Sadly the playoffs are over - Jarmo's offseason gameplan.

[That Aud Smell]

16 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

If it was Cliff, I'd make that deal.

You're gonna make me search for that photo again, aren't you?

[JohnC]

19 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

Eye roll for final climb. Jarmo's passiveness, shocking given his reputation, has downshifted us back into the desert. Is "final climb" code for making the playoffs again in 27-28?

Jarmo wasn't passive this offseason. He scanned the market for deals and concluded that the players he was interested in, most notably Helly, were not worth the cost. When Jarmo took over for KA last season, it was widely reported that he made serious overtures for players such as Thomas and Paryko. For a variety of reasons, those prospective deals didn't materialize. He didn't then act out of panic and make a deal for the sake of demonstrating that he was doing something. He stuck to his trade value judgment and kept the roster intact. The result was a 109 season and losing the seventh game in the second round. 

I don't know if Jarmo is going to make any more deals this offseason. But what I can say is that he is going to be smart about deals when they happen as demonstrated by the Byram deal. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

19 hours ago, dudacek said:

 

Chad’s pod pretty much reflected where I am: it wasn’t a bad offseason, it may even have been a smart offseason; but that doesn’t change the fact that it was a disappointing offseason.

We built up so much momentum, the hope was we’d see a move or moves to launch us across the finish line.

Instead, what we got was more akin to a downshift as we get ready for the final climb.

My only real disappointment this offseason was losing Byram, but I had assumed going into the offseason that Tuch was gone and there weren’t going to be other major changes.  Why make major change when you have one of youngest teams in the league and that youth propelled you to nearly the conference finals?

I agree this was a smart offseason.  We went from cap strapped to having cap space, we drastically improved our prospect pipeline with the 4th and 20th overall picks and held on to all our key prospects and youth in Quinn, Doan, Benson, Kulich, Helenius, Östlund, Mrtka and Zeimer.  We also upgraded our defensive depth with two young NHL players with upside and I agree with the decision to give Östlund, Helenius and Kulich a legit change to replace Tuch’s production.  

 I understand being disappointed that we didn’t make a major upgrade; not in goal, or on top 4 defense or at center.  To make matters worse Jarmo seemed to not try to adequately replace Tuch or Byram.  I also understand why people are concerned about the goaltending slipping given Lyon’s and UPL’s inconsistent careers and taking our playoff chances next season with it.

There is no question that the losses of Tuch and Byram left the Sabres a less experienced team.  I don't believe that it necessarily follows that a less experienced team is a worse team.  The biggest issues are will still team stay healthy (Norris) and whether the goaltending performs adequately.  If we can stay healthy and get reasonable goaltending, this is again a playoff team.  

 

[dudacek]

I've seen a few people referencing the 2022/23 team in terms of the 'relying on kids and internal growth'.

Side-by-side, I'm not seeing the parallels.

In terms of the forwards, in '23 Quinn, Cozens and Peterka were given middle-six roles at age 21 or younger. Mittelstadt was 23.

It's shocking how callow the D was then. Hard to believe the team nearly made the playoffs

• Thompson 24 —> Thompson 28
• Tuch 26 —> Benson 21
• Skinner 30 —> Doan 24

 

• Mittelstadt 23 —> Norris 27
• Cozens 21 —> McLeod 26
• Olofsson 27 —> Zucker 34
• Quinn 20 —> Quinn 24
• Peterka 20 —> Östlund 22

 

• Girgensons 28 —> Krebs 25
• Okposo 34 —> Malenstyn 28
• Krebs 21 —> Carrick 34
• Jost 24 —> Kulich 22
• Asplund 24 —> Helenius 20
• Hinostroza 28 —> Danforth 33

 

• Dahlin 22 —> Dahlin 26
• Jokiharju 23 —> Samuelsson 26
• Samuelsson 22 —> Power 23
• Power 19 —> Zellweger 23
• Bryson 24 —> Crevier 26
• Lyubushkin 28 —> Timmins 27
• Clague 24 —> Metsa 27

 

• Anderson 41 —> Luukkonen 27
• Luukkonen 23 —> Lyon 33

[Nacho Libre]

12 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I've seen a few people referencing the 2022/23 team in terms of the 'relying on kids and internal growth'.

Side-by-side, I'm not seeing the parallels.

