2020 Draft Rankings Not Soon Enough...

[dudacek]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

This is my top 7 and the Sabres are my team so a little of both but I don't like Drysdale as much as most. 

This is not a mock

This interests the heck out of me because Drysdale’s game sits at the mid-point of Dahlin and Jokiharju and you love both of those guys and you also love skaters and he is a thing of beauty in that area.

[LGR4GM]

14 hours ago, dudacek said:

This interests the heck out of me because Drysdale’s game sits at the mid-point of Dahlin and Jokiharju and you love both of those guys and you also love skaters and he is a thing of beauty in that area.

Sorry, I should have elaborated. 

It isn't that I don't like Drysdale, he is good. It is that I like other players more and honestly I think the forwards this year offer more than the defenders at the top. Skating is great but the rest of what he does just doesn't light the world on fire for me. 

[JohnC]

On 6/24/2020 at 6:36 PM, dudacek said:

Further to the 2017 draft, there are some great stories floating around out my way over the intense debate the Canucks has at pick 5 between Cody Glass and Elias Petterson. 

Scuttlebutt is that 2nd year chief scout Judd Brackett (sp?) wanted EP, but Benning really liked Glass. This came the year after Benning steered the staff into taking Juolevi. After some very intense debate, Benning let the scouts get their way and drafted EP.

Aside from illustrating how one decision can have such a big impact, this is also somewhat relevant to the Sabres.

Last year, Benning allegedly overruled the scouting department to take Hoglander and Brackett lost it, and was effectively pushed to the sideline. He still ran the department this year, but is not getting his contract renewed. He’s a free agent June 30 and is being talked about as a potential chief scout for the Sabres.

Its not clear if his concerns about autonomy would make him a better, or a worse fit in the Sabres flat management structure.

Prior to becoming chief scout, Brackett was the area scout credited with pushing the selections of Brock Boeser and Adam Gaudette.

Judd Brackett was just signed by Minnesota to take over their scouting department. When you are widely respected in your field of endeavor you don't last long on the market. 

https://www.thetelegram.com/sports/hockey/report-judd-brackett-hired-by-minnesota-wild-471550/

[Curt]

On 7/9/2020 at 9:30 AM, LGR4GM said:

1. Lafrienerre
2. Byfield
3. Stutzle
4. Rossi
5. Jarvis
6. Raymond
7. Perfetti

This is my new top 7. I want to like Raymond and Holtz but I just don't quite get there. I still they could be really good. One thing I noticed is that if I watch them versus peers I come away more favorable. That is clearly a bias on my part and something to keep in mind. Raymond at the U20 this past season was fun to watch. 

After watching more of a few guys over the past couple days, I can definitely get behind Jarvis being this high.  His combination of skating, puck control, and aggressive mentality really lets him attack defenses.  He doesn’t skate around the perimeter, he challenges the defense.  And he is a gamer.  He isnt taking plays off, cheating, or just floating around.  He plays with an intensity.

[Curt]

I wanted to ask LGR4GM, and anyone else, about Sam Colangelo.  It seems to me that he may be a good target to take in the 2nd round at #38.

He had good but not amazing numbers for a very good Chicago Steel team of the USHL.  If you dig into the numbers a bit, they look even more impressive though.

Overall, he had 28-30-58 in 44 games.   That’s good but not incredible for the USHL, it’s a weaker league than CHL.  However, 47 of those 58 came at ES and 49 of those 58 were Primary Points.  Also he wasn’t getting incredibly high ice time for his team, about 17:30.  That’s less than most top draft prospects in junior leagues.  They routinely get 20+.  I think that combined, these numbers point to someone who could be a little undervalued.

As a player, he is a big (6’2” 205+), physical right wing, with good skating agility and acceleration, but only average speed.  He is good at winning board battles and fighting through checks.  He is a good shooter who goes to the dirty areas to score.  Not a great playmaker but can control the puck and make good passes.  He forechecks aggressively and back checks well, with a good motor.  Basically a power forward RW who works hard in all 3 zones.  I suppose there could be questions about how well the offense will translate against bigger, stronger competition.  Anyone have insights on him?

