Wonder what the NHL thinks of the state of its franchise in Buffalo

[bunomatic]

1 hour ago, Doohickie said:

Think of Buffalo as a Canadian city on the wrong side of the border.  The NHL likes to keep their Canadian small market cities to keep the Canadian flavor of the league.  And economically, Buffalo is a part of that.  The more small market teams in the league, the more they can drive the economics of the league to make the small Canadian cities viable as NHL locations.

I don't think this is true at all.

Its almost daily out of Vancouver. I listen to it every day at work . Believe what you want.

[Doohickie]

Well that's Vancouver desperately trying to feel good about themselves.

[bunomatic]

10 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

Well that's Vancouver desperately trying to feel good about themselves.

The Canucks appear to be on track but I get what you are saying. The city complains about Toronto thinking its the centre of the universe  as they pound their chest and act like the centre of the universe.

[Brawndo]

https://app.radio.com/rQyP6a1MG3
 

The answer is here. 
 

Start at 9:25

[PASabreFan]

1 hour ago, Brawndo said:

https://app.radio.com/rQyP6a1MG3
 

The answer is here. 
 

Start at 9:25

Can you summarize it?

[Eleven]

1 hour ago, Brawndo said:

https://app.radio.com/rQyP6a1MG3
 

The answer is here. 
 

Start at 9:25

Brawndo--your link is to an app download page--if you're linking to the Duane call, it's in the Duane thread; if you're linking to something else, we can't see it.

[Brawndo]

Sorry gentlemen: 

Friedman was on the Instigators, he mentioned that league officials came up and spoke with him about the frustration surrounding the Sabres from a fan and organization Perspective. The TVs ratings are high for out of market games and yet its 9 years without playoffs. He also mentioned how whatever the organization has including done increasing scouting, signing FAs, replacing coaches and GMs hasn’t worked. 

He also mentioned that he got a note from the Sabres that they were upset about this post in 31 Thoughts.

If you would like to listen it’s on demand at WGR under the Instigators. If you listen to his separate segment it starts at 9:25 if you listen to the whole hour it’s 10:20 for the segment 

[bunomatic]

Pegula might as well buy the Buffalo media. He’s again trying to control them. And um well, Canadas media as well. This moron will never learn.

Edited January 31, 2020 by bunomatic

[Radar]

This team made huge mistake by dumping two players that I feel if we still had this whole picture would look completely different. I blame ownership for either allowing it to happen or directing it to happen. Try any way you want to rationalize these moves but they set us back years. It wasn't tanking or not tanking it was these moronic moves. It's done and can't be reversed. JBott and the Pegulas made this ad now it's probably something we live with for the foreseeable future. It's not an off-season fix.

 

 

 

 

[Randall Flagg]

51 minutes ago, Brawndo said:

Sorry gentlemen: 

Friedman was on the Instigators, he mentioned that league officials came up and spoke with him about the frustration surrounding the Sabres from a fan and organization Perspective. The TVs ratings are high for out of market games and yet its 9 years without playoffs. He also mentioned how whatever the organization has including done increasing scouting, signing FAs, replacing coaches and GMs hasn’t worked. 

He also mentioned that he got a note from the Sabres that they were upset about this post in 31 Thoughts.

If you would like to listen it’s on demand at WGR under the Instigators. If you listen to his separate segment it starts at 9:25 if you listen to the whole hour it’s 10:20 for the segment 

I don't really like the air of mystery that outside media guys, and our own media guys, and some fans, attribute to our lack of success. I heard a few fan calls into WGR the other day that were to the effect of "what are we missing? these guys are good, we've seen them play good, they should be good, but they're not. what is going on?" Peters/Rivet were like I feel ya, I know what y ou mean, I don't know. 

We hear that the Pegulas are baffled and have no idea why it hasn't been working. 

