Don Granato Interim Coach for Sabres/Ellis and Girardi to the Bench. Steve Smith Fired

[darksabre]

19 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Different voice is always interesting.

Did we really ever like the pressers from Housley and Bylsma?

The curse of intertextuality on the coaching progression. Our opinion of one coach is inherently tied to our opinion of the coach that came before and the coach that will inevitably come after. 

[pi2000]

1 hour ago, darksabre said:

FWIW Don Granato's interview on WGR this morning is worth a listen. Definitely a different tone from him than Krueger. Talks about players being confused and anxious, which I thought was an interesting choice of words.

Granato is refreshingly honest with the media compared to the past few coaches. 

He's attempting to address the things we as fans have agreed are plaguing this team... pace, thinking too much and puck management.

Housley had a similar approach, but for whatever reason he failed at getting the players to consistently buy in.

Can Granato get through to this group?  All he can do is try his best, time will be the final judge.

[PASabreFan]

11 minutes ago, darksabre said:

The curse of intertextuality on the coaching progression. Our opinion of one coach is inherently tied to our opinion of the coach that came before and the coach that will inevitably come after. 

See also Eisenhower-Kennedy/Johnson-Nixon/Ford-Carter-Reagan/Bush-Clinton-Bush-Obama-Trump-Biden.

[LGR4GM]

1 minute ago, pi2000 said:

Granato is refreshingly honest with the media compared to the past few coaches. 

He's attempting to address the things we as fans have agreed are plaguing this team... pace, thinking too much and puck management.

Housley had a similar approach, but for whatever reason he failed at getting the players to consistently buy in.

Can Granato get through to this group?  All he can do is try his best, time will be the final judge.

No, this group is fundamentally flawed. Even if he "gets through" they are still bad at too many areas and lack enough talent to overcome their weaknesses. 

[Randall Flagg]

12 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Different voice is always interesting.

Did we really ever like the pressers from Housley and Bylsma?

We did. A few snippets from when we hired Dan: 
"It was awesome actually. Hearing slap down some analytics while propping up others. Getting a swipe in that a shot from a guy like Rivet or him doesn't have the same value as a shot from Crosby. Highly recommend everyone listen to it. It's informative and rather comical also and was a great listen."
"This was a great interview--on both sides.  Coller did a nice job and DDB answered questions with a lot of insight."
"I admit guilt to think DD was an empty suit but his interview was compelling. Certainly way more cerebral than most here gave him credit for. I think I like DD."
"Enjoyed the presser. Something about his countenance appeals to me; like he's ready to tell a joke or that he knows something but he's just not gonna let you in on it just yet. Anyway, nice first impression."

I can't find others right now, but people were thrilled about his discussion of "playing with pace," I remember reading that multiple times. "High tempo" and the like. "Finally!!!"

Then with Phil, here's a sample:
"Love that he stated that people will love his brand of hockey...that's all I needed to hear"
"5 man ATTACK!!!!!!"
"Our defense will be very involved in the play" - Housley -> "Thank the baby jesus"
"Attacking as a 5 man unit, love it"
"Give the people what they want :thumbsup:"
"This might be the stupid Buffalo optimism speaking, but listening to Phil makes me think Bogo is gonna play like a top-4 dman. Mark me down as OUT of the bunker."
"Housely!

Yes!"
"Give them responsibility........jack will love Phil!

Loved that line"
"We'll see in the next couple of seasons if it pans out, but I'm stoked!

I like it so far."

I remember actually writing a post to the effect of "remember guys, we loved what Dan said about his hockey system/style right away, this means nothing til we see it" haha

Though I will say that some people thought Dan was dry. 
 

[pi2000]

8 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

No, this group is fundamentally flawed. Even if he "gets through" they are still bad at too many areas and lack enough talent to overcome their weaknesses. 

I disagree 🙂

Their biggest weakness is scoring 5-on-5.   IMO there's enough talent that they should be better than what they've shown the past 6 weeks.  

[LGR4GM]

2 minutes ago, pi2000 said:

I disagree 🙂

Their biggest weakness is scoring 5-on-5.   IMO there's enough talent that they should be better than what they've shown the past 6 weeks.  

 

[Kruppstahl]

Looks like at least some type of minor changes are coming to the scouting department this week.

 

22. It sounds like the Sabres are making some scouting changes. At the very least a shuffling, and then we see about external additions. Could be news on the assistant-GM front (Jason Karmanos very much a contender) this week.

 

[Gatorman0519]

Gallant is on the same level as Q and look what he has done in Florida. Get the man in here and he can help evaluate who stays and who goes. This is not the time to take your time.  Nobody better available or will be available. 

