Curt Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 2 minutes ago, JohnC said: If the fourth line in its new composition adds more scoring then it will be more of a contributing line. The Larry line was mostly defensively oriented with little offensive contribution. I expect the reconstituted fourth line to be still more of a defensive line but more able to make an offensive contribution. For a team that doesn't have enough scoring coming from its lower lines I will accept the tradeoff. Angry Larry got a $1.4 X 2 deal from Arizona. That was his market value. With the Sabres he fulfilled his role. But he was far from being an indispensable player. Lazar is not the defensive stalwart that Larsson is but the tradeoff is he has more offensive capability and is a faster skater. With a cheaper price I will accept that tradeoff. I just think that you are overanalyzing his departure. For me the plusses and the minuses balance out. You keep saying that Lazar is definitely a better offensive player than Larson. I’m not even sure that is true. What makes you think so? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottysabres Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 2 minutes ago, Thorny said: I have to admit, the arguments *against* Larsson are tough to counterpoint. Let's call it a Push. After all these seasons of pain, losing any of these players outside of maybe 4 of them should be cause for celebration in my view. I'm not the least bit concerned over any of them leaving Buffalo, and that includes Jack, to he honest. After watching near 50 years of no cup, that is my only interest at this time. I could care less what players get it here. The clock is ticking, and I taint gettin' any younger.......so, Kevin Adams, step up to the plate, Batter Up! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 2 minutes ago, Scottysabres said: After all these seasons of pain, losing any of these players outside of maybe 4 of them should be cause for celebration in my view. I'm not the least bit concerned over any of them leaving Buffalo, and that includes Jack, to he honest. After watching near 50 years of no cup, that is my only interest at this time. I could care less what players get it here. The clock is ticking, and I taint gettin' any younger.......so, Kevin Adams, step up to the plate, Batter Up! Through the prism of this argument, your overall take makes sense. Thanks. That's not snark. 7 minutes ago, Curt said: You keep saying that Lazar is definitely a better offensive player than Larson. I’m not even sure that is true. What makes you think so? Lazar scoring at an inferior rate in easier usage, I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 Just now, Curt said: You keep saying that Lazar is definitely a better offensive player than Larson. I’m not even sure that is true. What makes you think so? I'm not suggesting that Lazar is a scoring dynamo. But because he is a better skater than Larsson he will have more scoring opportunities. Again, I appreciated the effort Larry brought to the team but I'm not distressed by his departure. His market value for the team that signed him wasat bargain bin level. He was replaced by a player who can play his role more than adequately and do it for almost half the price. From an analytical standpoint it was a good deal. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LTS Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 3 hours ago, aristocrat said: How did Barrie only get 4 mil? Reports were that he took less money and the 1 year deal to go to Edmonton. Guess he's hoping that next year he can earn an even better deal. 1 hour ago, Taro T said: He wanted out THAT badly? Dayum. As it was reported, the Sabres didn't want him back. I'm kind of shocked. I liked Larsson but he certainly wasn't someone that had to be kept at all costs. It makes the retaining of Girgensons interesting, but I suppose Girgensons has shown he can move up and down the lineup when needed and Larsson really hasn't. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 1 minute ago, JohnC said: I'm not suggesting that Lazar is a scoring dynamo. But because he is a better skater than Larsson he will have more scoring opportunities. Again, I appreciated the effort Larry brought to the team but I'm not distressed by his departure. His market value for the team that signed him wasat bargain bin level. He was replaced by a player who can play his role more than adequately and do it for almost half the price. From an analytical standpoint it was a good deal. But why do you think Lazar is a better offensive player. I don’t even think he is. Larson excels at puck possession/cycling in the offensive zone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brawndo Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trettioåtta Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 Just now, Brawndo said: Thorny will be in pieces Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 2 minutes ago, JohnC said: I'm not suggesting that Lazar is a scoring dynamo. But because he is a better skater than Larsson he will have more scoring opportunities. Again, I appreciated the effort Larry brought to the team but I'm not distressed by his departure. His market value for the team that signed him wasat bargain bin level. He was replaced by a player who can play his role more than adequately and do it for almost half the price. From an analytical standpoint it was a good deal. Why, because you say so? He's demonstrably weaker defensively and even offensively. He's a better skater so at 25 that's all about to change? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FAM4christ$ Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 I know it’s early in free agency but not signing or any actual NHL caliber players so far is pretty sad. The Sabres look worse than last year on paper so far because they let Kahun walk for nothing and have lost Larson. Eichel is probably losing it right now. I see no actual commitment to improve. I don’t know why they would spend $2.2 million a year to overpay for Girgenson and let Kahun and Larson walk for nothing. Brutal!!!! They have also not provided any explanation. They are wasting their time trying to pursue Hall. In the meantime, they are missing out on signing players they may have a chance to sign. Now I see no goalie upgrades without a trade in which we lose more assets. What assets do we have to lose that doesn’t hurt this club? I see no plan here and I think trades hurt this club. We can’t afford to lose more draft picks next year. We already have traded two of next years draft picks. This is crazy!!! I hope I am wrong for venting, but I am sick of losing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 2 minutes ago, Curt said: But why do you think Lazar is a better offensive player. I don’t even think he is. Larson excels at puck possession/cycling in the offensive zone. I think Lazar is a better offensive player. That is not to say that is his role. Larson did excel at puck possession but that didn't translate into conversions. I'm happy that Larsson found another place to play and hopefully refresh his game. But I'm not bothered very much by his departure. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brawndo Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derrico Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 4 minutes ago, Brawndo said: Lolz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASabresIUFAN Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 Can we fire KA yet? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trettioåtta Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 How long until people stop defending KA’s ridiculous moves? I hope people look at this as Dahlins team this year. Otherwise they might be in for an angry trade deadlinr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 9 minutes ago, Brawndo said: Oh that one hurt. Has to be a case of rather playing for Carolina than Buffalo. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 4 minutes ago, dudacek said: Oh that one hurt. Has to be a case of rather playing for Carolina than Buffalo. Very likely. The hilarity of Eakins advanced metrics gives me pause, but I still think it's that^ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brawndo Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 7 minutes ago, Thorny said: Very likely. The hilarity of Eakins advanced metrics gives me pause, but I still think it's that^ We probably can dismiss the notion that the Sabres Front Office is using analytics. At least correctly 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Brawndo said: We probably can dismiss the notion that the Sabres Front Office is using analytics. At least correctly Yup. It can change, Adams can be right, and the numbers we are using could be all wrong, or inadequately predictive. But by the methods available to us that we usually use to judge how we feel about the moves, he's done quite poor by analytical standards. Only the results can save him. Edited October 10, 2020 by Thorny 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 1 hour ago, JohnC said: If the fourth line in its new composition adds more scoring then it will be more of a contributing line. The Larry line was mostly defensively oriented with little offensive contribution. I expect the reconstituted fourth line to be still more of a defensive line but more able to make an offensive contribution. For a team that doesn't have enough scoring coming from its lower lines I will accept the tradeoff. Angry Larry got a $1.4 X 2 deal from Arizona. That was his market value. With the Sabres he fulfilled his role. But he was far from being an indispensable player. Lazar is not the defensive stalwart that Larsson is but the tradeoff is he has more offensive capability and is a faster skater. With a cheaper price I will accept that tradeoff. I just think that you are overanalyzing his departure. For me the plusses and the minuses balance out. That totally neglects the fact that the non-scoring 4th line oftentimes was matched against the other team's top line and would typically battle them to a draw. The 4th line, if centered by Lazar will not be able to do that IMHO. So, they may score a bit more, but if the other team now scores even more, that is a net loss. Having to play the Staal line out of necessity against tougher competition than the Johansson line faced will not be a victory either, again IMHO. Plus, if the Mittelstadt line (ducks LOL) has to play real minutes, that's another one chalked up in the L column. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 54 minutes ago, LTS said: Reports were that he took less money and the 1 year deal to go to Edmonton. Guess he's hoping that next year he can earn an even better deal. As it was reported, the Sabres didn't want him back. I'm kind of shocked. I liked Larsson but he certainly wasn't someone that had to be kept at all costs. It makes the retaining of Girgensons interesting, but I suppose Girgensons has shown he can move up and down the lineup when needed and Larsson really hasn't. Have we heard that from anyone other than Larsson's brother? It could very well be a case of Larsson saying he wanted at least $3×3 to come back & the Sabres saying at those #'s he doesn't fit in the plans, good luck elsewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 2 minutes ago, Taro T said: That totally neglects the fact that the non-scoring 4th line oftentimes was matched against the other team's top line and would typically battle them to a draw. The 4th line, if centered by Lazar will not be able to do that IMHO. So, they may score a bit more, but if the other team now scores even more, that is a net loss. Having to play the Staal line out of necessity against tougher competition than the Johansson line faced will not be a victory either, again IMHO. Plus, if the Mittelstadt line (ducks LOL) has to play real minutes, that's another one chalked up in the L column. Mittelstadt line/Eakin line..what's the difference 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 Grab the bull by the horns. It's a metaphor. But we should actually do it ^ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted October 10, 2020 Report Share Posted October 10, 2020 1 minute ago, Thorny said: Mittelstadt line/Eakin line..what's the difference Hadn't seen the Eakin deal, but yeah, basically. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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