Make a trade

[GASabresIUFAN]

Lets talk for a moment about the inner workings for the international scholar named Keyvn Adams.  Why make a trade if Samuelsson is now "healthy" and you just acquired a JAG named Jost. Everything is perfect in KA land.  He is spending the least amount of Pegula money as possible and getting the appropriate result.  

Never mind that the goalies can't stop a puck or the fact that Pilut and Fitz (and Bryson) are still on the roster.  No, Samuelsson is back and a former 1st rd pick was acquired for nothing.  In KA Land, it's a job well done.

Edited November 21, 2022 by GASabresIUFAN

[DarthEbriate]

15 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Lets talk for a moment about the inner workings for the international scholar named Keyvn Adams.  Why make a trade if Samuelsson is now "healthy" and you just acquired a JAG named Jost. Everything is perfect in KA land.  He is spending the least amount of Pegula money as possible and getting the appropriate result.  

Never mind that the goalies can't stop a puck or the fact that Pilut and Fitz (and Bryson) are still on the roster.  No, Samuelsson is back and a former 1st rd pick was acquired for nothing.  In KA Land, it's a job well done.

Nah, GM Sheevyn is still wishing he could somehow get Jost on a $750k contract. There's always room for improvement.

[Thorny]

1 hour ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Lets talk for a moment about the inner workings for the international scholar named Keyvn Adams.  Why make a trade if Samuelsson is now "healthy" and you just acquired a JAG named Jost. Everything is perfect in KA land.  He is spending the least amount of Pegula money as possible and getting the appropriate result.  

Never mind that the goalies can't stop a puck or the fact that Pilut and Fitz (and Bryson) are still on the roster.  No, Samuelsson is back and a former 1st rd pick was acquired for nothing.  In KA Land, it's a job well done.

Sir, this is a Wendy’s 

[GASabresIUFAN]

59 minutes ago, Thorny said:

Sir, this is a Wendy’s 

I’m sorry, but Wendy’s is fine dining compared to this organization.  I’m thinking more Cook Out than Wendy’s.

 

[thewookie1]

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/3768584

 

How do these ideas look?

Krebs went to Rochester

[PerreaultForever]

29 minutes ago, thewookie1 said:

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/3768584

 

How do these ideas look?

Krebs went to Rochester

I like the idea of acquiring people like those players but I don't see getting them for those prices being possible, especially the Greenway one. 

[SabresBillsFan]

On 11/18/2022 at 5:38 PM, LGR4GM said:

I like Horvat

SCHENN and Boeser, less so. I don't think trading Quinn and JJP for them is wise. 

Tim Murray felt that way. It's why Brock Boeser isn't a Sabre already. 

Schenn is garbage. I just don’t see Horvat and Boeser look like Sabres. This team need another good forward and some gritty players. This team needs to be better in their own end and the offensive players need to be hustling.

[Curt]

5 hours ago, thewookie1 said:

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/3768584

 

How do these ideas look?

Krebs went to Rochester

You got the standard comments.  A reply saying that Greenway sucks and you paid too much for him, then another reply saying he doesn’t suck, in fact he’s untouchable!

[Pimlach]

17 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Lets talk for a moment about the inner workings for the international scholar named Keyvn Adams.  Why make a trade if Samuelsson is now "healthy" and you just acquired a JAG named Jost. Everything is perfect in KA land.  He is spending the least amount of Pegula money as possible and getting the appropriate result.  

Never mind that the goalies can't stop a puck or the fact that Pilut and Fitz (and Bryson) are still on the roster.  No, Samuelsson is back and a former 1st rd pick was acquired for nothing.  In KA Land, it's a job well done.

I would like to believe that Adams knows this is not the appropriate result.  

[Sabres Fan in NS]

9 hours ago, thewookie1 said:

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/3768584

 

How do these ideas look?

Krebs went to Rochester

Not terrible wook.  Not bad atol.

