Thorny Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 1 hour ago, dudacek said: So that sounds pretty much like there is a deal in principle if one of the parties doesn’t change its mind because of another deal they’re chasing. When was the last time the Sabres acquired a player the fans disliked as much as Vesey? I don't even dislike him, I just don't think he is very good. Botterill should do better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 5 hours ago, Derrico said: McDavid broke the mold and we're not going back unless the new CBA changes this. Matthews moreso. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 1 hour ago, dudacek said: I meant before they acquired him. Poor Jimmy if he hits Hgsn standards, or worse, Leino. Excuse me but I gave Cody Hodgson his O's back. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 22 minutes ago, Thorny said: I don't even dislike him, I just don't think he is very good. Botterill should do better. He’s one of a very small handful of players who Sabre fans boo when he touches the puck. I don’t have any strong feelings about him as a player. He’s an NHL winger who should at least increase our depth. Maybe he can help our middle six more than Sheary did, but probably not. We trade pick 31 for him I’ll be upset. if it’s pick 67, fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 1 minute ago, dudacek said: He’s one of a very small handful of players who Sabre fans boo when he touches the puck. I don’t have any strong feelings about him as a player. He’s an NHL winger who should at least increase our depth. Maybe he can help our middle six more than Sheary did, but probably not. We trade pick 31 for him I’ll be upset. if it’s pick 67, fine. I'm thinking along these same lines, but more about who's all brought in in a bigger picture sense. If Vesey is the best winger we bring in (a left winger, to boot), I'll be disappointed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IKnowPhysics Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 3 hours ago, Zamboni said: Change that 2nd rounder to this years 1st rounder #7 ... for Taylor Hall.... now it’s close. In the last three years (most current therefore most valid) he’s played 181 games and has 183 points. He’s a ppg producer. He’ll be 28 in November so I think he still has 4-5 solid years left in him before he starts to tail off. He can play C and LW. Losing Hall is gonna hurt the Devils big time. So getting Hall is gonna hurt big time. But Hall is currently only under contract for one year. No team will pay a #7 for a one-year rental. If the Devils even think there's a legit chance Hall won't sign, then they know the return for Hall only goes down as time goes on. It would be highest bidder, which we're equipped to win, for less than the #7. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 I have no freaking clue why we would want Jimmy Vesey. He plays a position we don't need. He isn't a significant upgrade over what we have. He 3 years ago indicated pretty directly he did not want to play here. This is mind boggling dumb to trade assets for a 3rd line LW who has a history of wanting to play in 1 place and 1 place only. This is how you get guys on your team with bad attitudes. If he was really good, fine. But he is a 3rd line player with mediocre possession metrics. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 16 minutes ago, LGR4GM said: I have no freaking clue why we would want Jimmy Vesey. He plays a position we don't need. He isn't a significant upgrade over what we have. He 3 years ago indicated pretty directly he did not want to play here. This is mind boggling dumb to trade assets for a 3rd line LW who has a history of wanting to play in 1 place and 1 place only. This is how you get guys on your team with bad attitudes. If he was really good, fine. But he is a 3rd line player with mediocre possession metrics. He's a depth scorer and we could use more depth scoring. If Botterill thinks he's an answer in the top-6, however.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 9 hours ago, jahnyc said: I really do not understand this interest in Vesey. I do not think he is a top six forward and we all know that he did not want to sign here after we traded for his rights. Makes no sense to me. 17 minutes ago, LGR4GM said: I have no freaking clue why we would want Jimmy Vesey. He plays a position we don't need. He isn't a significant upgrade over what we have. He 3 years ago indicated pretty directly he did not want to play here. This is mind boggling dumb to trade assets for a 3rd line LW who has a history of wanting to play in 1 place and 1 place only. This is how you get guys on your team with bad attitudes. If he was really good, fine. But he is a 3rd line player with mediocre possession metrics. There is a huge spread between "My first choice is the Rangers" and "I don't want to play in Buffalo." Vesey has never to my knowledge indicated anything except the former. Having said that, JB certainly needs to do his homework as to Vesey's mindset so as to avoid repeating the Berglund debacle. 