Sabres announce Lindy Ruff signed to a two year extension

[msw2112]

2 hours ago, Archie Lee said:

I'll be the stick in the mud. I’m mildly disappointed. I understand though that there was next to zero chance that he would be gone, unless he wanted to be gone. Still, I was hoping that he would want to move on to an advisory role or retirement.

The Sabres are one of the youngest teams in the league and are entering into what should be a window of multiple years of playoff and possibly Cup contention. As an NHL head coach, Ruff, to me, is mediocrity. In 24 seasons as an NHL head:

-          His teams have a points % of .553 and a winning % of .490* in the regular season (*for the first 7 years of his coaching career, games could end in a tie).  An average Ruff-team is barely in the wild-card mix.

-          His teams make the playoffs 50% of the time

-          His teams have a .538 winning % in playoff games and have won 13 of 25 playoff series (52%)

-          He hasn’t won a cup and has been to one cup final

-          He hasn’t made the playoffs 3 years in a row since the start of his career with the Sabres, and he hasn’t made the playoffs twice in a row since 2011

Many will dismiss the above as Ruff being dealt bad luck or bad teams for 1/2 of his career. There is some of that, to be sure, but the drop-offs are steeper than justified some years (in my view).  

I have a lot of respect for Ruff and his career as a Sabre.  He most definitely deserves his own spot in the rafters.  We had a great and fun season. Ruff being the coach that took the Sabres back to the playoffs is a great story.  I just don’t think a contending team, other than the Sabres, hires Ruff to be their head coach.

For what it's worth, Ruff has a similar record to Paul Maurice.  Maurice finally broke through with Florida and got 3 Finals and 2 Cups (before missing the playoffs this season).  Also, Ruff's record at Dallas and New Jersey showed him inheriting a poor team, building them up, having a few years of success, then declining.  If he follows that same pattern with the Sabres, he should have another good year or 2 left in him and his new contract is for 2 years.  Certain coaches have success, but push the team very hard and "lose the room" after a few years when players start tuning out the message.  That may happen with Ruff and this Sabres team, but I believe that if that actually happens, it's a couple of years away.  He'll be close to 70 by then and may be ready to retire.  

For the record, I'm a huge Lindy fan dating back to when he was a player, but was not pleased when he was hired the 2nd time around.  I felt that the coaching search was a sham and that a younger, more "current" coach would be a better fit.  Back in November, I said on this board that the game had passed him by.  I was wrong.  He did a hell of a job this season and deserves the extension that he got.  I agree with just about everyone here that a power play specialist coach should be added to the roster (even if Appert is retained for other reasons).

Edited May 20 by msw2112

[thewookie1]

2 minutes ago, msw2112 said:

For what it's worth, Ruff has a similar record to Paul Maurice.  Maurice finally broke through with Florida and got 3 Finals and 2 Cups (before missing the playoffs this season).  Also, Ruff's record at Dallas and New Jersey showed him inheriting a poor team, building them up, having a few years of success, then declining.  If he follows that same pattern with the Sabres, he should have another good year or 2 left in him and his new contract is for 2 years.  Certain coaches have success, but push the team very hard and "lose the room" after a few years when players start tuning out the message.  That may happen with Ruff and this Sabres team, but I believe that if that actually happens, it's a couple of years away.  He'll be close to 70 by then and may be ready to retire.  

For the record, I'm a huge Lindy fan dating back to when he was a player, but was not pleased when he was hired the 2nd time around.  I felt that the coaching search was a sham and that a younger, more "current" coach would be a better fit.  Back in November, I said on this board that the game had passed him by.  I was wrong.  He did a hell of a job this season and deserves the extension that he got.  I agree with just about everyone here that a power play specialist coach should be added to the roster (even if Appert is retained for other reasons).

If Lindy has one attribute that makes him great it’s his ability to adapt and change. He definitely still falls into a more “old school” role by his age but he’s unusually offensive for a guy who’s primary contemporary’s style was defensive defense. He definitely has a taskmaster style but has softened over time. And regardless if you believe Andrew Peters’ story, Lindy did something to galvanize this team around the time Adams was fired and it sent us nearly to the Conference Finals on many of our players first attempt. 
 

 

[RuffMuff]

Awesome!

[Weave]

Now on to roster tweaks!

