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LGR4GM

Casey Mittelstadt, what should we make of him

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So this podcast had a line Mitts and I gotta say it isn't Mitts talent I doubt, it is his drive and compete. Hedman was already a good defender but he pushes himself further to be one of the very best. I get the impression Casey pushes himself to the bare minimum. I could be wrong but without that internal motivation, he isn't going to make it and I doubt he has it. If he doesn't we need to cut our losses and package him away before others get wise to the issue. 

Edited by LGR4GM
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sorry had a slight error, fixed it now. Would help if I wasn't reading multiple tweets at once. 

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5 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

I doubt his talent as much or more than his commitment.

I would make of him an epic summer blockbuster trade 

I think he has little trade value

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When you can't do a pull-up at a pull-up contest, when you've known about the pull-up contest for 3 years, you're a lazy, unprepared, unprofessional loser.

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I think it’s less motivation and more maturity.

Casey is a rink rat who loves hockey and beating guys in hockey. Casey is more of a kid than a lot of his peers and has never really had to work in order to beat people.

This break is a big crossroads for him. Is he golfing with his buddies and playing Fortnite until 2 am? Or is he running, lifting and watching tape?

Time to leave childhood behind and become a pro.

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Casey definitely comes off as a 15-16 year old, for sure. Immature is the perfect word to describe him..

You need to tackle that in development before we even talk about the on-ice stuff. He's proven he can look real good in a 2 week youth tournament with the world watching. Can he consistently do it in an 82 season against men, is the question.

 

Then on the analytical side, he's never tracked as the prospect that he got hyped as by Pronman and others after that tournament, so expectations should also be adjusted. Tyson Jost is probably what we're looking at long term, with development. So yeah, if there's still a team out there who thinks higher of him, you need to be investigating a trade scenario...(please be Calgary)

 

Edited by Gabrielor

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10 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I think it’s less motivation and more maturity.

Casey is a rink rat who loves hockey and beating guys in hockey. Casey is more of a kid than a lot of his peers and has never really had to work in order to beat people.

This break is a big crossroads for him. Is he golfing with his buddies and playing Fortnite until 2 am? Or is he running, lifting and watching tape?

Time to leave childhood behind and become a pro.

The biggest problem with people that never get it is that they think they are working as hard as they can. I generally hate comparisons between sports and everyday business but we’ve all seen them. The people that think they are doing everything they can but end up falling short and end up blaming everyone but themselves.

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We should make him into a Newt

 

 

 

VtefW.gif

1 hour ago, Randall Flagg said:

I doubt his talent as much or more than his commitment.

I would make of him an epic summer blockbuster trade 

 

1 hour ago, freester said:

I think he has little trade value

By epic blockbuster you mean scuttled off for a 4th round pick, then I agree. 

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12 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I think it’s less motivation and more maturity.

Casey is a rink rat who loves hockey and beating guys in hockey. Casey is more of a kid than a lot of his peers and has never really had to work in order to beat people.

This break is a big crossroads for him. Is he golfing with his buddies and playing Fortnite until 2 am? Or is he running, lifting and watching tape?

Time to leave childhood behind and become a pro.

Good observations! My ignorant impression is that he's more Fortnite than weight training but thats based on nothing & I hope I'm wrong. Casey HAS to see the writing on the wall & see that he's on the outside in when it comes to becoming an NHL starter. If I were GM i'd personally trade him if value could be found. Not to say I think he's a bust, but some players don't fully develop til their mid 20's & I just don't think we can wait that long with him.

I wish Casey would put a video on his twitter of him doing 10 pullups... that would give me some hope that he's added some strength & that he's grown into a man & that he wants to silence all the naysayers & doubters out there, one pullup at a time. ?

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1 hour ago, ubkev said:

When you can't do a pull-up at a pull-up contest, when you've known about the pull-up contest for 3 years, you're a lazy, unprepared, unprofessional loser.

By comparison he would have a ceiling of...Sam Bennett?

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42 minutes ago, MakeSabresGrr8Again said:

By comparison he would have a ceiling of...Sam Bennett?

I almost died laughing when it was suggested that they be traded for each other. Talk about a big bag of who gives a *****! The only thing impressive about Bennett is his facial hair makes him look like he might be able to actually do a pull-up now.

Edited by ubkev
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2 hours ago, ubkev said:

When you can't do a pull-up at a pull-up contest, when you've known about the pull-up contest for 3 years, you're a lazy, unprepared, unprofessional loser.

A few people got on my back when I didn't want the Sabres to draft Bennett solely because of the pull-up thing, but this really is the reason.  There's no excuse for an athlete being so completely unprepared.

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Just now, Eleven said:

A few people got on my back when I didn't want the Sabres to draft Bennett solely because of the pull-up thing, but this really is the reason.  There's no excuse for an athlete being so completely unprepared.

That's all there is to it. You know every exercise that you will have to do ahead of time. How do you ***** that up?

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30 minutes ago, ubkev said:

That's all there is to it. You know every exercise that you will have to do ahead of time. How do you ***** that up?

