Robin Lehner trashes Sabres Medical Staff

[msw2112]

I don't give a lot of credence to Lehner's claims and think they have nothing to do with Eichel's situation.

• Lehner was in the midst of major mental health issues while in Buffalo (and the Sabres went out of their way to help him)
• I don't know much about the Sabres medical staff at the time, but that staff is no longer with the team (so no impact on Eichel situation)
• Lehner is on his third team since leaving Buffalo, so his 5th overall and he's not that old of a guy.  Perhaps that says something about Lehner.  (I think Vegas has made a big mistake by trading Fleury in favor of Lehner.)

All of these points have been made above - I agree with all of them and am summarizing them here.

[nfreeman]

56 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

There's nothing wrong with judging each situation on merit, rather than always go with "the Sabres stink. They must be wrong about everything."

Well, to really judge this or any other situation, we'd need all of the facts, and we of course don't have anything remotely approaching a complete picture.  I don't think it's rash to think the Sabres screwed up the medical team hire, especially since (i) they've screwed up a lot of other hires and (ii) they've since replaced that medical team.

OTOH, in light of the statements here supporting the current medical team, I'm inclined to believe that they've corrected that mistake and now have a good group in place.

Also, if Lehner didn't do so on that podcast, it would've been nice if he had credited the Sabres (as @Brawndo pointed out) for digging him out of the abyss.

[Taro T]

40 minutes ago, msw2112 said:

I don't give a lot of credence to Lehner's claims and think they have nothing to do with Eichel's situation.

• Lehner was in the midst of major mental health issues while in Buffalo (and the Sabres went out of their way to help him)
• I don't know much about the Sabres medical staff at the time, but that staff is no longer with the team (so no impact on Eichel situation)
• Lehner is on his third team since leaving Buffalo, so his 5th overall and he's not that old of a guy.  Perhaps that says something about Lehner.  (I think Vegas has made a big mistake by trading Fleury in favor of Lehner.)

All of these points have been made above - I agree with all of them and am summarizing them here.

2 minor additional points to your 1st 2 bullets:

1.  Yes, the Sabres helped him get the treatment he needed.  But this came towards the end of his 3rd year in Buffalo.  Had that been as concerned about his welfare 2 years earlier, his saga and that of the Sabres themselves could've been remarkably different.  (Yes, water under the bridge and we can wish that Lehner could/did move past bitterness/anger over that period, but at this point that is what it is.)

2.  Eichel's 1st ankle injury came the day before Lehner's second season w/ the Sabres began.  He was right there with a better seat than we had to watch that one play out.  Take it w/ a grain of salt & different people are in the roles overseeing treatments & recoveries, but he was there to watch that one.  And yes, that ankle injury has no bearing on the current neck injury.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

2 hours ago, MISabresFan said:

Explains why he couldnt overcome his mental health and substance abuse while with the Sabres until he moved on.

WTF are you talking about?

[darksabre]

4 minutes ago, New Scotland (NS) said:

WTF are you talking about?

Lotsa garbage brained takes about Lehner. I don't even like the guy but people are being needlessly gross about it.

[IKnowPhysics]

 

 

[IKnowPhysics]

However:

 

[IKnowPhysics]

 

[grinreaper]

18 hours ago, Marvin, Sabres Fan said:

They share a lot of medical staff.  You seem to imply that drafting the right quarterback makes the doctors good for the Bills and then they become idiots for the Sabres.

It was that bottom shelf fifth of Bourbon the doctors prescribed for Lehner every day.

[Peter]

5 hours ago, Marvin, Sabres Fan said:

Welcome back to the board.

Thanks!

 

[MDFan]

It seems to me that the Sabres actually treated Lehner quite well in his time in Buffalo, including supporting him through his mental issues.  They received very little in return from Lehner and it seems pretty classless on his part for him to trash the organization now.  At least he and Jack have that in common. 

[Buffalonill]

I wish his agent would tell him to shut up Jesus 

[Ruff Around The Edges]

Robin who?

Robin: Good for you that you are overcoming your demons and I wish you the best going forward: You are bringing awareness for mental health and for that we are all better for it.