[Taro T]

36 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

This is one of the more puzzling things to me. Not getting a coach, but how hard can it be to BE a PP coach.

The powerplay is one VERY small aspect of hockey and PP and PK are relatively simple compared to the 200 foot even strength game.  Study the best PPs in the league, what are they doing that you aren't? Study when YOU have a successful powerplay vs when you don't, what did you do vs what didn't you do?  

I have a hard time thinking that a PP coach or a PP system is a mystery that needs to be unlocked, and more that it is your players either 1.) being not good enough or 2.) not following the instructions you give them. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't get it.

Now from having a few boring nights where I watched the replays of every single powerplay goal scored across the league (done it more than a few times actually) there is something that I noticed: Most (at leat half) of the PP goals happen in a scrum around the net, people banging away at a loose puck, or on a deflection.  But there you go, get people to the net.  Why is Doan good on the PP? He goes to the net and is willing to bang away at the puck.  Zucker and Doan accounted for 19 PP goals this year between them (in 435 minutes). Tuch, Thompson, Quinn and Norris COMBINED had 19 (in 745 minutes)  Are Zucker and Doan that much more talented, have that much of a better shot than those other guys? Nope, they go to the net.

So that leaves what? Zone entries?  THAT is what you simply study every single PP in the league and figure out what the good ones do that you don't do. And then once you have the puck in the Zone, you need ONE guy screening the goalie from 5 feet out 100% of the time and preferably a 2nd one doing it most of the time also.

I know there are a few more subtleties to the PP (A guy like McDavis not only has talent, but he opens up more space because he draws more guys to him), but again, it shouldn't be that complicated.  Study the BEST PPs, study the worst ones, come up with a plan, and get your talented guys to do it.

To the bolded, have been harping on that for ages.  Chaos is where PP goals are born.  (Even when you have an Ovechkin on your PP, you need to get the defenders moving and pressured to allow for that shot to work.)  They don't score, except rarely like with Quinn's 2nd playoff goal, from a clean brilliant 1 timer.  They score off the puck getting moved (whether it be from behind the net to the front, side to side, or off a rebound or deflection.

There are so many different ways for them to be moving the puck while they are on the PP and they should be able to move it and generate chaos.  They almost NEVER use that 5 man cycle when on the PP.  Especially if Appert is a key designer of that, wtf don't they use that more on the PP?  Why not use the move that Liger is always harping to see - the play from below the goal line; whether it's moved back to the boards or into the slot or even right to the crease that forces movement by the defenders which forces chaos.

Entries.  Dahlin can stick handle the puck into the zone.  Thompson can and Byram can to an extent as well.  Expect Power should be able to do so too and would be shocked if Benson can't do so.  The staff's favorite move is dumping it to McLeod or Norris for a full ice rush while everyone is stationary.  Why not let them gain speed in other manners and actually have teammates moving as well?  A big part of the issue on entries IMHO is they honestly believe they're one of the better teams in the league at them.  Have heard Ruff state explicitly that they are one of the best teams in the league at entries (which is nuts).  They have a flawed definition of what a successful entry is.  Personally, would like them to swap the definition to they control the puck for at least 5 seconds or they get a clean high danger shot off of the entry.  Look at how other teams are getting to that and then emulate that.  Don't consider breaking over the blue line and making a single pass (which seems to be how they're defining a successful entry) to be successful in and of itself because it takes them far too long to regroup and get another crack at it.

And, don't be afraid to have at least 3 of the guys flying into the zone and dumping it in.  Benson and Doan are great along the boards.  IF he's back, so is Tuch.  Expect Helenius and Östlund will be better there than their size warrants them to be.  Use ALL these tools in your repertoire.  You no longer have Eichel to simply bring it in to whereever you want the PP to start from; but you can do a significantly better job of getting it in than they do.

And SERIOUSLY, relook at how they are determining success on the PPs they evaluate.  Am quite certain the metrics they're using to make evaluations are trash.

[...]

[ska-T Chitown]

5 minutes ago, Taro T said:

To the bolded, have been harping on that for ages.  Chaos is where PP goals are born.  (Even when you have an Ovechkin on your PP, you need to get the defenders moving and pressured to allow for that shot to work.)  They don't score, except rarely like with Quinn's 2nd playoff goal, from a clean brilliant 1 timer.  They score off the puck getting moved (whether it be from behind the net to the front, side to side, or off a rebound or deflection.

