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Patrick Kane


tom webster
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10 minutes ago, tom webster said:
13 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

In July of 2023 Kane will be available as a FA unless he re-signs with Chicago or is traded by Chicago and signs with his new clubBut... if his goal is to finish his career in his hometown the Sabres could sign him next summer without giving up any assets. 

Sure, maybe Chicago trades him at the deadline but the Sabres could still sign him during free agency the following summer.

Or, they trade him this off-season and he decides to re-up with the team he gets traded to. A lot of people seem to be assuming it’s now or next off-season but there’s no guarantee he’s free next year.

Yep.  Covered that in the bolded part.

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1 minute ago, tom webster said:

I’m old, tired and hung over. Reading comprehension only at around 25% today.

That's okay, I had a whole argument with @SwampD only to get down to the point where he realized that Kane will be a free agent in July 2023 regardless of whether the Hawks trade him (unless he signs before then).

My gut feel is that there will be some talks between the teams, but that Adams won't pull the trigger unless it's a sweet deal for the Sabres.  He will, however, use the trade negotiations to determine the parameters for a Kane contract for next summer.

 

I don't know how Kevyn views Kane.  I know that he stresses character and Kane has some antics on his permanent record.  So maybe he's not really at all interested in Kane.  Even if he *is* interested in acquiring him, I don't think he will be looking to Kane to be a major part of the team's future, just a complementary piece.  As such I don't expect him to spend a crap-ton of assets to acquire him.

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1 hour ago, tom webster said:

Or, they trade him this off-season and he decides to re-up with the team he gets traded to. A lot of people seem to be assuming it’s now or next off-season but there’s no guarantee he’s free next year.

Isn’t this whole idea of the Sabres acquiring Kane based upon the idea that it is important to Kane that he play in Buffalo?

If it is made known to Kane that the Sabres have serious interest in signing him, but he decides to sign an extension with another team before the Sabres are even eligible to sign him, then I would say that he wasn’t particularly interested in signing with Buffalo in the first place.

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6 minutes ago, Curt said:

Isn’t this whole idea of the Sabres acquiring Kane based upon the idea that it is important to Kane that he play in Buffalo?

If it is made known to Kane that the Sabres have serious interest in signing him, but he decides to sign an extension with another team before the Sabres are even eligible to sign him, then I would say that he wasn’t particularly interested in signing with Buffalo in the first place.

There are a ton of factors going into this. While he wants to finish his career in Buffalo, he’s not going to just let them dictate the terms. If Buffalo doesn’t step up, someone else will and it could be a lot older Kane coming to finish up his career in Buffalo long after they could have used him.

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If it was completely up to me, and it’s obviously not, I acquire both Toews and Kane with Chicago retaining half of cap hit, sign Letang to a one year, $10M contract, trade for Quick and see how it goes. If come March things aren’t going well, I trade Kane, Quick and Toews, recoup some assets and resign Kane next off-season.

See, I could be an insider…..

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1 hour ago, tom webster said:

There are a ton of factors going into this. While he wants to finish his career in Buffalo, he’s not going to just let them dictate the terms. If Buffalo doesn’t step up, someone else will and it could be a lot older Kane coming to finish up his career in Buffalo long after they could have used him.

If the Sabres make it known to Kane that they are very interested in acquiring him within the next 13 months, and giving him a fair value contract, but can’t work out a reasonable trade with Chicago, I would think Kane would give them a chance in free agency.

If Kane level of “want” to be in Buffalo is that low, and the Sabres do “step up” and pay considerable assets to trade for Kane, what assurances does Buffalo have that he will sign an extension.  I think there is just as much risk in “stepping up” as there is in being patient.

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24 minutes ago, Curt said:

If the Sabres make it known to Kane that they are very interested in acquiring him within the next 13 months, and giving him a fair value contract, but can’t work out a reasonable trade with Chicago, I would think Kane would give them a chance in free agency.