As for trashing your former team years later publically: Bad form. Its weak IMO. He is in the rear view mirror for me as a Sabres fan.

[dudacek]

Lehner's time in Buffalo was spent as an addict and a risk to himself and others, on a bad team, with a bad coach and one of the loosest, least-disciplined, least-sensitive managers in recent memory.

He lost a lot, often letting in a late goal to lose 3-2 in a game where he faced 40 shots, and he was embarrassingly bad in shootouts.

Can't speak for Buffalo in general, but on here he was the most-pilloried Sabre of the past 10 years.

Of course he has bad memories of Buffalo.

[Andrew Amerk]

24 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Lehner's time in Buffalo was spent as an addict and a risk to himself and others, on a bad team, with a bad coach and one of the loosest, least-disciplined, least-sensitive managers in recent memory.

He lost a lot, often letting in a late goal to lose 3-2 in a game where he faced 40 shots, and he was embarrassingly bad in shootouts.

Can't speak for Buffalo in general, but on here he was the most-pilloried Sabre of the past 10 years.

Of course he has bad memories of Buffalo.

Sabres fans were spoiled to have such great goaltending back to back with Hasek and then Miller. Any goalie since them hasn’t held a candle to their predecessors, and has gotten roasted by the fans in the process. 

Hell, even Miller was heavily debated about on here. 

It sucks that a lot of us can’t appreciate any goalies we have because they aren’t the greatest goalie of all time that we were blessed to see with the Sabres. Ullmark, as an example, is a better goalie than a lot of fans realize. 

[Pimlach]

2 hours ago, dudacek said:

Lehner's time in Buffalo was spent as an addict and a risk to himself and others, on a bad team, with a bad coach and one of the loosest, least-disciplined, least-sensitive managers in recent memory.

He lost a lot, often letting in a late goal to lose 3-2 in a game where he faced 40 shots, and he was embarrassingly bad in shootouts.

Can't speak for Buffalo in general, but on here he was the most-pilloried Sabre of the past 10 years.

Of course he has bad memories of Buffalo.

His bad memories are from his addiction, the poor play of team, the dysfunction of the organization, and his own poor play.  
 

Murray, the most incompetent of GMs, knew him in Ottawa and traded for him, and apparently did not know what was going on with him.  
 

Lehner played much better with the Islanders, yet Lou Lamorella let him go.  The Black Hawks gave him just one year as well.  

[Pimlach]

2 hours ago, Andrew Amerk said:

Sabres fans were spoiled to have such great goaltending back to back with Hasek and then Miller. Any goalie since them hasn’t held a candle to their predecessors, and has gotten roasted by the fans in the process. 

Hell, even Miller was heavily debated about on here. 

It sucks that a lot of us can’t appreciate any goalies we have because they aren’t the greatest goalie of all time that we were blessed to see with the Sabres. Ullmark, as an example, is a better goalie than a lot of fans realize. 

This is not on the fans. Hasek is long forgotten and other teams have had even greater goaltending legacies.   

Lehner needs to be a accountable for his actions on and off the ice.  

[Hoss]

I think Robin's criticism of Buffalo should alarm us all and not just be dismissed because we didn't love the price paid for him, his overall performance or what he's said about the team since. @nfreemanmade a point about the defense of a franchise that has done nothing but lose for a decade now. Lehner went on to be a Vezina finalist AND, maybe more relevant here, a Masterton finalist for a player who "best exemplifies the qualities of perseverance, sportsmanship, and dedication to ice hockey." Not to mention the team who had the Vezina winner last season just got rid of that player in favor of him.

He has found success and solid ground once leaving this situation. I don't believe for a second things have changed enough nor do the result reflect an improved environment ... Not to mention three of our most notable players have made every effort to leave the team (one being the captain and star).

This franchise might be the worst-run organization in North America over the last ten years.

[Weave]

4 hours ago, Hoss said:

I think Robin's criticism of Buffalo should alarm us all and not just be dismissed because we didn't love the price paid for him, his overall performance or what he's said about the team since. @nfreemanmade a point about the defense of a franchise that has done nothing but lose for a decade now. Lehner went on to be a Vezina finalist AND, maybe more relevant here, a Masterton finalist for a player who "best exemplifies the qualities of perseverance, sportsmanship, and dedication to ice hockey." Not to mention the team who had the Vezina winner last season just got rid of that player in favor of him.