There are so many different ways for them to be moving the puck while they are on the PP and they should be able to move it and generate chaos.  They almost NEVER use that 5 man cycle when on the PP.  Especially if Appert is a key designer of that, wtf don't they use that more on the PP?  Why not use the move that Liger is always harping to see - the play from below the goal line; whether it's moved back to the boards or into the slot or even right to the crease that forces movement by the defenders which forces chaos.

Entries.  Dahlin can stick handle the puck into the zone.  Thompson can and Byram can to an extent as well.  Expect Power should be able to do so too and would be shocked if Benson can't do so.  The staff's favorite move is dumping it to McLeod or Norris for a full ice rush while everyone is stationary.  Why not let them gain speed in other manners and actually have teammates moving as well?  A big part of the issue on entries IMHO is they honestly believe they're one of the better teams in the league at them.  Have heard Ruff state explicitly that they are one of the best teams in the league at entries (which is nuts).  They have a flawed definition of what a successful entry is.  Personally, would like them to swap the definition to they control the puck for at least 5 seconds or they get a clean high danger shot off of the entry.  Look at how other teams are getting to that and then emulate that.  Don't consider breaking over the blue line and making a single pass (which seems to be how they're defining a successful entry) to be successful in and of itself because it takes them far too long to regroup and get another crack at it.

And, don't be afraid to have at least 3 of the guys flying into the zone and dumping it in.  Benson and Doan are great along the boards.  IF he's back, so is Tuch.  Expect Helenius and Östlund will be better there than their size warrants them to be.  Use ALL these tools in your repertoire.  You no longer have Eichel to simply bring it in to whereever you want the PP to start from; but you can do a significantly better job of getting it in than they do.

And SERIOUSLY, relook at how they are determining success on the PPs they evaluate.  Am quite certain the metrics they're using to make evaluations are trash.

Montreal did a much more advanced and cohesive version of "the drop" - they generally had much greater success at zone entries ... hmmmmm

[Pimlach]

3 hours ago, TageMVP said:

This is a great post that makes a lot of sense, at least to me. 

I give Ruff full credit for turning the team around, I really do. But it seems like its actually impossible for a team to win a cup with him as coach. PerreaultForever hit the nail on the head I think, he said Ruffs "changes" during the Montreal series were "reactionary". Thats 100% true. I give Ruff credit for making those changes, but all that proves is that he had a bad gameplan to begin with. And also didn't make those changes FAST ENOUGH. (Krebs off top line) That took WAY TOO LONG. I was screaming for changes after game TWO 

Here's a problem with the extension, although im glad its only two years. What if the Sabres fail again in the playoffs the next two years? As in get far, but dont win the cup? I fear that they just keep handing Ruff 2 year extensions until he's 100 years old and HOPE he finally wins a cup. Terrible idea

Ruff stuck around FAR TOO LONG the first time around. I do not want that to happen again 

Two years is right extension and that really means he gets one year to win a cup, or at least get them further than they did this year, or they could move on.   

[...]

Every team has been doing the drop. It's one of those strategies that works until it doesn't. Like anything else, it relies on circumstances and execution.

Now, it's overused and expected. They need to find a new strategy. They also need to emphasize going to the net - if you don't go to the net you're off the PP.

Of course this part of the game will not go ignored over the summer. If anything else with Lindy, he's a dog with a bone and the PP is definitely in his crosshairs.

[SabresSnowStorm]

The same guy that own the Bills owns the Sabres, my theory is both teams are going to be run along the same trajectory...draw your own conclusions.

While the Sabre problems go beyond one guy, Ruff should probably be parted with, he's been around 18 seasons.

He isn't going to bring anything different after almost two decades. 

I feel the Pegula era is tainted by "personal relationships" and not who is best to get the job done.

Seen similar on the Bills end. Man, I don't know, maybe this is pure entertainment or I hate to use the term comedy.

[GoPuckYourself]

I think it was a pretty easy decision, I want to see what more Lindy has to offer this group. I just hope the power play is priority number 1, like a few posters have said they don't necessarily have to fire Appert but this should go to someone with vast experience whoever that is.