If Kane level of “want” to be in Buffalo is that low, and the Sabres do “step up” and pay considerable assets to trade for Kane, what assurances does Buffalo have that he will sign an extension.  I think there is just as much risk in “stepping up” as there is in being patient.

Question is not directed at you particularly, as several posters have expressed similar sentiments, but how do they do this without tampering while he's still under contract to Chicago?

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35 minutes ago, Curt said:

If the Sabres make it known to Kane that they are very interested in acquiring him within the next 13 months, and giving him a fair value contract, but can’t work out a reasonable trade with Chicago, I would think Kane would give them a chance in free agency.

If Kane level of “want” to be in Buffalo is that low, and the Sabres do “step up” and pay considerable assets to trade for Kane, what assurances does Buffalo have that he will sign an extension.  I think there is just as much risk in “stepping up” as there is in being patient.

Again, I don’t see them giving up significant assets. Chicago wants to be bad. They want a graceful exit strategy for both Kane and Toews. Trading Kane to his hometown is that. As Elliot Friedman stated, “it’s a romantic notion.” I just don’t see the downside.

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18 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Question is not directed at you particularly, as several posters have expressed similar sentiments, but how do they do this without tampering while he's still under contract to Chicago?

Is it still tampering if no one finds out?

Seriously, these GMs and agents speak often.  I think it’s pretty likely that they drop hints and tid bits of info to each other regularly.

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32 minutes ago, tom webster said:

Again, I don’t see them giving up significant assets. Chicago wants to be bad. They want a graceful exit strategy for both Kane and Toews. Trading Kane to his hometown is that. As Elliot Friedman stated, “it’s a romantic notion.” I just don’t see the downside.

Chicago desperately needs to reboot the franchise, get the bad taste out of fans mouths from the scandal and start fresh with some new young franchise players coming from high picks.

Kane to Buffalo, Toews to Winnipeg. Send the guys home to finish their careers. I could see it. I mean if they are looking to move DeBrincat the fans aren’t going to be enthused with the franchise. 

The only downside is acquisition cost for Buffalo. But Adams would have the hammer of “We’ll just check in on him as a UFA instead” to play. 

Adding Kane would likely open the door to the higher end goalies and dmen to consider coming to Buffalo too.

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50 minutes ago, tom webster said:

Again, I don’t see them giving up significant assets. Chicago wants to be bad. They want a graceful exit strategy for both Kane and Toews. Trading Kane to his hometown is that. As Elliot Friedman stated, “it’s a romantic notion.” I just don’t see the downside.

Something similar to the package given up for Skinner?

In reality, I doubt that Kane is moved in the offseason.  I think it’s much more likely that he is moved to a contender near the trade deadline, when he is easier to fit under the cap and his value will be higher.  He can go on a run, (really doesn’t every player want to do that?) then he can make his UFA decisions.

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2 hours ago, Taro T said:

Question is not directed at you particularly, as several posters have expressed similar sentiments, but how do they do this without tampering while he's still under contract to Chicago?

 

2 hours ago, Curt said:

Is it still tampering if no one finds out?

Seriously, these GMs and agents speak often.  I think it’s pretty likely that they drop hints and tid bits of info to each other regularly.

It happens all the time and Kane and Eichel have the same agent in Pat Brisson, so we know that Adams has Him on Speed Dial. 
 

And it can be something as innocuous as Hey Pat, We maybe looking next Summer for a RW in His 30’s with playoff experience who wants to help the Sabres get to the over the hump, if you have anyone in mind for the 2023-24 Season let us know when the time is right.  Also Kane can reach out through Brisson, who can tell the Sabres, Kane would be interested in discussing something with Buffalo when the timing is right. 
 

It’s tampering without contract parameters being discussed. 