9 hours ago, dudacek said: So that sounds pretty much like there is a deal in principle if one of the parties doesn’t change its mind because of another deal they’re chasing. When was the last time the Sabres acquired a player the fans disliked as much as Vesey? I think there is only a small minority of fans who dislike Vesey. Most do not have a strong opinion one way or the other. Separately, I completely agree that Vesey can't be the main offseason acquisition at forward. But I doubt that is JB's plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 He did score three goals against us last season #sabrekiller 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASabresIUFAN Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 Let’s go get Hall and Larsson. Seems like poetic justice. I doubt NJ actually trades Hall now. I think they’ll want him to play with Hughes and see if they dynamic kid convinces him to stay. If not trade him at the deadline. Look out but and 1-2 of Hughes and Nico looks pretty good. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 (edited) Ok, let's take away that Vesey didn't want to play here. Let's completely ignore it. How does he upgrade the roster? If you are spending assets for a 1yr rental who then becomes a UFA, he should be an upgrade. He isn't isn't an upgrade. Edited June 21, 2019 by LGR4GM 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 1 minute ago, LGR4GM said: Ok, let's take away that Vesey didn't want to play here. Let's completely ignore it. How does he upgrade the roster? If you are spending assets for a 1yr rental who then becomes a UFA, he should be an upgrade. He isn't isn't an upgrade. Well, you're right that the price shouldn't be too high. I certainly wouldn't want them to spend much to get him. However, as noted previously I disagree about him being an upgrade. The Sabres' middle 6 was freaking terrible last year, and Vesey is a young player with size and speed who can score goals. You are certainly free to prefer guys like Sheary (who was terrible for over half of the season), ERod (who had 9 goals in 74 games), KO, Sobotka, etc. -- but I'd rather give Vesey a try. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsb Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 6 hours ago, dudacek said: He’s one of a very small handful of players who Sabre fans boo when he touches the puck. I don’t have any strong feelings about him as a player. He’s an NHL winger who should at least increase our depth. Maybe he can help our middle six more than Sheary did, but probably not. We trade pick 31 for him I’ll be upset. if it’s pick 67, fine. I'm not a Vesey fan by any means but he would have been our #4 best scoring winger last year. My guess is it's him for Scandella and hopefully not McCabe but if it is, with his injury history of late that may end up being a fair deal also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 1 minute ago, nfreeman said: Well, you're right that the price shouldn't be too high. I certainly wouldn't want them to spend much to get him. However, as noted previously I disagree about him being an upgrade. The Sabres' middle 6 was freaking terrible last year, and Vesey is a young player with size and speed who can score goals. You are certainly free to prefer guys like Sheary (who was terrible for over half of the season), ERod (who had 9 goals in 74 games), KO, Sobotka, etc. -- but I'd rather give Vesey a try. Pominville is better that Vesey. Surely we can do better than that in upgrading the middle six. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 2 minutes ago, nfreeman said: Well, you're right that the price shouldn't be too high. I certainly wouldn't want them to spend much to get him. However, as noted previously I disagree about him being an upgrade. The Sabres' middle 6 was freaking terrible last year, and Vesey is a young player with size and speed who can score goals. You are certainly free to prefer guys like Sheary (who was terrible for over half of the season), ERod (who had 9 goals in 74 games), KO, Sobotka, etc. -- but I'd rather give Vesey a try. Why? He isn't young either. Vesey is 26. His most goals is 17. He outscored Erod by 6 points. So I am trading assets for a 26yr old left wing (side we need the least) who is at best a 35-40pt winger. Again, the only thing he gives you is size. Almost the entire team was terrible for over half the season. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASabresIUFAN Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 2 minutes ago, nfreeman said: Well, you're right that the price shouldn't be too high. I certainly wouldn't want them to spend much to get him. However, as noted previously I disagree about him being an upgrade. The Sabres' middle 6 was freaking terrible last year, and Vesey is a young player with size and speed who can score goals. You are certainly free to prefer guys like Sheary (who was terrible for over half of the season), ERod (who had 9 goals in 74 games), KO, Sobotka, etc. -- but I'd rather give Vesey a try. I’d rather try Olofsson, but agree that Vesey is probably better then some of the status quo options. He might do well with Mitts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 1 minute ago, darksabre said: Pominville is better that Vesey. Surely we can do better than that in upgrading the middle six. Pommer's career will most likely end up being better than Vesey's, but at this point I would absolutely have Vesey. Pommer is out of gas. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 2 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said: I’d rather try Olofsson, but agree that Vesey is probably better then some of the status quo options. He might do well with Mitts. I will trade them Sobotka straight up for Vesey. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsb Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, LGR4GM said: I will trade them Sobotka straight up for Vesey. You're better than this plus the Rangers are still trying to upgrade their blue line and have enough up and coming wingers to trade for our extra https://bluelinestation.com/2019/06/16/new-york-rangers-blueshirts-return-jimmy-vesey/ Edited June 21, 2019 by jsb Added info 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 2 minutes ago, nfreeman said: Pommer's career will most likely end up being better than Vesey's, but at this point I would absolutely have Vesey. Pommer is out of gas. I know this is a common talking point around here but I will continue to disagree with it. That's not the point though. On a bad team Pommers was just as good as Vesey despite being long in the tooth and relegated to a mostly checking role. Vesey doesn't score enough and he doesn't defend well enough to justify plugging him in to this roster. He doesn't fit this team's needs and I want nothing to do with him. Find literally anyone else who is better. It shouldn't be hard. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 1 minute ago, nfreeman said: Pommer's career will most likely end up being better than Vesey's, but at this point I would absolutely have Vesey. Pommer is out of gas. Pommer's career already is better than Vesey's. Vesey's best season by age 26: 17g, 18a for 35pts Pommers best season by age 26: 34g, 34a (68pts) or 27g and 53a (80pts) I mean come one, this isn't even a comparison to make. Most likely? Pominville is the better hockey player and might still be to this day. The only 2 years that fall below Vesey's best are his last 2 years and they fall behind vesey by 1 and 4 total points on the season. Further Pominville was still defensively sound even with his declining production. Most likely? Is was and will be. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triumph_communes Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 (edited) Pomminstein is a smart player, but he is out of gas. If we have a lot of line drivers he is a great compliment, but the Sabre’s currently lack line drivers outside of Eichel/Erod. Hopefully the new coach revives the line driving tendencies out of guys like Girgensons again, but fact is we’re still playing with a lot of complimentary guys. We could use some bigger guys who at least attempt to possess the puck longer than a hot potato. Vesey ain’t anything special, I agree, and he will never hold a candle to Pomminstein in his prime, but if you’re trading something like Sobotka/Sheary the other way—who cares? Overpaid 3rd line winger to hold the spot until he either transforms as a player under a new/coach and system, or gets replaced from within. Edited June 21, 2019 by triumph_communes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted June 21, 2019 Report Share Posted June 21, 2019 2 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said: I’d rather try Olofsson, but agree that Vesey is probably better then some of the status quo options. He might do well with Mitts. It would be great if Olofsson can step up and contribute this year, but there is zero evidence that he'll be able to. I don't see how anyone can look at the Sabres' roster and conclude that no upgrade at LW is needed. After Skinner it's a vast wasteland. But if the LWs below Skinner were Vesey, Olofsson (having proven capable) and Sheary, all fighting it out for ice time, then it starts looking like a real group of NHL forwards. 1 minute ago, LGR4GM said: I will trade them Sobotka straight up for Vesey. What is the point of this? Just to be argumentative? A more realistic proposal would be GA's idea of Scandella. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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