The second line is Dylan and 2 rookies ??

Power needs his Lube Man, so I would swap Lubsie with the Joker.

[Pimlach]

On 11/20/2022 at 9:12 AM, JohnC said:

What would be the return if Mittelstadt was dealt? That's the conundrum when talking trades. It comes down to getting value back. When you send out an inconsequential player you definitely are not going to get back a consequential player unless it is packaged with high end prospects and draft picks. Would you take that option? 

The Sabres had Jack, ROR, Reinhart, Risto, Hall and Ullmark. What did they all have in common? They all wanted out because they concluded that they were stuck in an organization that had no ability to get itself out of the muck of mediocrity in a reasonable period of time. You see teams like Jersey make that quantum leap after a rebuilding process. And there are teams that had succeeded and then needed to retool after their cup contending lifespan came to an end. And then they do it. 

My fear is that this prolonged failure is corrosive and demoralizing on the players (and the fans) gets to the point where the next batch of our better players will want out when their contracts allow them to do so. 

I don't know what the answer is about this interminable slide into meaningless and irrelevant hockey. It's numbing to the point of being apathetic. 

See bold.   I have said these things to you before, and you continued to support the glacial build from within plan that the GM has in place.  

Sounds like the pain of losing is taking hold.   It does not have to be like this.  

 

 

 

[GASabresIUFAN]

14 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

I would like to believe that Adams knows this is not the appropriate result.  

It is the appropriate result for someone not committed to winning.

[GASabresIUFAN]

https://theathletic.com/3913878/2022/11/22/luke-schenn-canucks-career-resurgence/
 

After reading this article, I can’t think of better player to mentor our kids on defense and give us good depth defensive play. For those who can’t read the article, I’d sum up the story with when he got sent to the minors, he reevaluated what it meant to be a pro hockey player and changed how he did things.  He hired a private coach to work on the deficiencies in his game and went on to win Cups with TB.  
 

From the article:

Quote

 

Luke had a young family and was now making two-hour drives for AHL practices and games in San Diego. Brayden encouraged Luke to consider working with private coach Adam Oates. So Luke made the call.

“I figured out I kinda had to evolve and a lot of it was puckhandling, trusting my skating more, trying to put yourself in thinking the game and putting yourself in better positions on the ice,” said Schenn.

 

Quote

He’s found a clear role and identity as a player, worked tirelessly with Oates to improve his poise with the puck and short first passes and learned how to evolve his offseason training to continue sharpening defensively.

Anyone still think we couldn’t use a hard working professional like Schenn on our team?

[LGR4GM]

13 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

https://theathletic.com/3913878/2022/11/22/luke-schenn-canucks-career-resurgence/
 

After reading this article, I can’t think of better player to mentor our kids on defense and give us good depth defensive play. For those who can’t read the article, I’d sum up the story with when he got sent to the minors, he reevaluated what it meant to be a pro hockey player and changed how he did things.  He hired a private coach to work on the deficiencies in his game and went on to win Cups with TB.  
 

From the article:

Anyone still think we couldn’t use a hard working professional like Schenn on our team?

Id trade for Schenn but not Quinn and JJP and 2 firsts etc... 

We are talking like a 3rd or a mid tier prospect. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

1 minute ago, LGR4GM said:

Id trade for Schenn but not Quinn and JJP and 2 firsts etc... 

We are talking like a 3rd or a mid tier prospect. 

Absolutely.  We have 3 2nds, we can easily part with a 3rd plus to get him.  Anyone with that work ethic, multiple Cups and the history of carrying the weight of being a top 5 draft pick has things to teach our kids.  

Obviously this makes to much sense for KA to even attempt it. 

[Taro T]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

Id trade for Schenn but not Quinn and JJP and 2 firsts etc... 

We are talking like a 3rd or a mid tier prospect. 

