Official Jason Karmanos Hired as Sabres Associate GM

[nucci]

10 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

If I'm not mistaken ticket sales for the opened up games were/are incredibly slow and I'm not sure they even sold them all. This reality may have finally woken Terry up from his deluded dream and he sees no option but to market a new climate of hope or else ticket sales for next year will be non existent. The only way to create that feeling of hope and renewal is to bring in a name hockey person like Rutherford (or Dudley, still my preferred choice). 

So in a way, I think Terry faced the choice. Either sell the team or step back and let it be reborn . At least I hope that's it. 

a 6-23-4 record wasn't enough

[NAF]

1 hour ago, StuckinFL said:

This would almost be a dream come true but I have to say after 10 years I'm hesitant to believe it. How many times have we been given hope that this ship is turning around only to have those hopes be dashed upon the rocks.

Exactly how I feel. And even if the rumor is true I don't even know if Rutherford can fix this mess. It just seems like everything that the organization touches turns to ash.

[msw2112]

I think that Pegula wants to do the right thing to fix the franchise.  He just doesn't know what it is.  Some of the previous moves he's made looked like the right ones (Bylsma, Housley, Botterill, (even) Krueger, etc.) and didn't work out.  Even the tank arguably wasn't a horrible strategy - it worked in Pittsburgh and Chicago.  Obviously, it hasn't in Buffalo.  Adams is someone he trusts and I think they are taking their time to make sure they get it right this time.  Going with the interim coach while they sort out the front office was a good decision.  The newly revamped FO, once in place, can decide who/what they want for a coach.

I realize this is the glass half-full, optimistic view.

Edited March 29, 2021 by msw2112

[Sabres Fan in NS]

8 minutes ago, msw2112 said:

I think that Pegula wants to do the right thing to fix the franchise.  He just doesn't know what it is.  Some of the previous moves he's made looked like the right ones (Bylsma, Housley, Botterill, (even) Krueger, etc.) and didn't work out.  Even the tank arguably wasn't a horrible strategy - it worked in Pittsburgh and Chicago.  Obviously, it hasn't in Buffalo.  Adams is someone he trusts and I think they are taking their time to make sure they get it right this time.  Going with the interim coach while they sort out the front office was a good decision.  The newly revamped FO, once in place, can decide who/what they want for a coach.

I realize this is the glass half-full, optimistic view.

The tank was a horrible strategy.  No doubt.  The price was always going to be too high.  Very high risk.

[Gatorman0519]

17 minutes ago, New Scotland (NS) said:

The tank was a horrible strategy.  No doubt.  The price was always going to be too high.  Very high risk.

That team was going to be bad anyways in 2015-2017.  Real bad. If we got McDavid this might be a different discussion.  What was bad was the GM’s he put in charge.  Their decision making and player development was beyond terrible. 

[WildCard]

Obligatory the tank was right the rebuild was wrong yada-yada-yada

[darksabre]

1 hour ago, That Aud Smell said:

Beane's on record saying that the ultimate decision on whether to take Allen was his to make.

OTOH, the fact that Terry and Kim traveled to Wyoming with Beane, McDermott, and Daboll isn't exactly "staying away" from football matters. Maybe the franchise QB is a unique matter. Anyway: Here's what Allen had to say following the draft:

Q: What was your reaction like when you got to meet Terry before you were drafted?

Allen: Yeah, so he came out to Laramie, Wyoming. He came out with Kim and the coaching staff and we sat down and we had dinner. We went out there and he kind of saw me throw and he followed me coming back to the facilities about two weeks ago. [I’ve been] getting to talk with him again just get to know him and for him to getting to see how I really ticked. Turns out, he really liked what he saw.

 

I get that the Pegulas are definitely...around. Terry especially seems to just like to be tottering around in his dad sneakers feeling like he's involved, even though he has no idea what is going on.

My hope is that people who are used to dealing with him, or people like him, know how to...uh, humor, Terry. I have to imagine he's not the first sports owner who wants to believe he's helping.

[Randall Flagg]

2 minutes ago, darksabre said:

I get that the Pegulas are definitely...around. Terry especially seems to just like to be tottering around in his dad sneakers feeling like he's involved, even though he has no idea what is going on.

My hope is that people who are used to dealing with him, or people like him, know how to...uh, humor, Terry. I have to imagine he's not the first sports owner who wants to believe he's helping.

I've thought about this before, if I owned a team, it'd be hard to balance the fact that I definitely want to be in the room just as a fan because it's really interesting and exciting, with the possibility that my presence could be off-putting, making people second guess the logic/instincts that brought them here in the first place, mildly threatening etc. 

 

[Sabre fan]

Interesting to see Torts struggle to get Columbus going...back-to-back losses to Detroit did not go over well and Laine is on pace to score less then Skinner. I think it is safe to say that Torts may be on his way out but while I have advocated bringing him in to kick butt and get this team motivated,   at the end of the day I think I prefer Boudreau along with Rutherford and Karmanos being added. That would bring respectability back to the franchise almost overnight.