But anyone that seriously watches hockey looked at this roster in August and couldn't see any reason for it to be any better than the low 80 point range they're currently pacing for. They are smack dab in the middle of the point window I gave for them, and right around where many other fans had them pegged. There isn't some mystery aura plaguing the organization. They are the sum of their bad managerial decisions, and it's playing out EXACTLY as you'd expect. Not hope, but expect. There's no mystery whatsoever. Through three offseasons, Botterill has been a meh-to-bad GM, and as a result, his team has been a meh-to-bad team. The reason the streak extends further back than Jason is that Murray also had critical flaws, and then before that they spent 164 games trying to lose on purpose. Those years add up quickly. 

There's no mystery, Terry. I know you're sick of firing people, but that's no excuse to hang onto people that haven't shown the capability of putting together a coherent team with a chance to do anything. The path is pretty clear to me. You like Ralph, we like the organizational mindset that we feel he's capable of establishing. He can pick your next GM, and will do a better job than you did. If that GM is competent, I am quite confident that we will have immediate results, and if they're competent-to-good instead of meh-to-bad, we will be in the playoffs in short order. this mythical "we needed until the fourth year to sniff a wild card birth" stuff can be left in the dust bin forever, where it belongs. This was never reasonable given where we were coming from at the tail end of 16-17. Especially because our three years spent towards "setting up" sustained success doesn't have our prospect pool or set of young players looking anything more than typical, or average.

Edited January 31, 2020 by Randall Flagg

[dudacek]

31 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

I don't really like the air of mystery that outside media guys, and our own media guys, and some fans, attribute to our lack of success. I heard a few fan calls into WGR the other day that were to the effect of "what are we missing? these guys are good, we've seen them play good, they should be good, but they're not. what is going on?" Peters/Rivet were like I feel ya, I know what y ou mean, I don't know. 

We hear that the Pegulas are baffled and have no idea why it hasn't been working. 

But anyone that seriously watches hockey looked at this roster in August and couldn't see any reason for it to be any better than the low 80 point range they're currently pacing for. They are smack dab in the middle of the point window I gave for them, and right around where many other fans had them pegged. There isn't some mystery aura plaguing the organization. They are the sum of their bad managerial decisions, and it's playing out EXACTLY as you'd expect. Not hope, but expect. There's no mystery whatsoever. Through three offseasons, Botterill has been a meh-to-bad GM, and as a result, his team has been a meh-to-bad team. The reason the streak extends further back than Jason is that Murray also had critical flaws, and then before that they spent 164 games trying to lose on purpose. Those years add up quickly. 

There's no mystery, Terry. I know you're sick of firing people, but that's no excuse to hang onto people that haven't shown the capability of putting together a coherent team with a chance to do anything. The path is pretty clear to me. You like Ralph, we like the organizational mindset that we feel he's capable of establishing. He can pick your next GM, and will do a better job than you did. If that GM is competent, I am quite confident that we will have immediate results, and if they're competent-to-good instead of meh-to-bad, we will be in the playoffs in short order. this mythical "we needed until the fourth year to sniff a wild card birth" stuff can be left in the dust bin forever, where it belongs. This was never reasonable given where we were coming from at the tail end of 16-17. Especially because our three years spent towards "setting up" sustained success doesn't have our prospect pool or set of young players looking anything more than typical, or average.

I had a long involved post planned where I reviewed every move Botterill has made to illustrate why we are where we are today.

But the bolded is all that needs to be said. Thank you.

The rest I can get on board with.

I'll be back when there is something new to talk about.

[Cheektorado]

57 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

I don't really like the air of mystery that outside media guys, and our own media guys, and some fans, attribute to our lack of success. I heard a few fan calls into WGR the other day that were to the effect of "what are we missing? these guys are good, we've seen them play good, they should be good, but they're not. what is going on?" Peters/Rivet were like I feel ya, I know what y ou mean, I don't know. 

We hear that the Pegulas are baffled and have no idea why it hasn't been working. 

But anyone that seriously watches hockey looked at this roster in August and couldn't see any reason for it to be any better than the low 80 point range they're currently pacing for. They are smack dab in the middle of the point window I gave for them, and right around where many other fans had them pegged. There isn't some mystery aura plaguing the organization. They are the sum of their bad managerial decisions, and it's playing out EXACTLY as you'd expect. Not hope, but expect. There's no mystery whatsoever. Through three offseasons, Botterill has been a meh-to-bad GM, and as a result, his team has been a meh-to-bad team. The reason the streak extends further back than Jason is that Murray also had critical flaws, and then before that they spent 164 games trying to lose on purpose. Those years add up quickly. 