(Side Note: Seth Jarvis also only got about 17:30 TOI, if he had been getting 22 like some top draft prospects, his numbers would probably be crazy high and he might be a consensus top-10 pick)

Edited July 12, 2020 by Curt

[JohnC]

On 7/9/2020 at 9:30 AM, LGR4GM said:

1. Lafrienerre
2. Byfield
3. Stutzle
4. Rossi
5. Jarvis
6. Raymond
7. Perfetti

This is my new top 7. I want to like Raymond and Holtz but I just don't quite get there. I still they could be really good. One thing I noticed is that if I watch them versus peers I come away more favorable. That is clearly a bias on my part and something to keep in mind. Raymond at the U20 this past season was fun to watch. 

I appreciate your draft evaluations. Your knowledge of this draft class is impressive. It's apparent that the forwards dominate the top half of this draft class. Acknowledging that fact where would Calgary's Sam Bennett rank in this class?

[dudacek]

1 hour ago, Curt said:

I wanted to ask LGR4GM, and anyone else, about Sam Colangelo.  It seems to me that he may be a good target to take in the 2nd round at #38.

He had good but not amazing numbers for a very good Chicago Steel team of the USHL.  If you dig into the numbers a bit, they look even more impressive though.

Overall, he had 28-30-58 in 44 games.   That’s good but not incredible for the USHL, it’s a weaker league than CHL.  However, 47 of those 58 came at ES and 49 of those 58 were Primary Points.  Also he wasn’t getting incredibly high ice time for his team, about 17:30.  That’s less than most top draft prospects in junior leagues.  They routinely get 20+.  I think that combined, these numbers point to someone who could be a little undervalued.

As a player, he is a big (6’2” 205+), physical right wing, with good skating agility and acceleration, but only average speed.  He is good at winning board battles and fighting through checks.  He is a good shooter who goes to the dirty areas to score.  Not a great playmaker but can control the puck and make good passes.  He forechecks aggressively and back checks well, with a good motor.  Basically a power forward RW who works hard in all 3 zones.  I suppose there could be questions about how well the offense will translate against bigger, stronger competition.  Anyone have insights on him?

(Side Note: Seth Jarvis also only got about 17:30 TOI, if he had been getting 22 like some top draft prospects, his numbers would probably be crazy high and he might be a consensus top-10 pick)

First I’ve ever heard of the player, but I sure like The scouting report.

[Rasmus_]

Give me Lundell or Raymond.  Both are useful pieces for our continual perpetual uphill battle for the playoffs.  Both have upside and have a two way nature to their game. 

[Rasmus_]

On 7/10/2020 at 6:10 AM, LGR4GM said:

Sorry, I should have elaborated. 

It isn't that I don't like Drysdale, he is good. It is that I like other players more and honestly I think the forwards this year offer more than the defenders at the top. Skating is great but the rest of what he does just doesn't light the world on fire for me. 

I like Drysdale as well, and normally if he's the best player available, I say take him.  Except, our system has more depth in upcoming defensemen than we do in forwards.  Aside, from Cozens, we're lacking completely.   If there was ever a time to take Lundell, Quinn, Holtz, Raymond, etcetera, it's here. 

[dudacek]

I will be very surprised if Drysdale is available at eight and not the best player available.

I would certainly take him over Lundell or Holtz, and probably Raymond as well.

[rakish]

I have Bennett 19th for the decade, that would put him 6th behind Perfetti and in front of Jarvis if you average their 16th and 17th year. If you look at just year 17, Bennett's at 15 for the decade, which would be 4th in 2020, though picking the right number for Stutzle is difficult as there haven't been many DEL picks, so Bennett could easily be 5th. Picking 8, I don't care what the right number for Stutzle is, since he'll be long gone.

I have Coloangelo 176 for the decade for 17 year old forwards. I find I get better success by averaging 16 and 17, it smooths out a lot of bumps. Coloangelo's 16th year didn't have that much output. Averaging the two years he's at 359 for the decade. Some people get better, so averaging doesn't always work well. I don't think he would be a bad pick at 38, but I'm looking at Roby Javartie

[Crusader1969]

My Sabres #1 target is Marco Rossi.

news yesterday indicated that he will be leaving the CHL for the Swiss league. He won't however, report to his new team until later in the season as he is looking to crack an NHL roster.

Rossi is an older prospect, turning 19 in September. He may already have the skating and strength required to play in NHL right away.   There are some who think that because of his early birthdate that he has already reached his potential. While younger guys, like Byfield have a lot more growth ahead of them.