Not opposed to Schenn for the right price.  But am tired of them consistently trading away their 3rd.  It effectively keeps them out of the RFA market because they need to have their 3rd available to make offers for the non-name guys that could both want to be in Buffalo and improve the team.

[Curt]

57 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Not opposed to Schenn for the right price.  But am tired of them consistently trading away their 3rd.  It effectively keeps them out of the RFA market because they need to have their 3rd available to make offers for the non-name guys that could both want to be in Buffalo and improve the team.

I think you mean that it keeps US (fans) out of the armchair offer sheet market.  The real life offer sheet market is essentially non existent.

[Taro T]

45 minutes ago, Curt said:

I think you mean that it keeps US (fans) out of the armchair offer sheet market.  The real life offer sheet market is essentially non existent.

No, fans that like to propose trades & the like will still do so whether the Sabres have the pieces to make their deal or not.

Realize full well that there are ridiculously few actual offer sheets signed & pretty much none not involving the Eulers or the weird Cane-Hab spat.  But, not having that 3rd has been a crutch allowing Sabres GMs to avoid even looking.  If he doesn't want to enter that market, he should say so without having the 'well, we wanted to, but just desperately needed that 3rd rounder we traded up for last year even more.'

Edited November 22, 2022 by Taro T

[John Tucker]

On 11/20/2022 at 3:35 PM, Curt said:

I hope that he does become a 2/3C quality player.  He could, but I don’t think he is close currently.

Being on pace for 22-23 goals is nice, but if we are going to talk about his ES role, we need to look at his ES numbers.  Mittelstadt currently has 1 goal and 1 assist at ES, in 18 games.  His possession numbers are below average relative to the rest of the team, and is a -5 for whatever that’s worth.  He has been used mostly in 2nd/3rd line, scoring line roles.

By comparison, Asplund has 1 goal and 4 assists at ES in 16 games, and is a +1.  His possession numbers are also below average, but he has been used in a much more defensive role with fewer minutes.

Mittelstadt’s ES play has been very disappointing to me this season.  He has performed like a 4th liner at ES.  He has been better on special teams but I expected more.  I thought he might break out, but I’m now questioning whether he has a future on the team.

I'm not really sure what his comparative stats look like, but I agree, to me he has been disappointing.  I was hoping that someone that was an 8th overall pick and who has spent the better part of 6 seasons in the NHL would look like more of a 2nd line center than a 4th liner.  He looks really, really slow this year.  This franchise can ill afford to have the ceiling for high draft picks become 4th liners.  Does he have value?  Sure.  Is he valuable to this team?  Meh.  We have enough similarly sized guys in the AHL that could potentially slide into a 4th line role and kill a penalty or two.  Don't know if it has been coaching, his ability, or the culture here (or all of the above), but he is nowhere close to what I think we all expected him to be at this stage in his career after his performance in the World Juniors back in the day.  

[JohnC]

4 hours ago, Pimlach said:

See bold.   I have said these things to you before, and you continued to support the glacial build from within plan that the GM has in place.  

Sounds like the pain of losing is taking hold.   It does not have to be like this.  

 

 

 

In general, I support the youth movement (draft and development approach) that is occurring. However, that doesn't mean that you can't augment that process with some reasonable acquisitions in the offseason, especially when you have a gaping amount of cap space. I like the additions of Lyubushkin and Comrie. But at the minimum another defenseman and goalie could have been added without displacing time for any of the youngsters. Even accepting the youth movement this team clearly had little reserve on the roster and in our system. Knowing that injuries are a fact of life in this crash sport. More could have been done and should have been done to enhance the roster. Our plummeting record speaks to that lack of preparation for the inevitable. 

[Curt]

12 minutes ago, JohnC said:

In general, I support the youth movement (draft and development approach) that is occurring. However, that doesn't mean that you can't augment that process with some reasonable acquisitions in the offseason, especially when you have a gaping amount of cap space. I like the additions of Lyubushkin and Comrie. But at the minimum another defenseman and goalie could have been added without displacing time for any of the youngsters. Even accepting the youth movement this team clearly had little reserve on the roster and in our system. Knowing that injuries are a fact of life in this crash sport. More could have been done and should have been done to enhance the roster. Our plummeting record speaks to that lack of preparation for the inevitable. 