In terms of the forwards, in '23 Quinn, Cozens and Peterka were given middle-six roles at age 21 or younger. Mittelstadt was 23.

It's shocking how callow the D was then. Hard to believe the team nearly made the playoffs

• Thompson 24 —> Thompson 28
• Tuch 26 —> Benson 21
• Skinner 30 —> Doan 24

 

• Mittelstadt 23 —> Norris 27
• Cozens 21 —> McLeod 26
• Olofsson 27 —> Zucker 34
• Quinn 20 —> Quinn 24
• Peterka 20 —> Östlund 22

 

• Girgensons 28 —> Krebs 25
• Okposo 34 —> Malenstyn 28
• Krebs 21 —> Carrick 34
• Jost 24 —> Kulich 22
• Asplund 24 —> Helenius 20
• Hinostroza 28 —> Danforth 33

 

• Dahlin 22 —> Dahlin 26
• Jokiharju 23 —> Samuelsson 26
• Samuelsson 22 —> Power 23
• Power 19 —> Zellweger 23
• Bryson 24 —> Crevier 26
• Lyubushkin 28 —> Timmins 27
• Clague 24 —> Metsa 27

 

• Anderson 41 —> Luukkonen 27
• Luukkonen 23 —> Lyon 33

It’s not that it’s comparable it’s thst it’s comparable potentially relative to the much different expectation 

Arguably comparable. I’m not the one making the comparison though 

We are indisputably relying on internal growth as things stand, we fell short last year and weakened the roster on paper. It’s only internal improvement right now in our quiver quite literally. No growth represents a failed result undoubtedly and it’s highly unlikely an improved result will be achieved by the a net gain Zellweger provides over Byram (the argument more so is how much he drops off not if the swap vaults us past round 2) 

Internal growth is absolutely AS MUCH the plan as 2023, but, again, there’s a far better argument for Jarmo utilizing it - which is what I think your data speaks to. Even if it’s against my personal bias/how I’d do it 

Edited July 7 by Nacho Libre

[TageMVP]

Jarmo gave up. Wow 

At least Adams would have traded for Tyson Jost by now or something 

[dudacek]

1 hour ago, Nacho Libre said:

. No growth represents a failed result undoubtedly

Interesting take.

Not exactly wrong, but probably unrealistic.

No many teams improve on 109-point seasons, not many make the final four.

To me the question facing the Sabres after this offseason is whether they can maintain their new status as a “good” team that can challenge over an extended run (Carolina or Dallas starting circa 2018), or if they simply caught lightning in a bottle (Canucks 2024)

[LGR4GM]

10 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Interesting take.

Not exactly wrong, but probably unrealistic.

No many teams improve on 109-point seasons, not many make the final four.

To me the question facing the Sabres after this offseason is whether they can maintain their new status as a “good” team that can challenge over an extended run (Carolina or Dallas starting circa 2018), or if they simply caught lightning in a bottle (Canucks 2024)

Buffalo needs to limit their chances against better. They were mid pack last year doing it and you can't live off of that. They need to grow defensively. 

[PASabreFan]

4 hours ago, That Aud Smell said:

You're gonna make me search for that photo again, aren't you?

AI, the next best thing?

[Nacho Libre]

24 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Interesting take.

Not exactly wrong, but probably unrealistic.

No many teams improve on 109-point seasons, not many make the final four.

To me the question facing the Sabres after this offseason is whether they can maintain their new status as a “good” team that can challenge over an extended run (Carolina or Dallas starting circa 2018), or if they simply caught lightning in a bottle (Canucks 2024)

No, that was in context. No growth represents a failed result re: the team improving. We were discussing means for improvement I thought 

it wasn’t about the perception of whether or not the season was a success or not. ie- I wasn’t saying that no growth (and no improvement) necessarily represents a “fail”

merely that we’d be hard pressed to achieve improvement, specifically, without internal growth. Ie it can’t really come from anywhere else but Zellweger (and Crevier I guess)  

In that way, the approach is similar to 2023, I think the approaches are very similar actually. The difference is in fact the context, the timing of when said strategy is implement 

The timing being different is what your big post demonstrated, not the essence of the strategy being so 

- - - 

Timing is almost always the issue frankly. Whether it’s player or GM 

And time is the most disregarded variable so it’s very ironic. Most disregarded, most valuable 

 

Edited July 7 by Nacho Libre

[That Aud Smell]

Just now, PASabreFan said:

AI, the next best thing?

i avoid it like the plague.

which i realize makes me a technophobe.

speaking of which, have a gander at ol' cliffy's defunct facebook page

https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100002209335574

that page led me, in turn, to a facebook page for bill guerin's wife, which, in turn, led me to a facebook page for jason karmanos's wife. 

i stopped at that point.