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Here's a question:  have the Blackhawks indicated that they are planning on a full rebuild?  If not, it seems reasonably likely that, rather than trading Kane and Toews this summer, they might try to bring in a few guys over the summer via trade/FA and see if that gets them back into the playoffs -- and if it doesn't work, they can trade those 2 guys, and anyone else that makes sense, at the deadline.

 

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7 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

Here's a question:  have the Blackhawks indicated that they are planning on a full rebuild?  If not, it seems reasonably likely that, rather than trading Kane and Toews this summer, they might try to bring in a few guys over the summer via trade/FA and see if that gets them back into the playoffs -- and if it doesn't work, they can trade those 2 guys, and anyone else that makes sense, at the deadline.

 

Not sure if management has come out and said it, but they are allegedly shopping everyone of value.

They fired their coach and their GM and finished the season playing under .400 hockey.

Hawks have traded 8 of their past 10 first-rounders and don’t have one this year either. Alex Debrincat is the only non-1st of note to come out of their system in that period and their prospect list is among the worst in the league.

I think their entire list of good players in their prime is Debrincat and Seth Jones, and their interesting pieces might start and end with McCabe, Murphy and the disappointing Kirby Dach. They do have some money under the cap, but even the very best free agents on sweet deals arent going to turn this around.

And that’s ignoring the stinking dung heap that the franchise is off-ice between the Beach disgrace and the owner’s embarrassing reaction.

I think the Hawks are the league’s biggest mess and are in desperate need of a saviour in the best season to be bad since 2015. 

Going for it one more time would be the epitome of foolishness.

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15 hours ago, tom webster said:

If it was completely up to me, and it’s obviously not, I acquire both Toews and Kane with Chicago retaining half of cap hit, sign Letang to a one year, $10M contract, trade for Quick and see how it goes. If come March things aren’t going well, I trade Kane, Quick and Toews, recoup some assets and resign Kane next off-season.

See, I could be an insider…..

Didn’t know Tim Murray was a poster on this board.  Sorry Tim , it didn’t work in 2015 and it won’t work in 2022

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53 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

Here's a question:  have the Blackhawks indicated that they are planning on a full rebuild?  If not, it seems reasonably likely that, rather than trading Kane and Toews this summer, they might try to bring in a few guys over the summer via trade/FA and see if that gets them back into the playoffs -- and if it doesn't work, they can trade those 2 guys, and anyone else that makes sense, at the deadline.

 

They have a new front office, and new coaching staff led by Richardson.

The insiders are saying they are taking calls on DeBrincat and Dach and might not qualify Strome or Kubilik but that is unlikely.

They aresaying the only players not currently available are Jones, Toews and Kane.  Jones because they just gave up the farm to get him and give him a massive contract. Toews and Kane because they have been the faces of the franchise for Cup Winners. Both control their destiny though with one year left at over $10 million. They can both go to management and say they want out and I think that is what the Hawks want at this point it is just semantics. Hawks are looking at a full rebuild and I doubt either want to extend after this season.

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1 minute ago, Flashsabre said:

The insiders are saying they are taking calls on DeBrincat and Dach and might not qualify Strome or Kubilik but that is unlikely

I would be interested in Dach for the right price. What would it take? a second and a third? Two seconds? I could be convinced to give up Florida's pick this year but I'd still be on the fence for that.

 

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26 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Not sure if management has come out and said it, but they are allegedly shopping everyone of value.

They fired their coach and their GM and finished the season playing under .400 hockey.

Hawks have traded 8 of their past 10 first-rounders and don’t have one this year either. Alex Debrincat is the only non-1st of note to come out of their system in that period and their prospect list is among the worst in the league.

I think their entire list of good players in their prime is Debrincat and Seth Jones, and their interesting pieces might start and end with McCabe, Murphy and the disappointing Kirby Dach. They do have some money under the cap, but even the very best free agents on sweet deals arent going to turn this around.

And that’s ignoring the stinking dung heap that the franchise is off-ice between the Beach disgrace and the owner’s embarrassing reaction.