[darksabre]

43 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

I've thought about this before, if I owned a team, it'd be hard to balance the fact that I definitely want to be in the room just as a fan because it's really interesting and exciting, with the possibility that my presence could be off-putting, making people second guess the logic/instincts that brought them here in the first place, mildly threatening etc. 

 

Thanks for expanding, this is exactly it.

It's distinctly possible that some of the much speculated Pegula meddling was more accidental than intentional, a case of inexperienced owners too involved in the work and unaware of the harm it was doing, and inexperienced management too accommodating to draw a line over it.

[LabattBlue]

So as the time passes and no news, does it mean...

- Karmonos is a done deal, and hoping to get Rutherford also before announcing anything?

- Karmanos doesn’t like what he sees and hears and is waffling, and Rutherford becomes a pipe dream?

[PromoTheRobot]

1 minute ago, LabattBlue said:

So as the time passes and no news, does it mean...

- Karmonos is a done deal, and hoping to get Rutherford also before announcing anything?

- Karmanos doesn’t like what he sees and hears and is waffling, and Rutherford becomes a pipe dream?

I mean it's no secret the team is a mess. What spooked him?

[LabattBlue]

Just now, PromoTheRobot said:

I mean it's no secret the team is a mess. What spooked him?

Speaking to or meeting Terry? 😈

[PerreaultForever]

1 hour ago, nucci said:

a 6-23-4 record wasn't enough

He's a business man first and foremost. Harold Ballard said he was a Leaf's fan but ran that team into the ground for years because he was still making a buck. 

[OhMyDahlin]

I'm just scared of Rutherford's building strategy...he constantly trades draft picks and he left Pittsburgh with literally zero prospects.

[Zamboni]

21 minutes ago, LabattBlue said:

So as the time passes and no news, does it mean...

- Karmonos is a done deal, and hoping to get Rutherford also before announcing anything?

Most likely this… Plain and simple…

 

or all the reports and rumors floating around were 100% wrong… It could be that too .. 😂

[Randall Flagg]

3 minutes ago, OhMyDahlin said:

I'm just scared of Rutherford's building strategy...he constantly trades draft picks and he left Pittsburgh with literally zero prospects.

If Chad is right, I don't think Rutherford is building our roster.

And even if he was building our roster, I don't think he'd treat it the same way as he'd treat a Penguins roster trying to win now and wring more cups out of Crosby/Malkin. 

But this rumor says that KA would retain final authority on making trades and roster moves

[OhMyDahlin]

2 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

If Chad is right, I don't think Rutherford is building our roster.

And even if he was building our roster, I don't think he'd treat it the same way as he'd treat a Penguins roster trying to win now and wring more cups out of Crosby/Malkin. 

But this rumor says that KA would retain final authority on making trades and roster moves

I hope you're right (or "Chad" is), because that is not the kind of roster building we need.

I like the idea of the hire, but I got thinking about that and it got me worried.

[LabattBlue]

7 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

But this rumor says that KA would retain final authority on making trades and roster moves

...and this should make me feel better?  😱

[Randall Flagg]

5 minutes ago, LabattBlue said:

...and this should make me feel better?  😱

[Flashsabre]

50 minutes ago, OhMyDahlin said:

I'm just scared of Rutherford's building strategy...he constantly trades draft picks and he left Pittsburgh with literally zero prospects.

But you have to remember that Rutherford was trying to win a Stanley Cup during Crosby and Malkin’s peak years.  Moving draft picks/prospects for known talent that can help you win now is what they all do when they are a contender.

 

Rebuilding is a totally different situation and strategy.

Rutherford’s role here would be to shepherd the organization, making sure everything is running smoothly.  Adams would still be GM.  Rutherford brings a ton of respect around the league.  People will look at the Buffalo organization and not say “complete tire fire” but rather that they have a lot of vet experience overseeing things and I might be open to joining them now.  That holds a lot of weight with players, agents, scouts, front office people, coaches you want to try and attract.

[dudacek]

If you think Adams, is an energetic agile thinker with vision, who can lead, but lacks knowledge adn connections, and Rutherford is a font of knowledge and connections, with reduced energy and vision, then you have the makings of a pretty good team if they work well together.

You would hope Karmanos and the mysterious "other guys" can supply a healthy dose of administrative structure and the talent evaluation.

Edited March 29, 2021 by dudacek

[SDS]

Just now, dudacek said:

If you think Adams, is an energetic agile thinker with vision, who can lead, but lacks knowledge, and Rutherford is a font of knowledge with reduced energy and vision, then you have the makings of a pretty good team if they work well together.

You would hope Karmanos and the mysterious "other guys" can supply a healthy dose of administrative structure and the talent evaluation.

The best thing about the other guys is that they are whoever we pretend they are.

[dudacek]

2 minutes ago, SDS said:

The best thing about the other guys is that they are whoever we pretend they are.

Very true.

Smart leaders do, however, try to build complementary teams.

 

[Scottysabres]

5 minutes ago, SDS said:

The best thing about the other guys is that they are whoever we pretend they are.

I hereby invite PG&E to pretend I am one of those. I will however, be expecting my very real paycheck. 🙂