He has found success and solid ground once leaving this situation. I don't believe for a second things have changed enough nor do the result reflect an improved environment ... Not to mention three of our most notable players have made every effort to leave the team (one being the captain and star).

This franchise might be the worst-run organization in North America over the last ten years.

This smells of truth-iness.  We all hate when someone trashes our team.  We all lean towards defense of what is ours.  But Lehner's comments were likely heartfelt, and givien the exodus of players off this team that don't want to be here we probably shouldn't dismiss them.  This team is a wreck.

Edited August 13, 2021 by Weave

[Pimlach]

6 hours ago, Hoss said:

I think Robin's criticism of Buffalo should alarm us all and not just be dismissed because we didn't love the price paid for him, his overall performance or what he's said about the team since. @nfreemanmade a point about the defense of a franchise that has done nothing but lose for a decade now. Lehner went on to be a Vezina finalist AND, maybe more relevant here, a Masterton finalist for a player who "best exemplifies the qualities of perseverance, sportsmanship, and dedication to ice hockey." Not to mention the team who had the Vezina winner last season just got rid of that player in favor of him.

He has found success and solid ground once leaving this situation. I don't believe for a second things have changed enough nor do the result reflect an improved environment ... Not to mention three of our most notable players have made every effort to leave the team (one being the captain and star).

This franchise might be the worst-run organization in North America over the last ten years.

Yes, you are right and the truth hurts.  Maybe our medical staff is improved but let’s not forget some of our best players just became free agents and left.  Players that get traded away are relieved to be gone.  The common denominator over the past 10 years is the ownership. 

[HoosierDaddy]

29 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

Yes, you are right and the truth hurts.  Maybe our medical staff is improved but let’s not forget some of our best players just became free agents and left.  Players that get traded away are relieved to be gone.  The common denominator over the past 10 years is the ownership. 

Everything he says is probably true, but why is he talking about this now? I think we know why, and that’s why i argue that KA’s biggest mistake is not controlling the narrative better. Thanks to Jack and his agent, the Sabres are getting a reputation amongst NHL players as a place where you don’t get treatment for injuries. This just adds to that narrative, and it’s a naked attempt to force KA to take whatever table scraps that he can get. But the side effects could be catastrophic to our rebuilding efforts. The danger is becoming the NHL version of the Sacramento Kings, a team that can never finish rebuilds because no free agents will go there. 

[SHAAAUGHT!!!]

7 hours ago, Hoss said:

I think Robin's criticism of Buffalo should alarm us all and not just be dismissed because we didn't love the price paid for him, his overall performance or what he's said about the team since. @nfreemanmade a point about the defense of a franchise that has done nothing but lose for a decade now. Lehner went on to be a Vezina finalist AND, maybe more relevant here, a Masterton finalist for a player who "best exemplifies the qualities of perseverance, sportsmanship, and dedication to ice hockey." Not to mention the team who had the Vezina winner last season just got rid of that player in favor of him.

He has found success and solid ground once leaving this situation. I don't believe for a second things have changed enough nor do the result reflect an improved environment ... Not to mention three of our most notable players have made every effort to leave the team (one being the captain and star).

This franchise might be the worst-run organization in North America over the last ten years.

 

2 hours ago, Weave said:

This smells of truth-iness.  We all hate when someone trashes our team.  We all lean towards defense of what is ours.  But Lehner's comments were likely heartfelt, and givien the exodus of players off this team that don't want to be here we probably shouldn't dismiss them.  This team is a wreck.

The team is a wreck, it's horribly run, and the problems start at the top and end with the product on the ice.  Lehner's comment's appear heartfelt, and honest.  

That said, it doesn't mean what Lehner said is correct or right.  He is an emotional guy, and not in a bad way.  He appears thoughtful and concerned about others well being and isn't afraid to put himself out there to get a message across.  He has a lot of issues with the way players heath is managed in the NHL  and I think this was an opportunity to bring up the topic of player care because that is something that is on his mind every.single.day.  

