Is the prospect pipeline progressing enough?

[Cage]

I wish someone would have pushed Kevyn Adams on this a bit.  Assuming Ryan Johnson doesn't change his mind and stays in school, when was the last time there wasn't a single new prospect debuting in Rochester for the next season?  I don't think its happened as far back as I can recall.  No college graduates signing either.  I'm not sure why there's not a push to bring some the Swedish players over to develop further?

Assuming Quinn and Peterka advance to Sabres, there be only Pekar, Laaksonen, Weissbach and Rousek on the Amerk next year from among draftees

Edited May 6, 2022 by Cage

[ddaryl]

We are seeing some real progression with our pipeline to the point that we need to fill it up again 

We more than likely will see a few more Rochester players make the jump next year which means Rochester  needs to be restocked

[Doohickie]

Let's see how draft and free agency goes (particularly college signings).

[GoPuckYourself]

22 minutes ago, Cage said:

I wish someone would have pushed Kevyn Adams on this a bit.  Assuming Ryan Johnson doesn't change his mind and stays in school, when was the last time there wasn't a single new prospect debuting in Rochester for the next season?  I don't think its happened as far back as I can recall.  No college graduates signing either.  I'm not sure why there's not a push to bring some the Swedish players over to develop further?

Assuming Quinn and Peterka advance to Sabres, there be only Pekar, Laaksonen, Weissbach and Rousek on the Amerk next year from among draftees

I'm not sure but isn't Isaak Rosen going to be added to Rochester, I would think that makes sense. Plus we'll have this entire draft class upcoming, I would assume a few make it to Rochester.

[ddaryl]

7 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

Let's see how draft and free agency goes (particularly college signings).

How many College players do you foresee making the jump to the Amerks ?

The draft maybe gets us 1 or 2 AHL ready players IMO.

[GASabresIUFAN]

Tyson Novak could be signed this offseason and debut with the Amerks in the fall.   The issue we are having is that the middle 4 picks in 2019 remain in college or Europe.  The good news is all 4 remain legit prospects and all 4 had really good years last season (Johnson, Portillo, Huglen and Cederqvist).  

KA's 2020 draft is having similar issues to Jbot's 2019.  The top 2 prospects developed quickly (this is a good thing), but the other 3 picks, who are all also progressing nicely, remain in college or Europe.  Costantini had a very solid college season, Lyckasen, RHD, played well in the SWE-1 including 5 points in 9 playoff games and Konecny played in the top Czech league.

So while there is a void in Rochester, 7 quality guys from 2019 and 2020 are making good headway.  I suspect in 2023-24 many of these guys in Rochester.  Add 2021 prospects like Nadeau, Nozak and Bloom and Rochester could be over flowing in prospects in 2023-24.

Edited May 6, 2022 by GASabresIUFAN

[dudacek]

The issue is not about the pipeline, its about the Amerks.

It's mostly about Peterka and Quinn expected to arrive in the NHL early and Johnson and Portillo staying an unexpected year

[bob_sauve28]

The pipeline is about to be pumped full of new prospects in the next few years. We have a crazy number of draft picks. I think, if the draft well, the pipeline might just burst! 

[dudacek]

As far as the pipeline goes, Portillo, Levi and Johnson are still in it.

Next year you are going to see people paying more attention to Rosen, Poltapov, Kisakov, Bloom, Nadeau, Costantini, Huglen, Rousek and others, many of whom could be on the Amerks in 23/24.

And 4 shiny new toys will be added in the first 4 picks of the draft. 2021/22/23 that should keep the pipeline gushing for a while.

[Doohickie]

6 minutes ago, bob_sauve28 said:

The pipeline is about to be pumped full of new prospects in the next few years. We have a crazy number of draft picks. I think, if the draft well, the pipeline might just burst! 

 

10 minutes ago, dudacek said:

The issue is not about the pipeline, its about the Amerks.