 

[dudacek]

Just now, Nacho Libre said:

No, that was in context. No growth represents a failed result re: the team improving. We were discussing means for improvement I thought 

it wasn’t about the perception of whether or not the season was a success or not 

👍

Fine line, but I was initially coming from the perspective as to whether the team will regress or not.

With success or failure defined by making the playoffs.

My hope is the Sabres are at the point where the culture and critical mass of talent is such that they will sustain the team through things like older guys like Tuch moving on while younger guys like Benson move up.

My fear is they aren’t.

 

[dudacek]

It was interesting and gratifying to hear Friedman talk about the Sabres as for real.

He talked about Hellebuyck waiving and Trochek wanting to come here.

He also kinda described Buffalo Montreal Tampa Florida as locks and the other 4 as the teams battling to join them.

Not that he’s any more of an expert handicapper than anyone else, more that he is extremely plugged in and often a mirror of the general perceptions around the league.

[Taro T]

7 minutes ago, dudacek said:

It was interesting and gratifying to hear Friedman talk about the Sabres as for real.

He talked about Hellebuyck waiving and Trochek wanting to come here.

He also kinda described Buffalo Montreal Tampa Florida as locks and the other 4 as the teams battling to join them.

Not that he’s any more of an expert handicapper than anyone else, more that he is extremely plugged in and often a mirror of the general perceptions around the league.

Well, provided the GTing doesn't poop on the carpet and TB and Florida stay relatively injury free; expect those ARE on paper the 4 best teams in the Atlantic.  Unfortunately for us, they don't play the games on paper.

Detroit looks like it's stil going to be mediocre.  TO is in the midst of an attempt to shift gears, but with adding an 18 yo 1 dimensional player to their group not sure just how effective they'll be at trying to change their style and they still have GTing that should be trusted less than the Sabres.  Boston still seems too slow to really compete even with the addition of Peterka and an injury to Swayman, Pastrnak, or McAvoy could derail their year.  Ottawa's a wild card.  They should be worse minus Tkachuk; but maybe overall the guys left there will rally round the hockey world thinking they're dead in the water.

[Mr Peabody]

Marty B has Fla and Tor battling it out for first and the rest of us in a battle for 3 &4. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

3 hours ago, Mr Peabody said:

Marty B has Fla and Tor battling it out for first and the rest of us in a battle for 3 &4. 

Did someone tell him it’s 2026 not 2024?

[PASabreFan]

I'll put this here, because we don't seem to have a thread dedicated to Sabres' offseason moves. Go figure. This one was created when the Sabres were eliminated and was a call for predictions, I think.

Anyway, I have my AI bot Daniel working on an audio clip of Winston Churchill saying, "Never in the field of Sabres offseason moves has so much been written by so many about so little."

JARMO, YOU SUCK! But go ahead and buy that house and get comfy. Maybe plant a peach tree.

[Nacho Libre]

It’s not a poor offseason, far too soon to say that, but every day that goes by without Jarmo actually addressing the roster certainly leaves me feeling that it’s a very surprising one. I say that not because I expected a ton of moves, but purely because I DIDN’T expect many and there was still less than expected 

[DarthEbriate]

On 6/29/2026 at 10:25 AM, ... said:

OMG. Be careful of the spiders.

Didn’t see a single one. 

On 6/29/2026 at 10:30 AM, Night Train said:

Go to a AFL game.  Tons better than soccer IMO. 

The home teams were always on the road. 

But we did end up watching several rugby games with our friends on tv including the State of Origin Decider which was in Brisbane while we were there. It was fun (except Queensland was lambasted). 

[DarthEbriate]

I’m out of it for a little while and everyone gets delusions of grandeur and nothing happened. 

[...]

1 hour ago, DarthEbriate said:

Didn’t see a single one. 

Then you must have been in a relatively civilized location for an outer rim territory. Welcome back, wayfarer!