[Marvin]

5 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

 

I think both points have validity.

1. There are players he can get through to.  The ones whom we shouldn't have long term plans for (Staal, Hall, etc.), we should be happy about because we can get more in a trade.  The rest should be kept for positive continuity and an example for those who are left.

2. There are players whom he can't get through to.  We should move as many of them as possible as soon as possible to teams which can deal with them while we get back more self-motivated players, even if they are not as talented.

As a point of reading the plots, we are on the bottom left of the two graphs.  We are the worst in our division by a wide margin.

[IKnowPhysics]

Hooray.

 

 

The upside is that if our most skilled players were that easily affected by a coaching change, maybe they can get back to form under a new coach.

[Doohickie]

9 hours ago, Weave said:

Have any of the most recent coaches not impressed us with their first few press conferences?   It seems like we could cut and past comments re: Bylsma’s, Housley, Krueger’s, first few pressers and they’d fit in this thread.

Call me cynical, but why do we keep doing this?

All coaches are not the same.  Some day our coachmate will sweep us off our feet and all the pain we've suffered in the past will be worth it.

9 hours ago, pi2000 said:

Granato is refreshingly honest with the media compared to the past few coaches. 

He's attempting to address the things we as fans have agreed are plaguing this team... pace, thinking too much and puck management.

Housley had a similar approach, but for whatever reason he failed at getting the players to consistently buy in.

Can Granato get through to this group?  All he can do is try his best, time will be the final judge.

That seems like an uncharacteristically mellow post from you, pi.  Are you feeling okay?

[Doohickie]

I couldn't watch it last night, I just couldn't.   But I'm watching the postgame from the Philly OT loss.  Everything Granato says seems like it makes sense.  "What do you say to the team after a collapse like that?  How do you bring them back?"  Granato:  "Let them feel what they feel tonight.  Maybe they have to feel that.  Tomorrow we do what we can to fix the things we can control."

RFK never seemed to acknowledge anything was wrong.  Like he had everything under control, but he didn't.

Also, without saying so, Granato strongly implied that he feels RFK ***** up this team.  But he said rather than looking back, we need to look forward.  He acknowledges the problems but doesn't wallow in them.

I don't think he's a serious contender for the HC job but I'm glad he's leading this team right now.

[Doohickie]

So tonight the Sabres gave Granato his first come from behind victory.

Compared to the cerebral Krueger, Granato seems like such a breath of fresh air.  He seems to not worry about getting his players to conform to a system, he just wants them to succeed.

The team looks so much better this last few games, and remember this is without Eichel, but also with injuries to Cozens and Lazar, with the loss of Staal.  He's basically lost his entire center spine and put lines together with spare parts.  our top two centers are Mitts and Reino, neither of which has played center at the NHL level to any great extent.   With Granato none of that matters, just move the puck up ice it it all works out.

Granato keeps proving over and over what a really, really bad coach Krueger was.

[PerreaultForever]

1 hour ago, Doohickie said:

Granato keeps proving over and over what a really, really bad coach Krueger was.

and how bad Steve Smith was.  

I'm not sure why he was the one tossed with Kreuger (I guess they were seeing eye to eye those two) but I've wanted him gone for ages. Since Housley left the D has gotten worse and worse and Girardi seems to have made a difference. In the very least they seem to be playing better positionally which is huge.

The one thing I don't get though is all year I (along with many others here) have been saying they need to be better in front of the net and go to the blue paint and they finally are. The thing is though, I remember Kreuger saying that very same thing. So why are some of them doing it now when they wouldn't do it for him? Despite some of the we like him rhetoric, did they quit on him? It would seem so. 

[triumph_communes]

I’m seeing passes from the defense, especially like Dahlin, that were never attempted before.  ‘Outside the system’. Seeing jump in from the defense too. Steve Smith was a huge problem. 
 

Forwards aren’t giving up the zone immediately and they’re picking pockets. Also getting some more attempts to skate into the slot for once. This transition is slow but refreshing.  The system was so bad before. 

[JoeSchmoe]

Hockey is too dynamic of a game for rigid systems to be successful.

Yes, certain situations are "static" enough to run some set plays and systems.

However, once the game opens up, the players should be free to react in the best way they see fit for the situation. At most, a coach could employ some general principles to follow in these situations.

[inkman]

On 3/19/2021 at 8:02 PM, Ducky said:

Tell whichever GM that wants Hall that you will retain 50% for a 4th rounder but they take KO at full value.

I want Kyle on this team.  Feels good saying it. 

[dudacek]

Just now, inkman said:

I want Kyle on this team.  Feels good saying it. 

So glad to see him looking like himself again. I'm a big fan, but the first two months of this year he looked done.