I have a lot of experience dealing with people in high pressure situations losing their cool or taking out their frustration tangentially and a lot of it depends on their mental state at that time.  I see a lot of that in his statements, which is why maybe I'm being a bit more dismissive of his actual comments than others...

 

 

[LGR4GM]

8 hours ago, Hoss said:

I think Robin's criticism of Buffalo should alarm us all and not just be dismissed because we didn't love the price paid for him, his overall performance or what he's said about the team since. @nfreemanmade a point about the defense of a franchise that has done nothing but lose for a decade now. Lehner went on to be a Vezina finalist AND, maybe more relevant here, a Masterton finalist for a player who "best exemplifies the qualities of perseverance, sportsmanship, and dedication to ice hockey." Not to mention the team who had the Vezina winner last season just got rid of that player in favor of him.

He has found success and solid ground once leaving this situation. I don't believe for a second things have changed enough nor do the result reflect an improved environment ... Not to mention three of our most notable players have made every effort to leave the team (one being the captain and star).

This franchise might be the worst-run organization in North America over the last ten years.

It would alarm me if he wasn't talking about something from 4 years ago and my understanding is the person who did this was fired after 8 months according to Paul Hamilton. Hammy also mentioned on WGR that Babcock was actually the one who suggested the person but unfortunately WGR didn't press him on that from what I remember. 

This is the equivalent of saying the ROR was awful so the Eichel trade will be just is bad. Could it? yes but one does not predict the other because the ppl involved are gone. 

Edited August 13, 2021 by LGR4GM

[Pimlach]

10 minutes ago, SHAAAUGHT!!! said:

 

The team is a wreck, it's horribly run, and the problems start at the top and end with the product on the ice.  Lehner's comment's appear heartfelt, and honest.  

That said, it doesn't mean what Lehner said is correct or right.  He is an emotional guy, and not in a bad way.  He appears thoughtful and concerned about others well being and isn't afraid to put himself out there to get a message across.  He has a lot of issues with the way players heath is managed in the NHL  and I think this was an opportunity to bring up the topic of player care because that is something that is on his mind every.single.day.  

I have a lot of experience dealing with people in high pressure situations losing their cool or taking out their frustration tangentially and a lot of it depends on their mental state at that time.  I see a lot of that in his statements, which is why maybe I'm being a bit more dismissive of his actual comments than others...

 

 

And now we are talking about the medical staff, not the current one, the prior one.  This team can’t get a break.  
 

This goes to show that experience matters.  People argue with me on this point, and yes sometimes bringing in first time leaders is a good thing - especially bright young minds that will shake things up in a positive way.   But you can’t have an organization where everyone in leadership is essentially new at their jobs.   We shouldn’t be talking about our medical staff and whether it’s good enough or not.  Eichel is clearly using the injury to get out of Buffalo and Lehner’s comments make us look worse, even if the medical staff has since been improved.  
 

This all goes back to the front office team that Pegula’s put together in the post Regier/Ruff era.  When will we stop paying for mistakes of the past?   It important that KA hold strong on the Eichel trade. 

[Hoss]

16 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

It would alarm me if he wasn't talking about something from 4 years ago and my understanding is the person who did this was fired after 8 months according to Paul Hamilton. Hammy also mentioned on WGR that Babcock was actually the one who suggested the person but unfortunately WGR didn't press him on that from what I remember. 

This is the equivalent of saying the ROR was awful so the Eichel trade will be just is bad. Could it? yes but one does not predict the other because the ppl involved are gone. 

If there weren’t a similar pattern of comments coming out within the last few months from other players (and their agents) then I would agree but that’d require me to ignore the fact that it is indeed happening. There is a stench and it didn’t come and go because we fired a guy who may or may not have been suggested by someone who never even worked for the organization (and, in fact, turned the organization down in favor of the team just a short drive north).

There isn’t much criticism for this team that isn’t warranted and I don’t believe the organization has earned anyone’s energy spent in defense of it.

All that said, go Sabres. May we someday bleed blue and gold again (ideally with a competent medical staff on hand to inform us on the proper handling of such a disorder).