Here is a detailed scouting report for the best OHL prospect guy out there  - Brock Otten

3. Marco Rossi - Center - Ottawa 67's
For me, the players ranked 3 through 5 here (Rossi, Perfetti, and Quinn) are all pretty interchangeable. I wouldn't be shocked at all to see them drafted in any combination of order, be it even Quinn first (he's got a way higher standing with NHL scouts than some internet scouts want to believe). This is a Marco Rossi write up though, so let's talk about him. IMO, Rossi is the best two-way forward in the entire OHL. When the puck isn't on his stick, he is just so hungry to get it back and he plays with such a high intensity level. He pushes hard to apply back pressure and uses a strong lower body and a quick stick to force turnovers. As an offensive player, Rossi is just so well rounded. His skating improved a lot this year, especially his top gear, and this made him a way more effective player in transition. He can push the pace, but has the puck skill, creativity, and poise to make calculated decisions even when pressured. His identification of passing lanes is at an elite level. Rossi can also beat you from below the goal line. He often requires two defenders to separate him from the puck in the cycle, despite being only 5'9, and that's because he has such a strong base and always keeps his feet moving. But Rossi also has eyes in the back of his head, showing such great awareness of when to spin off a check to find that streaking linemate. Rossi also has a great release and navigates the slot extremely well with the timing of a high end goal scorer. I will admit, last year I just wasn't as high on Rossi because I didn't feel like he had the creativity or skating ability to be a top 6 center. But man, did he prove me wrong this year by improving so much. The one concern that I do see is his size and whether he'll remain effective down the middle at the next level. He's as strong as an ox, but it's certainly not impossible that he will need to move to the wing to be a more successful and durable two-way presence. I think he can stick down the middle, but I have heard and understand the concerns.

My biggest question, is there a scenario where he is available at 8?

 

 

[LGR4GM]

7 hours ago, Crusader1969 said:

My Sabres #1 target is Marco Rossi.

news yesterday indicated that he will be leaving the CHL for the Swiss league. He won't however, report to his new team until later in the season as he is looking to crack an NHL roster.

Rossi is an older prospect, turning 19 in September. He may already have the skating and strength required to play in NHL right away.   There are some who think that because of his early birthdate that he has already reached his potential. While younger guys, like Byfield have a lot more growth ahead of them.

Here is a detailed scouting report for the best OHL prospect guy out there  - Brock Otten

3. Marco Rossi - Center - Ottawa 67's
For me, the players ranked 3 through 5 here (Rossi, Perfetti, and Quinn) are all pretty interchangeable. I wouldn't be shocked at all to see them drafted in any combination of order, be it even Quinn first (he's got a way higher standing with NHL scouts than some internet scouts want to believe). This is a Marco Rossi write up though, so let's talk about him. IMO, Rossi is the best two-way forward in the entire OHL. When the puck isn't on his stick, he is just so hungry to get it back and he plays with such a high intensity level. He pushes hard to apply back pressure and uses a strong lower body and a quick stick to force turnovers. As an offensive player, Rossi is just so well rounded. His skating improved a lot this year, especially his top gear, and this made him a way more effective player in transition. He can push the pace, but has the puck skill, creativity, and poise to make calculated decisions even when pressured. His identification of passing lanes is at an elite level. Rossi can also beat you from below the goal line. He often requires two defenders to separate him from the puck in the cycle, despite being only 5'9, and that's because he has such a strong base and always keeps his feet moving. But Rossi also has eyes in the back of his head, showing such great awareness of when to spin off a check to find that streaking linemate. Rossi also has a great release and navigates the slot extremely well with the timing of a high end goal scorer. I will admit, last year I just wasn't as high on Rossi because I didn't feel like he had the creativity or skating ability to be a top 6 center. But man, did he prove me wrong this year by improving so much. The one concern that I do see is his size and whether he'll remain effective down the middle at the next level. He's as strong as an ox, but it's certainly not impossible that he will need to move to the wing to be a more successful and durable two-way presence. I think he can stick down the middle, but I have heard and understand the concerns.

My biggest question, is there a scenario where he is available at 8?

 

 

I can envision several scenarios where he'll be available at 8. His size will work against him and I think Holtz, Raymond, and Lundell all have the chance of going b4 him. Maybe even toss Sanderson in there. 

[Crusader1969]

11 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

I can envision several scenarios where he'll be available at 8. His size will work against him and I think Holtz, Raymond, and Lundell all have the chance of going b4 him. Maybe even toss Sanderson in there. 

Yes, Drysdale, Sanderson and perhaps Ottawa taking Askorov with their 2nd pick.