There's no mystery, Terry. I know you're sick of firing people, but that's no excuse to hang onto people that haven't shown the capability of putting together a coherent team with a chance to do anything. The path is pretty clear to me. You like Ralph, we like the organizational mindset that we feel he's capable of establishing. He can pick your next GM, and will do a better job than you did. If that GM is competent, I am quite confident that we will have immediate results, and if they're competent-to-good instead of meh-to-bad, we will be in the playoffs in short order. this mythical "we needed until the fourth year to sniff a wild card birth" stuff can be left in the dust bin forever, where it belongs. This was never reasonable given where we were coming from at the tail end of 16-17. Especially because our three years spent towards "setting up" sustained success doesn't have our prospect pool or set of young players looking anything more than typical, or average.

Lincoln kept firing Generals until he found one that could fight.

[PromoTheRobot]

On 1/29/2020 at 6:28 PM, Curt said:

I don’t think the NHL wants any team to completely suck for a decade straight.  It’s bad for business.  They want parity, with every fan base excited that their team has a shot at the playoffs every year, so they buy tickets, buy merchandise, buy streaming services.............

Why would the NHL be feeling warm and fuzzy that Buffalo hockey fans are at their wits end?

 

Buffalo is the league's primo TV ratings market. I have to believe they have some concern about the Sabres.

[Kruppstahl]

The Sabres have been on a hot streak of new lows going on nearly a decade now.

And yet last night was definitely another new one.

F-ing Habs fans singing the "Ole" song in Buffalo as Buffalo was about to go down to defeat in their own building.

That ***** made me sick to my stomach.

I'm old enough to have a genuine hatred for the Canadiens going back to playoff rivalries decades ago.  

That one really hurt! 

Does Pegula notice this stuff?  He's older than I am.  I hope it made him sick to his stomach as well.

 

 

 

[darksabre]

2 hours ago, Randall Flagg said:

I don't really like the air of mystery that outside media guys, and our own media guys, and some fans, attribute to our lack of success. I heard a few fan calls into WGR the other day that were to the effect of "what are we missing? these guys are good, we've seen them play good, they should be good, but they're not. what is going on?" Peters/Rivet were like I feel ya, I know what y ou mean, I don't know. 

We hear that the Pegulas are baffled and have no idea why it hasn't been working. 

But anyone that seriously watches hockey looked at this roster in August and couldn't see any reason for it to be any better than the low 80 point range they're currently pacing for. They are smack dab in the middle of the point window I gave for them, and right around where many other fans had them pegged. There isn't some mystery aura plaguing the organization. They are the sum of their bad managerial decisions, and it's playing out EXACTLY as you'd expect. Not hope, but expect. There's no mystery whatsoever. Through three offseasons, Botterill has been a meh-to-bad GM, and as a result, his team has been a meh-to-bad team. The reason the streak extends further back than Jason is that Murray also had critical flaws, and then before that they spent 164 games trying to lose on purpose. Those years add up quickly. 

There's no mystery, Terry. I know you're sick of firing people, but that's no excuse to hang onto people that haven't shown the capability of putting together a coherent team with a chance to do anything. The path is pretty clear to me. You like Ralph, we like the organizational mindset that we feel he's capable of establishing. He can pick your next GM, and will do a better job than you did. If that GM is competent, I am quite confident that we will have immediate results, and if they're competent-to-good instead of meh-to-bad, we will be in the playoffs in short order. this mythical "we needed until the fourth year to sniff a wild card birth" stuff can be left in the dust bin forever, where it belongs. This was never reasonable given where we were coming from at the tail end of 16-17. Especially because our three years spent towards "setting up" sustained success doesn't have our prospect pool or set of young players looking anything more than typical, or average.

You got it dude. We were sitting here in the summer going "he needs to do something in August" and then it was September, and October, and November and...

Nothing. 

