picks in the 1st round. I typically believe 2nd round guys and later are barely influenced by the GM directly. You hire ppl and they build that list. 

[Nacho Libre]

1 minute ago, LGR4GM said:

Most ppl here don't get to worked up over drafts. Not me, I get worked up. 

Adams drafting was solid, not great but also far from bad. He had some great picks in the 1st round. I typically believe 2nd round guys and later are barely influenced by the GM directly. You hire ppl and they build that list. 

Exactly

 

[Mango]

6 minutes ago, tom webster said:

You keep talking about twelve years ago. Who cares. I’ve hired plenty of people on a hunch, on a belief that they were right for the position. History has shown there’s no science to hiring anyone but especially coaching. Prior experience isn’t always required and sometimes is even a detriment. But again, who cares. He’s been great at the job he is doing right now. 
The only thing about this that intrigues me is wondering if you were personally injured by his initial hiring.

When you hired that person as a hunch, did your team experience generational failure or no?

[tom webster]

17 minutes ago, Mango said:

Was Howie buds with Lurie before he bought the Eagles? And during that time did Rosman float around the organization during one of the worst runs in NHL history for nearly an entire generation.

People continue to take snippets without zooming out to Pegulas full on failures. Forton has been a part of that since the very beginning. 

The guy went from literal volunteer assistant to assistant coach in the NHL purely because he's buddy's with the owner.

For me Forton would have to be a generational talent evaluator to not tear him out of the org. It's bad practice from the top down.

If the org is serious about continuing on with Pegula as the defacto hockey ops guy they'll remove Forton and the like. If they're not they'll keep him around. 

 

Dude, hiring people you know is what happens and I guarantee you no one other than you looks down on the Sabres because Jerry Forton breaks bread with the Pegulas. The organization is bringing in massive amounts of revenue and is now bringing more money than half the league. As much as you might dismiss TPEGS, the business of the Sabres has never been better. The funny thing is the only reason Forton may move on is because Jarmo might want to bring in someone he regularly has dinner with.

[Taro T]

Just now, LGR4GM said:

Most ppl here don't get to worked up over drafts. Not me, I get worked up. 

Adams drafting was solid, not great but also far from bad. He had some great picks in the 1st round. I typically believe 2nd round guys and later are barely influenced by the GM directly. You hire ppl and they build that list. 

And admittedly am not a draft guy, though with the Sabres seasons being less than satisfying for well over a decade, paid reasonable attention to the draft.  And this discussion could morph into something more interesting towards how Adams top picks fared vs expected, how his 2nd & 3rd rounds fared vs expected, and how his reaches fared vs expected.

But maybe truly did miss something and misremembered the Benson selection.  Recalled a lot of people here being high on him because of seeing him play when trying to follow Savoie's progress.  Personally was pleased when the Sabres chose him because people were making it seem that he has "it."  Watching him since, would agree.  There is something special about that kid.  But don't recall the pick being hated and am truly curious about that perspective.

[Mango]

5 minutes ago, tom webster said:

Dude, hiring people you know is what happens and I guarantee you no one other than you looks down on the Sabres because Jerry Forton breaks bread with the Pegulas. The organization is bringing in massive amounts of revenue and is now bringing more money than half the league. As much as you might dismiss TPEGS, the business of the Sabres has never been better. The funny thing is the only reason Forton may move on is because Jarmo might want to bring in someone he regularly has dinner with.

That didn't answer the question.

You keep saying hiring guys on a hunch or hiring guys you know is a thing that happens sometimes. 

I get it.

People are relating to teams they've built.

The question is, when you've hired a guy you know on a hunch or a guy you know (who is wildly under qualified at the point of hire) was your team/business historically bad/under performing for 14 years?

Because that's the real world congruency. It isn't the "well this one time I hired this guy and it worked out".

You have to hire the guy, let him fail for a decade, and then claim victory.

EDIT: I will add that if nobody other than me look a down on Forton, I look forward to his lateral move or promotion once he leaves the Sabres. Or maybe just a single GM interview? 

 

Edited May 28 by Mango

[Nacho Libre]

1 minute ago, Taro T said:

And admittedly am not a draft guy, though with the Sabres seasons being less than satisfying for well over a decade, paid reasonable attention to the draft.  And this discussion could morph into something more interesting towards how Adams top picks fared vs expected, how his 2nd & 3rd rounds fared vs expected, and how his reaches fared vs expected.