It's mostly about Peterka and Quinn expected to arrive in the NHL early and Johnson and Portillo staying an unexpected year

 

[Curt]

42 minutes ago, GoPuckYourself said:

I'm not sure but isn't Isaak Rosen going to be added to Rochester, I would think that makes sense. Plus we'll have this entire draft class upcoming, I would assume a few make it to Rochester.

Isak Rosen is not coming over to Rochester as far as I know.

No 18-19 year olds straight out of the draft will be heading straight to the AHL.  That almost never happens.

 

35 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Tyson Novak could be signed this offseason and debut with the Amerks in the fall.   The issue we are having is that the middle 4 picks in 2019 remain in college or Europe.  The good news is all 4 remain legit prospects and all 4 had really good years last season (Johnson, Portillo, Huglen and Cederqvist).  

KA's 2020 draft is having similar issues to Jbot's 2019.  The top 2 prospects developed quickly (this is a good thing), but the other 3 picks, who are all also progressing nicely, remain in college or Europe.  Costantini had a very solid college season, Lyckasen, RHD, played well in the SWE-1 including 5 points in 9 playoff games and Konecny played in the top Czech league.

So while there is a void in Rochester, 7 quality guys from 2019 and 2020 are making good headway.  I suspect in 2023-24 many of these guys in Rochester.  Add 2021 prospects like Nadeau, Nozak and Bloom and Rochester could be over flowing in prospects in 2023-24.

With all possible respect. I believe that the prospect you are referring to is Tyson Kozak, not Novak or Nozak, center in the WHL.

[LGR4GM]

48 minutes ago, GoPuckYourself said:

I'm not sure but isn't Isaak Rosen going to be added to Rochester, I would think that makes sense. Plus we'll have this entire draft class upcoming, I would assume a few make it to Rochester.

Isak Rosen is signed in Sweden through the 2022-2023 season. He will not be heading to Rochester this year.

47 minutes ago, ddaryl said:

How many College players do you foresee making the jump to the Amerks ?

The draft maybe gets us 1 or 2 AHL ready players IMO.

No team is assigning their recent NHL drafted 18yr olds to the AHL. 

Rochester will continue to look the way it does until the Sabres are fixed (which is closer) because the talent flows up in an org, not down. Sabres get a build up of talent it keeps guys in Rochester. 

2 minutes ago, Curt said:

Isak Rosen is not coming over to Rochester as far as I know.

No 18-19 year olds straight out of the draft will be heading straight to the AHL.  That almost never happens.

 

With all possible respect. I believe that the prospect you are referring to is Tyson Kozak, not Novak or Nozak, center in the WHL.

It is indeed. Tyson Kozak, C Portland Winterhawks. 

[Curt]

Echoing what others have said, the pipeline and the progress of Sabres prospects is looking to be in very good shape.  It just looks like by random chance there won’t be any new prospects joining Rochester next season.  It will probably swing the opposite way for Rochester in 2023-24, with several new prospects joining the team.

[LGR4GM]

2 minutes ago, Curt said:

Echoing what others have said, the pipeline and the progress of Sabres prospects is looking to be in very good shape.  It just looks like by random chance there won’t be any new prospects joining Rochester next season.  It will probably swing the opposite way for Rochester in 2023-24, with several new prospects joining the team.

Part of the issue is that the 2019 guys are already there or gone. The 2020 draft only has 2 guys currently as everyone else is either in college or overseas. The 2021 draft only has Power currently in that pro hockey ready area and he's going to be in Buffalo. Kozak is the only guy from the 2021 draft who can join the Amerks so it is a bit of a weird fluke for sure.

[woods-racer]

The number of draft picks is also a large factor in all this. KA only got 5 picks in his first draft (2020). His first order of business was to remedy that (he has spoke about this at length) and the following year he had 11 draft picks.

Prior to 2021 you have to go back to 2016 to see another larger the normal ( 6 draftees ) class. Size matters, it gives the GM that many more chances of finding a diamond in the late rounds. Teams that are the best at finding those diamonds get good and stay good. Prior to 2017/18 the Sabres where still horrible at finding solid players after the first round (I am generalizing here). Hence why the cupboards still appear bare.