I think the Hawks are the league’s biggest mess and are in desperate need of a saviour in the best season to be bad since 2015. 

Going for it one more time would be the epitome of foolishness.

McCabe you say ...

😉

 

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40 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Not sure if management has come out and said it, but they are allegedly shopping everyone of value.

Quote

On Saturday, Sportsnet's Elliotte Friedman said the Blackhawks could be worth watching in the trade market. He excluded Patrick Kane, Jonathan Toews and Seth Jones because of their no-movement clauses but indicated they're testing the market for anyone else on their roster that other clubs are willing to ask about. 

Chicago Sun-Times' Ben Pope believes Kane and Toews can't and won't be traded unless they request it. However, he suggested their decisions could be determined by Davidson's moves this summer. 

The long-time Blackhawks stars each have a year remaining on their identical contracts and could be lukewarm to the idea of a long rebuild. Should one or both ask to be traded, their hefty $10.5 million cap hits would make them difficult to move.

This from the Hockey News, as stated by our insider @tom webster the price of obtaining Kane wouldn't be significant so I have no idea why someone would say it would take significant assets to get him, he would be owed 6.9M for next year but has a 4M bonus coming on July 1st so the cap hit is 10M but the actual salary would be 2.9M. So in reality Chicago wouldn't have to keep salary in trade. As for the significant assets, I don't think anyone has advocated for that. He would have to waive his NMC to come here which means to me if he came here, he wanted to be here. The PR of obtaining the greatest American born player who happens to be from WNY would outweigh just about anything else. If the Sabres would make this move it's already been established that Granato and Adams know him so their opinion of him is already set IMO. 

If we can get him for cheap, I don't see the downside. If he doesn't want to leave Chicago for whatever reason, good for him and God bless.

 

 

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1 hour ago, SDS said:

He wanted out. Doesn’t that automatically disqualify him?

His Wife is from and they live during offseason in Chicago, it was an easy decision for Him. 
 

If Chicago wants to move Him and Buffalo isn’t on His M NTC, I would consider it 

Edited by Brawndo
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2 hours ago, dudacek said:

Not sure if management has come out and said it, but they are allegedly shopping everyone of value.

They fired their coach and their GM and finished the season playing under .400 hockey.

Hawks have traded 8 of their past 10 first-rounders and don’t have one this year either. Alex Debrincat is the only non-1st of note to come out of their system in that period and their prospect list is among the worst in the league.

I think their entire list of good players in their prime is Debrincat and Seth Jones, and their interesting pieces might start and end with McCabe, Murphy and the disappointing Kirby Dach. They do have some money under the cap, but even the very best free agents on sweet deals arent going to turn this around.

And that’s ignoring the stinking dung heap that the franchise is off-ice between the Beach disgrace and the owner’s embarrassing reaction.

I think the Hawks are the league’s biggest mess and are in desperate need of a saviour in the best season to be bad since 2015. 

Going for it one more time would be the epitome of foolishness.

 

2 hours ago, Flashsabre said:

They have a new front office, and new coaching staff led by Richardson.

The insiders are saying they are taking calls on DeBrincat and Dach and might not qualify Strome or Kubilik but that is unlikely.

They aresaying the only players not currently available are Jones, Toews and Kane.  Jones because they just gave up the farm to get him and give him a massive contract. Toews and Kane because they have been the faces of the franchise for Cup Winners. Both control their destiny though with one year left at over $10 million. They can both go to management and say they want out and I think that is what the Hawks want at this point it is just semantics. Hawks are looking at a full rebuild and I doubt either want to extend after this season.

 

Good stuff here gents.  Thanks.

Still -- it wouldn't be the first time that an NHL franchise has refused to turn the page at what seemed like the logical time to do so.

I'll also say that the picture painted by these 2 posts isn't that of a team that would give up Kane for a price I'd be willing to pay (#28, Portillo/Johnson and a #2 -- and only if Kane signs an extension as part of the deal).

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