Maybe those injuries were more troubling than we knew?

Also, when was the last time he was used in a top-six role like he is right now?

[Kong]

31 minutes ago, inkman said:

I want Kyle on this team.  Feels good saying it. 

 

29 minutes ago, dudacek said:

So glad to see him looking like himself again. I'm a big fan, but the first two months of this year he looked done.

Maybe those injuries were more troubling than we knew?

Also, when was the last time he was used in a top-six role like he is right now?

 He's playing well lately but I'd like to see the team trade Kyle while he's at a five year high point. Too many miles on the old tank.

Edited April 4, 2021 by Kong

[Doohickie]

8 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

I'm not sure why he was the one tossed with Kreuger ...Girardi seems to have made a difference. In the very least they seem to be playing better positionally which is huge.

The one thing I don't get though is all year I (along with many others here) have been saying they need to be better in front of the net and go to the blue paint and they finally are. The thing is though, I remember Kreuger saying that very same thing. So why are some of them doing it now when they wouldn't do it for him? Despite some of the we like him rhetoric, did they quit on him? It would seem so. 

As I recall it was mentioned that Smith had previously worked with Kreuger somewhere, and the feeling at the time was that while Smith was already seen by the fan base as "part of the problem" those concerned were reset to zero when "hockey savant" Krueger came on board, the feeling being that Smith as the tactical Xs and Os guy would be in sync RFK's strategic vision.  Unfortunately, that proved exactly right, and vision was awful.

So right from the start, Krueger and Smith were associated with each other.  Ellis was associated with Adams and not Krueger as a long-time employee of the Sabres organization, first as a player and then at the Academy of Hockey, before becoming a development coach.  Girardi hired at the same time as Krueger.  Girardi was also a development coach so I suspect KA, as former director of Academy of Hockey and then VP of Business Ops had some input into Girardi's hire as part of the organization coaching staff, as opposed the NHL bench staff which was Krueger's turf.

That leaves Granato.  I'm not aware of any previous association between Granato and Krueger, Adams or the Sabres organization.  From that standpoint he may be one of the true independents on the staff without previous ties to Krueger or Adams.  It's possible, though, that as an independent, Adams was using Granato as a source of information in terms of how the team was doing:  An non-biased set of eyes.

So it makes sense that out of Krueger's staff, Granato was retained.

I just checked and Mike Bales is still and assistant coach.  He was apparently hired through connections with JBot.  I can't remember hearing anything about him since Krueger's firing and Granato apparently doesn't want him behind the bench, instead choosing two development coaches (which is how they are listed on the Sabres official site, nothing about interim assistants).  But apparently he was not seen as part of Krueger's inner circle like Smith was.

8 hours ago, triumph_communes said:

This transition is slow but refreshing.

I see it as a pretty rapid rollout, especially in mid-season and with Granato going into Covid protocol for a coupla days.

[Doohickie]

49 minutes ago, JoeSchmoe said:

However, once the game opens up, the players should be free to react in the best way they see fit for the situation.

The first goal yesterday is a good case in point.  To a man, every player has been talking about playing as a five man unit, and moving up and down the ice as such.  The implication I take from that is that they are all close enough to each other to provide puck support.  But somehow Hall signaled Dahlin for a long breakout pass and Mitts read off of that and took off down the right wing side.  That sounds like quite the opposite of "moving down the ice together" but boy did it work.  This may be a good example of "players free to react."

[Doohickie]

46 minutes ago, inkman said:

I want Kyle on this team.  Feels good saying it. 

He's still overpaid but he's contributing.  He's even getting .....faster?..... again.  The skill is eroded by age and what he's gone through, but the hockey smarts are still there and he seems he's figuring out the best use for the toolset still available to him.

44 minutes ago, dudacek said:

when was the last time he was used in a top-six role like he is right now?

When was the last time you saw Okposo win a footrace against a young Dman?

Edited April 4, 2021 by Doohickie

[inkman]

22 minutes ago, Kong said:

 

 He's playing well lately but I'd like to see the team trade Kyle while he's at a five year high point. Too many miles on the old tank.

That would be ideal but I don’t see it happening unless TO wants to reunite him with Tavares. 

[dudacek]

16 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

I just checked and Mike Bales is still and assistant coach.  He was apparently hired through connections with JBot.  I can't remember hearing anything about him since Krueger's firing and Granato apparently doesn't want him behind the bench, instead choosing two development coaches (which is how they are listed on the Sabres official site, nothing about interim assistants).  But apparently he was not seen as part of Krueger's inner circle like Smith was.

Bales was behind the bench last night.

Typically under Krueger he was the eyes-in-the-sky.