Not to mention... I'm in absolutely terrible shape at the moment and i can do a pull-up.  They aren't hard. 

 

It's like when a player does poorly on the bench at the NFL combine.  Doing well isn't indicative of a good player, but doing really poorly is indicative of a lazy player.  

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9 minutes ago, Drag0nDan said:

Not to mention... I'm in absolutely terrible shape at the moment and i can do a pull-up.  They aren't hard. 

 

It's like when a player does poorly on the bench at the NFL combine.  Doing well isn't indicative of a good player, but doing really poorly is indicative of a lazy player.  

The NFL combine bench is 225 for every player though. Some guys that's 120% their body weight. The NHL combine is 70-80% body weight (when Casey was there) he only had to bench 160 pounds and he only did 1. That just screams to me that he doesn't care.

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Just now, ubkev said:

The NFL combine bench is 225 for every player though. Some guys that's 120% their body weight. The NHL combine is 70-80% body weight (when Casey was there) he only had to bench 160 pounds and he only did 1. That just screams to me that he doesn't care.

Yeah - big red flag.  I haven't benched in over a year and I can do that easy.  Does this guy even lift bro?

I'll admit I'm newer to looking at hockey analytics in general, and i think drafting players is even more difficult to evaluate based on massively different levels of competition- but what was it about Mittelstadt that they liked so much more than a Thomas, Vilardi, Suzuki from the same class?  

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11 minutes ago, Let's Go B-Lo said:

 

Gotta admit, this was on my mind, too.

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3 minutes ago, Drag0nDan said:

Yeah - big red flag.  I haven't benched in over a year and I can do that easy.  Does this guy even lift bro?

I'll admit I'm newer to looking at hockey analytics in general, and i think drafting players is even more difficult to evaluate based on massively different levels of competition- but what was it about Mittelstadt that they liked so much more than a Thomas, Vilardi, Suzuki from the same class?  

'Murican, playing at a 'Murican college not a Canadian playing in the CHL

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Casey Mittelstadt's performance at the combine showed that he wasn't prepared. The lack of physical preparation demonstrably showed that he didn't have the work ethic and maturity required to show that he was close to being ready for the quantum leap to the pros. But that embarrassing performance was a few years ago. He is a prospect who was manifestly mishandled. He was rushed when he shouldn't have been rushed. 

Will he ever be a functional NHL player with us or any other team? I can't answer that question. If he comes into this camp at a high physical level which indicates that he is committed to his profession then there is a chance that whatever potential he has can be realized. 

I'm not making a declaration as to his success on him right now because it is impossible to know. We should soon be able to make a more decisive decision about when he comes to training camp (assuming he hasn't been dealt). Needless to say I'm not counting on him but I'm also not giving up on him just yet. It might be prudent to wait a little longer on passing a judgment before throwing him onto the garbage heap of  bad hockey decisions. 

Edited by JohnC
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26 minutes ago, Let's Go B-Lo said:

'Murican, playing at a 'Murican college not a Canadian playing in the CHL

Since when is that like a smart strategy?

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2 hours ago, dudacek said:

I think it’s less motivation and more maturity.

Casey is a rink rat who loves hockey and beating guys in hockey. Casey is more of a kid than a lot of his peers and has never really had to work in order to beat people.

This break is a big crossroads for him. Is he golfing with his buddies and playing Fortnite until 2 am? Or is he running, lifting and watching tape?

Time to leave childhood behind and become a pro.

Well, this, and the fact that he has never actually demonstrated having sustainable stand-out talent amongst peers in any league but high-school, not counting one-off tournaments. 

Once he develops the maturity, we can get an idea for if he actually has notable NHL talent. 

Edited by Thorny

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Just now, Thorny said:

Well, this, and the fact that he has never actually demonstrated having sustainable stand-out talent amongst peers in any league but high-school, not counting one-off tournaments. 

His development path should've gone through AHL for this reason alone.  1 year in college, fine.  But after that he should've been playing in the AHL for at least a year.  He's still learning how to be a hockey player at this point and he's somehow played over 100 games with the big club.  

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2 hours ago, Gabrielor said:

Casey definitely comes off as a 15-16 year old, for sure. Immature is the perfect word to describe him..

You need to tackle that in development before we even talk about the on-ice stuff. He's proven he can look real good in a 2 week youth tournament with the world watching. Can he consistently do it in an 82 season against men, is the question.

 

Then on the analytical side, he's never tracked as the prospect that he got hyped as by Pronman and others after that tournament, so expectations should also be adjusted. Tyson Jost is probably what we're looking at long term, with development. So yeah, if there's still a team out there who thinks higher of him, you need to be investigating a trade scenario...(please be Calgary)

 

This. The conversation is about, can Casey get past his drive/maturity issues to become a solid middle 6 winger, and not “can Casey still live up to his hype/become an impact player”. You can’t rule that out to a certainty, obviously, but it’s really very unlikely at this point. It’s not statistically supported. 

It’s a big reason I’m on the trade Casey bandwagon. There may still be a team out there that puts stock in the draft hype. 

Edited by Thorny

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