How do you feel about Rossi?

[LGR4GM]

14 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

Yes, Drysdale, Sanderson and perhaps Ottawa taking Askorov with their 2nd pick.

How do you feel about Rossi?

I love Rossi. Non-stop motor and lots of skills coupled with a bit of an attitude. People talking about Quinn in the same sentence make me shake my head in confusion. 

I don't think Ottawa will take Askorov but I can see several scenarios where they take a center with their first pick and a winger or defender with their second. Sanderson makes a ton of sense for Ottawa because their LHD pool is weak and he is almost a lock to be a middle pairing defender. 

Edited July 17, 2020 by LGR4GM

[JohnC]

On 7/12/2020 at 1:30 PM, dudacek said:

I will be very surprised if Drysdale is available at eight and not the best player available.

I would certainly take him over Lundell or Holtz, and probably Raymond as well.

If the Sabres traded down in order to make a package deal what lower first round picks would appeal to you as interesting prospects? 

[LGR4GM]

1 minute ago, JohnC said:

If the Sabres traded down in order to make a package deal what lower first round picks would appeal to you as interesting prospects? 

Are you asking what pick I would trade down to or what prospects could be drafted outside the top 10 if we did trade down?

(for the record, trading out of the top 10 in a trade down scenario is extremely rare)

[JohnC]

1 minute ago, LGR4GM said:

Are you asking what pick I would trade down to or what prospects could be drafted outside the top 10 if we did trade down?

(for the record, trading out of the top 10 in a trade down scenario is extremely rare)

What prospects could be drafted outside of the top 10 if we traded down? Also, is this draft full enough with good prospects where we could get a quality prospect in the second round? 

[dudacek]

5 minutes ago, JohnC said:

If the Sabres traded down in order to make a package deal what lower first round picks would appeal to you as interesting prospects? 

I haven’t looked too closely at players ranked in the bottom half of the first round.

[dudacek]

1 minute ago, JohnC said:

What prospects could be drafted outside of the top 10 if we traded down? Also, is this draft full enough with good prospects where we could get a quality prospect in the second round? 

Seth Jarvis is a guy LGR has been touting At 8 that many services rank in the mid-teens.

He’s reminiscent of Newhook from last year in terms of an offensive centre that might go lower than he should.

[LGR4GM]

Just now, JohnC said:

What prospects could be drafted outside of the top 10 if we traded down? Also, is this draft full enough with good prospects where we could get a quality prospect in the second round? 

1) Outside of the top 10, I am looking at Seth Jarvis because Seth Jarvis. Mercer, Gunler, and Mysak would be players outside the top 15 you could trade down and get but I think that is a risky gamble. 

2) I think you would need to define "quality" for me. There are NHL players in this draft that will be 2nd round guys but unlike last year, I think once you get further back in this draft, the drop off happens sharp and quick. This would partially depend on who slides into the 2nd round which is something that the Sabres aren't good at capitalizing on. 

1 minute ago, dudacek said:

Seth Jarvis is a guy LGR has been touting At 8 that many services rank in the mid-teens.

He’s reminiscent of Newhook from last year in terms of an offensive centre that might go lower than he should.

Oh man, Alex Newhook... I miss him already. 42 points in 34 games as a freshman at Boston College. Can't wait to see what he does this year. 

[JohnC]

1 minute ago, LGR4GM said:

1) Outside of the top 10, I am looking at Seth Jarvis because Seth Jarvis. Mercer, Gunler, and Mysak would be players outside the top 15 you could trade down and get but I think that is a risky gamble. 

2) I think you would need to define "quality" for me. There are NHL players in this draft that will be 2nd round guys but unlike last year, I think once you get further back in this draft, the drop off happens sharp and quick. This would partially depend on who slides into the 2nd round which is something that the Sabres aren't good at capitalizing on. 

Thanks for the response. 

When I use the word "quality" I'm defining it as someone who after a few years can develop into a contributing lower line and pairing caliber of player.  

[LGR4GM]

1 minute ago, JohnC said:

Thanks for the response. 

When I use the word "quality" I'm defining it as someone who after a few years can develop into a contributing lower line and pairing caliber of player.  

I am just starting to look into the late first and 2nd round guys but yes, there are some if the Sabres are clever. 

[Thorny]

Though, Jarvis is a RW, and not a C. 

[LGR4GM]

22 minutes ago, Thorny said:

Though, Jarvis is a RW, and not a C. 

And? We need both.