But maybe truly did miss something and misremembered the Benson selection.  Recalled a lot of people here being high on him because of seeing him play when trying to follow Savoie's progress.  Personally was pleased when the Sabres chose him because people were making it seem that he has "it."  Watching him since, would agree.  There is something special about that kid.  But don't recall the pick being hated and am truly curious about that perspective.

Benson pick was clearly highly regarded by the majority. For some “not universally praised” is synonymous with “hated” 

[tom webster]

1 minute ago, Mango said:

When you hired that person as a hunch, did your team experience generational failure or no?

Again, you are talking about history and if you want, I’ll provide you a list of people who were mired in mediocrity and thought to be a failure who later proved to be generational. There were a lot of reasons for organizational failure but employing Forton wasn’t one of them and firing the guy who is in charge of one of the most successful departments in all of hockey because of why he was hired  is nothing short of idiotic. I’ve wasted enough time with this. You obviously feel personally injured by this man’s existence. 

[Mango]

7 hours ago, tom webster said:

Again, you are talking about history and if you want, I’ll provide you a list of people who were mired in mediocrity and thought to be a failure who later proved to be generational. There were a lot of reasons for organizational failure but employing Forton wasn’t one of them and firing the guy who is in charge of one of the most successful departments in all of hockey because of why he was hired  is nothing short of idiotic. I’ve wasted enough time with this. You obviously feel personally injured by this man’s existence. 

Hiring unqualified people to hold roles they are bad at for a decade plus is a luxury that only the C Suite has.

It can absolutely ruin teams.

If it takes the C Suite a decade to prove themselves right, then they haven't created a process that is repeatable.

Jerry Forton was unhirable pre Pegula. Jerry Forton will take a demotion if he wants to stay in the NHL post Pegula. 

Again, an org like the Sabres under Pegula, with all their failures and meddling, can't afford a Forton (or the like) long term any longer.

Purging reasonable people brought in with allegiance to bad leadership is pretty standard.

Edit: Just to confirm. You didn't hire buddy who sucked for approximately a decade, but still  got a bunch of promotions, while your entire team had historical company failure, did you?

Edited May 28 by Mango

[Broken Ankles]

3 hours ago, Nacho Libre said:

Benson pick was clearly highly regarded by the majority. For some “not universally praised” is synonymous with “hated” 

Here ye, here ye this court will now come to order.  The honorable Judge JohnC_hatGPT presiding. The court finds… Promo the Robot in violation of basic maintenance protocols and hereby orders one can of WD-40 and an immediate oil change before his next appearance in this thread.  Clear and concise evidence to support the plaintiffs that Zack Benson was overwhelmingly appreciated by Spacers everywhere. 

Chats evaluation of the official thread. 

The sentiment around the Buffalo Sabres selecting Zach Benson with the #13 pick was overwhelmingly positive initially, and it has largely remained positive — though with some growing debate about development and offensive ceiling.

Here’s the breakdown from the SabreSpace thread you linked plus broader Sabres fan discussion:

Overall sentiment: strongly positive (roughly 70–80% favorable)

The dominant fan reaction was essentially:

“We stole a top-10 talent at #13.”

Many fans viewed Benson slipping to 13 as a major draft win because pre-draft projections often had him going top 5–10.

Common phrases/themes:

“Huge W”

“Massive steal”

“Top-6 upside”

“Elite compete level”

“Dawg”

“High motor”

“Winning player”

Main positive themes

1. Fans love his compete level and hockey IQ

Even skeptical posters consistently praise:

forechecking

defensive awareness

puck battles

effort level

“plays bigger than his size”

One of the strongest recurring sentiments:

Benson “plays the game the right way.”

Sabres fans especially seem emotionally attached to his intensity because they feel the roster has lacked enough “hard-to-play-against” forwards.

 

2. Many fans believe Buffalo got value at #13

This is probably the single strongest consensus point.

Fans repeatedly mention:

he was expected top-10

some had him top-5

teams ahead of Buffalo “overthought size concerns”

One Reddit comment summarized the community feeling:

“It was a miracle he fell to us.”

3. Fans think he is unusually advanced for his age

A major positive talking point:

making the NHL immediately at age 18 as a non-elite-sized forward is rare

Many posters view that alone as evidence he was a great pick.