I agree here.  Next offseason, I want them to add another D and Goalie of similar ilk or better than Lyubushkin and Comrie.  With the current numbers, it might be hard to add a FA F, but maybe we see some sort of consolidation trade that creates room or brings someone in.

[Taro T]

17 minutes ago, Curt said:

I agree here.  Next offseason, I want them to add another D and Goalie of similar ilk or better than Lyubushkin and Comrie.  With the current numbers, it might be hard to add a FA F, but maybe we see some sort of consolidation trade that creates room or brings someone in.

Agree on the D & G, but also want 1 more middle 6 vet brought in as well.  As was the case this past offseason.  If they had 1 more F in the ranks from day 1, yes, it's likely one of Krebs, Quinn, or Peterka would've likely started the year in Ra-cha-cha.  Though that was a very unpopular thought this summer, how's that looking in hindsight?

Adding competition is rarely a bad thing & if that keeps Savoie or Kulich or whomever off the Sabres out of the gate, so be it.  In a best case they out perform that vet and either the vet gets risked on waivers or a different young guy spends some time in the A waiting for an injury callup.  In a worst case, the kid's ELC slides a year.  Not really a bad thing when you have a glut of guys at pretty much the same point contract-wise.

[Marvin]

21 minutes ago, Curt said:

I agree here.  Next offseason, I want them to add another D and Goalie of similar ilk or better than Lyubushkin and Comrie.  With the current numbers, it might be hard to add a FA F, but maybe we see some sort of consolidation trade that creates room or brings someone in.

Much as I would like to add one, I am not worried as much about an FA forward.  I believe that another goalkeeper is a necessity unless one of our prospects surprises after the NCAA Frozen Four.  But we need to have 7-8 D who are better than Bryson and who force Jokiharu to the 3rd pairing.  That is likely 3 D and 1 G from outside the organisation before we add the forward I want.  That is a tall order.

[John Tucker]

2 minutes ago, Marvin said:

Much as I would like to add one, I am not worried as much about an FA forward.  I believe that another goalkeeper is a necessity unless one of our prospects surprises after the NCAA Frozen Four.  But we need to have 7-8 D who are better than Bryson and who force Jokiharu to the 3rd pairing.  That is likely 3 D and 1 G from outside the organisation before we add the forward I want.  That is a tall order.

Prolly gonna need an upgrade since Portillo or Levi (or both) will like go all Cal Peterson on us.  

[JohnC]

5 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Agree on the D & G, but also want 1 more middle 6 vet brought in as well.  As was the case this past offseason.  If they had 1 more F in the ranks from day 1, yes, it's likely one of Krebs, Quinn, or Peterka would've likely started the year in Ra-cha-cha.  Though that was a very unpopular thought this summer, how's that looking in hindsight?

Adding competition is rarely a bad thing & if that keeps Savoie or Kulich or whomever off the Sabres out of the gate, so be it.  In a best case they out perform that vet and either the vet gets risked on waivers or a different young guy spends some time in the A waiting for an injury callup.  In a worst case, the kid's ELC slides a year.  Not really a bad thing when you have a glut of guys at pretty much the same point contract-wise.

You make an incisive point that internal competition in of itself is a positive dynamic for the team and for young players. Even if it relegates a younger player to the lower league that doesn't necessarily hinder a prospect's develepmont. By not rushing the young player you are more likely to enhance the young player's development. Having depth is not a situation that anyone should lament about. It gives you a greater ability to absorb the inevitable injuries and prevent your team from sinking when injuries do happen. The Sabres are an example of what happens when there is little margin for error. The boat is more likely to sink in troubled waters.