The things that were broken are still broken. And then new things broke on top of that. 

 

[Cheektorado]

 

[nfreeman]

1 hour ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

Buffalo is the league's primo TV ratings market. I have to believe they have some concern about the Sabres.

This is an oft-repeated canard.  Buffalo gets a high percentage of hockey viewers but not a high absolute number of viewers, which is what matters.

[Kruppstahl]

50 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

This is an oft-repeated canard.  Buffalo gets a high percentage of hockey viewers but not a high absolute number of viewers, which is what matters.

When this sort of discussion comes up, I always remember back to when ESPN stopped televising NHL games.

They mentioned that PBA bowling received better ratings than a NHL hockey game.

That always blew my mind, but it shows you just what a small little niche thing the NHL is in the USA.

That was a while ago and the NHL has been trying to grow the game since then, and a bunch of US franchises didn't even exist when ESPN last televised a game, but still...

 

 

 

[PromoTheRobot]

1 hour ago, nfreeman said:

This is an oft-repeated canard.  Buffalo gets a high percentage of hockey viewers but not a high absolute number of viewers, which is what matters.

 

Small market but top ratings.

[nfreeman]

15 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

Small market but top ratings.

Yes, but this ignores the key point, which is what I said earlier:  the NHL doesn't care about a market of 100 people, even if 94 of them are watching hockey.  They care about a market in which 500,000 people are watching, even if there are 5MM people in that market.

[PromoTheRobot]

5 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

Yes, but this ignores the key point, which is what I said earlier:  the NHL doesn't care about a market of 100 people, even if 94 of them are watching hockey.  They care about a market in which 500,000 people are watching, even if there are 5MM people in that market.

I'm trying to find the actual ratings online to no avail. But Buffalo generally has a very large share 8-9%  The question is is 8-9% in Buffalo the same number of eyeballs as 0.8 or 0.9 in L.A. or NYC?

[Taro T]

1 hour ago, Kruppstahl said:

The Sabres have been on a hot streak of new lows going on nearly a decade now.

And yet last night was definitely another new one.

F-ing Habs fans singing the "Ole" song in Buffalo as Buffalo was about to go down to defeat in their own building.

That ***** made me sick to my stomach.

I'm old enough to have a genuine hatred for the Canadiens going back to playoff rivalries decades ago.  

That one really hurt! 

Does Pegula notice this stuff?  He's older than I am.  I hope it made him sick to his stomach as well.

 

 

 

That was not the 1st time they've sung it in that building.

And, yes, it is painfully annoying.

[MakeSabresGrr8Again]

1 hour ago, Kruppstahl said:

When this sort of discussion comes up, I always remember back to when ESPN stopped televising NHL games.

They mentioned that PBA bowling received better ratings than a NHL hockey game.

That always blew my mind, but it shows you just what a small little niche thing the NHL is in the USA.

That was a while ago and the NHL has been trying to grow the game since then, and a bunch of US franchises didn't even exist when ESPN last televised a game, but still...

 

 

 

I bowled in several leagues back in the day and among the leagues that had some guys who became PBA members (Tom Baker, John Masiello, Jim Schroeder, etc.

I would be curious to know how the ratings were in Buffalo for the PBA.

Ahhh, the days of "Bowling for Dollars".

[I-90 W]

So long as we continue to watch all the games etc, I doubt they care. We've never been the darling of the league, even with our #1 in the US TV ratings.

[Taro T]

1 hour ago, MakeSabresGrr8Again said:

I bowled in several leagues back in the day and among the leagues that had some guys who became PBA members (Tom Baker, John Masiello, Jim Schroeder, etc.

I would be curious to know how the ratings were in Buffalo for the PBA.

Ahhh, the days of "Bowling for Dollars".

No kidding, you bowled against Tom Baker?  That's pretty cool.

 

And your last comment reminds me of a joke from the Odd Couple.  For some reason, Felix and Oscar were in Buffalo (IIRC, Oscar was there covering a Bills Jest game and Felix had a photo shoot.) but Felix looks out their hotel window and says 'hey, it's really true; there IS a bowling alley on every corner.` ?