[PromoTheRobot]

 

[PerreaultForever]

6 hours ago, thewookie1 said:

I'm less you have to fire Appert and more you have to hire someone new for the PP coach

Most of all I want Appert fired so Lindy can hire his own heir apparent for when he actually does retire. Someone he can mold and help be ready for that moment. Jay McKee is one possibility. 

[PromoTheRobot]

4 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

Most of all I want Appert fired so Lindy can hire his own heir apparent for when he actually does retire. Someone he can mold and help be ready for that moment. Jay McKee is one possibility. 

What if Lindy likes his staff?

[muppy]

6 hours ago, steveoath said:

GET A PROPER POWERPLPAY COACH 

this was the one thing I read repeatedly in this forum was disappointment with our PP due to the long drought with no goals. the criticism was staunch.

Coaches fault alledegly* maybe * or probably *

so  from my perspective it definitely needs to be considered

[Second Line Center]

5 hours ago, Brawndo said:

 

 

And my guess is the development of Power.  
 

Which automatically means he can stay if that’s the case.   

[PerreaultForever]

1 hour ago, PromoTheRobot said:

What if Lindy likes his staff?

Ya I guess he does and then I guess we get head coach Seth Appert in 2028 or something and then we watch the window slam shut. 

[PromoTheRobot]

Just now, PerreaultForever said:

Ya I guess he does and then I guess we get head coach Seth Appert in 2028 or something and then we watch the window slam shut. 

I don't think it's a given, but I also don't subscribe to the groupthink that our assistant coaches stink. I mean how does a team earn 109 points and win the Atlantic with a staff as defective as most here think? It just doesn't make sense. It makes less sense that a coach like Ruff would put up with anything not to his standard.

[PerreaultForever]

3 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

I don't think it's a given, but I also don't subscribe to the groupthink that our assistant coaches stink. I mean how does a team earn 109 points and win the Atlantic with a staff as defective as most here think? It just doesn't make sense. It makes less sense that a coach like Ruff would put up with anything not to his standard.

So, who does design and run the PP? That's my biggest question, and that guy needs to be replaced. 

[PromoTheRobot]

5 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

So, who does design and run the PP? That's my biggest question, and that guy needs to be replaced. 

Maybe you need to replace the players on the power play?

Hockey isn't football with called plays with X's and O's. You start with an initial structure but it's up to the players to respond to the situations and improvise. 

And think about what killed our power plays. Losing faceoffs, failed zone entries, turning the puck over once in the zone, not finding shooting lanes and having shots blocked. That all falls on player's decisions. 

And again, the Sabres were the 16th ranked power play over the course of the season. It could have been better but it was not the worst. Ironically the Avalanche were the worst for most of the year.

[Taro T]

9 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

I don't think it's a given, but I also don't subscribe to the groupthink that our assistant coaches stink. I mean how does a team earn 109 points and win the Atlantic with a staff as defective as most here think? It just doesn't make sense. It makes less sense that a coach like Ruff would put up with anything not to his standard.

Not assistant coachES, assistant COACH.  And in one very critical important portion of the job; even that bozo might be useful in other portions of the job.

And, again, Ruff has said the team has one of the best entries in the league by analytics.  If that is what they're measuring, they are either mismeasuring that metric or more likely they have a defiiniton of that metric which is useless.  Because am prettty sure that even you can see that the entries are trash.  

And they WEREN'T the 16th ranked PP, they were the 21st ranked.

[PromoTheRobot]

18 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Not assistant coachES, assistant COACH.  And in one very critical important portion of the job; even that bozo might be useful in other portions of the job.

And, again, Ruff has said the team has one of the best entries in the league by analytics.  If that is what they're measuring, they are either mismeasuring that metric or more likely they have a defiiniton of that metric which is useless.  Because am prettty sure that even you can see that the entries are trash.  

And they WEREN'T the 16th ranked PP, they were the 21st ranked.

Well Lindy can make all the changes he wants now, can't he. 

[Doohickie]

[GASabresIUFAN]

19 hours ago, darksabre said:

I'm as much of an Appert hater as anyone but the late adjustments to the power play units in the Montreal series speak to a different issue:

They were struggling to get the right mix of players more than anything.

I think seeing a bunch of guys improve throughout the season and gradually increase their contributions overall means we may see an improved power play next year basically by default. 

But way did it take so long to make those changes?  

[PromoTheRobot]

7 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

But way did it take so long to make those changes?  

Ask Lindy. Wouldn't he have final say?