[GASabresIUFAN]

I'm revising my opinion that Jarmo is done.   The signing of Davidson and re-signing of Krebs has left me feeling that something more is about to happen.

Here's why.  

1) The Sabres have way to many forwards.  Right now there are 15 forwards under contract. This is easily solved by some mix of waiving guys like Kozak or Danforth and sending down Kulich or Helenius, but what if that is not the plan?  The reason that I doubt that's the plan is too many top 9 forwards.  The Sabres didn't give Krebs 4.5 to play on the 4th line.  Krebs gives the Sabres 11 top 9 forwards and there is no way they are sending two of Helenius, Östlund or Kulich down to start the season.  The only real solution of the 11 top 9 forwards is to trade one of the 11 and send down one other (or trade 2).  The obvious trade choices are Quinn, McLeod or Zucker. 

2) Jarmo has yet to put his stamp on this team.  Adding Davidson coupled with Bergevin gives Jarmo two advisors who were not afraid to make the big trade.  Jarmo also has a history of not being afraid either.  

3) The Hellebuyck rumors will not die.  The Kane one doesn't quit as well, but most of the noise seems to be Hellebuyck.

4) The Sabres have expendable prospects and draft picks.  The addition Rudolph with the 4th overall pick makes Mrtka expendable.  My guess is the trade is UPL, McLeod (or Quinn), Mrtka and a 1st next season for Hellebuyck.  UPL only has a 5 team NTC.  

[Gatorman0519]

We lost Tuch and Byram and none of the other issues got addressed so far. Looks like its youth or bust next year unless something happens. 

[Taro T]

13 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

I'm revising my opinion that Jarmo is done.   The signing of Davidson and re-signing of Krebs has left me feeling that something more is about to happen.

Here's why.  

1) The Sabres have way to many forwards.  Right now there are 15 forwards under contract. This is easily solved by some mix of waiving guys like Kozak or Danforth and sending down Kulich or Helenius, but what if that is not the plan?  The reason that I doubt that's the plan is too many top 9 forwards.  The Sabres didn't give Krebs 4.5 to play on the 4th line.  Krebs gives the Sabres 11 top 9 forwards and there is no way they are sending two of Helenius, Östlund or Kulich down to start the season.  The only real solution of the 11 top 9 forwards is to trade one of the 11 and send down one other (or trade 2).  The obvious trade choices are Quinn, McLeod or Zucker. 

2) Jarmo has yet to put his stamp on this team.  Adding Davidson coupled with Bergevin gives Jarmo two advisors who were not afraid to make the big trade.  Jarmo also has a history of not being afraid either.  

3) The Hellebuyck rumors will not die.  The Kane one doesn't quit as well, but most of the noise seems to be Hellebuyck.

4) The Sabres have expendable prospects and draft picks.  The addition Rudolph with the 4th overall pick makes Mrtka expendable.  My guess is the trade is UPL, McLeod (or Quinn), Mrtka and a 1st next season for Hellebuyck.  UPL only has a 5 team NTC.  

Well, it certainly seems that the Kane deal is contingent upon the Hellebucyk deal getting done.  Unless it's last minute, right at the beginning of October so Patty gets to pull a Bruce Smith and skip training camp after Hellebucyk turns out to be just a mirage.

Have said before, am leaning towards there not being the BIG trade just because it'll be way more emotionally satisfying to get surprised with a big move happening after convincing oneself it just ain't gonna happen than it would be to be convinced it'll happen any day now and then waking up realizing it's the middle of November.

[GASabresIUFAN]

Another thought if Jarmo is done.  I’m wondering if they will go with the Krebs type development track with Kulich.  Playing Kulich in the former Krebs role will take some pressure off his return and allow him to concentrate on playing a simple game.  He’ll add some much needed skill to Carrick and Beck helping to create what could be a very formidable 4th line.

Forwards

Benson Tage Krebs

Doan Norris Östlund

Zucker McLeod Quinn

Kulich Carrick Malenstyn (Kozak)

Danforth waived or traded

Helenius sent down to get max PT until the top 9 gets an injury. 

The lineup has two centers per line except McLeod.  The lines have at least one physical player per line except McLeod and at least one player and one scorer.  

Edited Tuesday at 03:57 PM by GASabresIUFAN