If Botterill and KA did/do a reasonably competent job of drafting after 2018 Rochester will really see that fruit of that next year.

[French Collection]

It is tough to have that steady flow of 3-5 draft picks into the AHL every year. Europeans often stay at home longer, NCAA guys stay in school 1-4 years and some CHL guys never develop enough. 
 

I’m pretty sure this is an unusual year for the Sabres past draft picks. KA may find a FA or two from Europe or the NCAA. DG may spot someone at the World Championship.

 

[Johnny Utah]

Amerks got Olischefski from Providence and Knoepke from Nebraska-Omaha but they have been healthy scratches since there are so many player on roster right now. Always movement to and from teams in AHL so I'm sure they will fill the gaps until the 2021 draft class arrives. Having said that, I really hope KA doesn't double up on the Russians in this years draft as we need to make sure some of the new pipeline actually wants to play in NA

[thewookie1]

The biggest issue for Rochester is that good players are either skipping the AHL like Cozens or quickly skill their way out of the AHL like Quinn and likely Peterka. College players rarely leave college to play in the AHL fulltime and Juniors players tend to hold there until ready for the NHL. Add to that the new SHL rule and the AHL will be in some serious trouble.

[GASabresIUFAN]

I’m not really about the pipeline.  My “worry” is how quickly some of our young forwards price themselves out of the team.  How quickly Rosen and other forwards start pushing on guys like Asplund, Girgensons and KO etc…

[Taro T]

9 minutes ago, thewookie1 said:

The biggest issue for Rochester is that good players are either skipping the AHL like Cozens or quickly skill their way out of the AHL like Quinn and likely Peterka. College players rarely leave college to play in the AHL fulltime and Juniors players tend to hold there until ready for the NHL. Add to that the new SHL rule and the AHL will be in some serious trouble.

The AHL, & the Amerks, will be fine once the AHL & NHL adjust to having added 2 more NHL teams in the past 4 years.

Except for the tweak to the SHL transfer agreement, all those issues you mention were there prior to adding Vegas & Seattle.

[LGR4GM]

49 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

I’m not really about the pipeline.  My “worry” is how quickly some of our young forwards price themselves out of the team.  How quickly Rosen and other forwards start pushing on guys like Asplund, Girgensons and KO etc…

Asplund is only 24.

[Curt]

2 hours ago, Johnny Utah said:

Amerks got Olischefski from Providence and Knoepke from Nebraska-Omaha but they have been healthy scratches since there are so many player on roster right now. Always movement to and from teams in AHL so I'm sure they will fill the gaps until the 2021 draft class arrives. Having said that, I really hope KA doesn't double up on the Russians in this years draft as we need to make sure some of the new pipeline actually wants to play in NA

What do you mean by the bolded?  Do you mean in the NHL or do you mean in the AHL?

If a Russian prospect wants to stay in Russian until he is NHL ready, that doesn’t really bother me. Draft the better prospect.  I don’t care if he ever plays in Rochester.

[GASabresIUFAN]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

Asplund is only 24.

and?  I love his defense and he seems to have found himself this year as a playmaker.  If he continues to develop his O game, he'll become a roster necessity.  If he fails, then he could find himself traded to another organization as more forwards push from below.

Not everyone youngish forward is a core player.  Some will have to go to make room for kids in the pretty near future.  

Edited May 6, 2022 by GASabresIUFAN

[LGR4GM]

1 minute ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

and?  I love his defense and he seems to have found himself this year as a playmaker.  If he continues to develop his O game, he'll become a roster necessity.  If he fails, then he could find himself traded to another organization as more forwards push from below.

What forwards? Outside of Quinn and JJ there's no one coming in the next year or probably 2 or 3.

[GASabresIUFAN]

15 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

What forwards? Outside of Quinn and JJ there's no one coming in the next year or probably 2 or 3.

That maybe true, but at some point Rosen, the Russians, Huglen and others will start to push from below.  Maybe even Rousek sooner then later.  

I can also see our 9th and 16th picks this season if forwards possibly making an impact even soon.  I really want Ohgren (16) and Lekkerimaki (9).