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LGR4GM

Phil Housley should be fired.

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Ballo makes more gaffs, Hunwick meh but good defender just doesnt bring a lot of O. Again dont think that player is on the team yet.

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I think the questions can be boiled down to: 

Has Phil lost the team?

I say he hasn't in the least bit.  The players never hint or otherwise that they have a problem with their coach.  When coaching is an issue for a team, at some point the players start hinting.  I see no signs that the players do not respect Phil.

Would the Sabres benefit more from a new coach or roster improvements?

This is an obvious yes. Seeing Phil's system, if we had the players who could play it 85-90% this team would already be in the playoffs.

Is Phil responsible for the team's mental discipline?

This is the most difficult to answer, I think.  I struggle with where the player's responsibility for their own focus ends, and where the coach's responsibility for the teams' focus begins.  Open to reading other POVs on this, especially.

Edited by ...

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25 minutes ago, ... said:

I think the questions can be boiled down to: 

Has Phil lost the team?

I say he hasn't in the least bit.  The players never hint or otherwise that they have a problem with their coach.  When coaching is an issue for a team, at some point the players stat hinting.  I see no signs that the players do not respect Phil.

Would the Sabres benefit more from a new coach or roster improvements?

This is an obvious yes. Seeing Phil's system, if we had the players who could play it 85-90% this team would already be in the playoffs.

Is Phil responsible for the team's mental discipline?

This is the most difficult to answer, I think.  I struggle with where the player's responsibility for their own focus ends, and where the coach's responsibility for the teams' focus begins.  Open to reading other POVs on this, especially.

I don’t think Phil has lost the team.. we’ve got recent examples of what that really looks like (team tuning out Ruff, players going behind Bylsma’s back).

but... Phil has failed to reach them. The lack of desperation in Eichel’s game is one of Phil’s biggest failures.

and even beyond that, when we get in to the game to game tactics at which he is really really bad. I can’t imagine what a 7 game series would look like... scary.

Edited by jame

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32 minutes ago, jame said:

but... Phil has failed to reach them. The lack of desperation in Eichel’s game is one of Phil’s biggest failures.

This is the mental discipline question.  I need a better explanation of why Phil is responsible for Eichel's focus or lack of it.

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4 hours ago, jame said:

I don’t think Phil has lost the team.. we’ve got recent examples of what that really looks like (team tuning out Ruff, players going behind Bylsma’s back).

but... Phil has failed to reach them. The lack of desperation in Eichel’s game is one of Phil’s biggest failures.

and even beyond that, when we get in to the game to game tactics at which he is really really bad. I can’t imagine what a 7 game series would look like... scary.

I think that is Eichel's biggest failure. He should be more desperate and shouldn't need a coach to tell him to be. He sometimes like tenacity and it is frustrating. 

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An effective power play coupled with less shorties would have won the game yesterday.  HCPH has no answers for the PP and it has been 1.5 years...not a recent problem.

Second...as in period.  HCPH seems to be lost on how to get better 2nd period performance for the team as evident by the season-to-date +/- differential vs. the 1st and 3rd periods.  Statistically the second period is by far our worse from a scoring differential standpoint.

He is accountable for these two things in my mind.

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3 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

I think that is Eichel's biggest failure. He should be more desperate and shouldn't need a coach to tell him to be. He sometimes like tenacity and it is frustrating. 

Eichel brings it only when he feels like it, and that happens only now and again.  

How much of that is on Housley can be debated.  A HC in the NHL these days has very little to work with in terms of disciplining thees guys.  All you can do is take away ice time, and I'm sure there is pressure from everywhere on Housley to give Eichel as much time as possible.

I would have no problem with removing Housley tomorrow; but I'm not sure that impact wins/losses all that much.

Replacing him with the right coach would be critical, but I don't have much faith in this organization's ability to find a great HC.

 

 

 

 

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31 minutes ago, Kruppstahl said:

Eichel brings it only when he feels like it, and that happens only now and again.  

How much of that is on Housley can be debated.  A HC in the NHL these days has very little to work with in terms of disciplining thees guys.  All you can do is take away ice time, and I'm sure there is pressure from everywhere on Housley to give Eichel as much time as possible.

I would have no problem with removing Housley tomorrow; but I'm not sure that impact wins/losses all that much.

Replacing him with the right coach would be critical, but I don't have much faith in this organization's ability to find a great HC.

 

 

 

 

I have no inside insight into this, but I would be inclined to disagree.

Great coaches in any sport are usually praised for their attention to detail. This is usually conveyed in how they practice, and by the coach harping on the little things. It's what people talk about with Belichick.

When I see our guys fanning on passes in the d-zone (Scandella, looking at you), not making the simple play to clear the zone, missing assignments... or taking ill-advised shots on net, making ill-advised pinches, etc... I think about players who are not attentive to the small details.

 

I don't think it's necessarily a matter of disciplining under-performing players by reducing their ice time- it's about how they practice.

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I've made up my mind on this.  It's the players and not Phil.

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Just now, ... said:

I've made up my mind on this.  It's the players and not Phil.

I think it’s both.

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1 minute ago, SwampD said:

I think it’s both.

Sorry, disagree.  Trying to instill a sense of urgency in players is near impossible without multiple mushroom or peyote trips in a desert with puppets, music and a light show.

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6 minutes ago, ... said:

Sorry, disagree.  Trying to instill a sense of urgency in players is near impossible without multiple mushroom or peyote trips in a desert with puppets, music and a light show.

He shows no emotion on the bench. He shows no emotion in press conferences. He’s a wet noodle. Willian H. Macy had more sac in Fargo.

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Just now, SwampD said:

He shows no emotion on the bench. He shows no emotion in press conferences. He’s a wet noodle. Willian H. Macy had more sac in Fargo.

Dude, this is false.  Ever since the narrative about Phil "showing no emotion" cropped up, I've watched him on the bench.  It's not true at all.  Not by the least bit.  Don't fall for this false narrative.

The press conferences are carefully handled.  He CAN NOT get all emo in front of those mics.  Look at the bunch he's dealing with.  He did get emo tonight if you weren't listening.  

Too many people who are too ignorant are creating a false narrative against Phil.  You don't want a guy who is NOT in control of their emotions coaching your team.

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3 minutes ago, ... said:

Dude, this is false.  Ever since the narrative about Phil "showing no emotion" cropped up, I've watched him on the bench.  It's not true at all.  Not by the least bit.  Don't fall for this false narrative.

The press conferences are carefully handled.  He CAN NOT get all emo in front of those mics.  Look at the bunch he's dealing with.  He did get emo tonight if you weren't listening.  

Too many people who are too ignorant are creating a false narrative against Phil.  You don't want a guy who is NOT in control of their emotions coaching your team.

I’ve looked. I haven’t seen it. If you say it’s there I’ll pay more attention, but I have not seen it.

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Again, the WGR guys are in line with my point.  What if Quenneville were coaching this bunch?  I guarantee he would lose them faster than a blind guy looking for toilet paper in a Lowes.  His gruff, manly style would reduce some of these players into puddles of person-hood.

Edited by ...
Gern Blanston

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25 minutes ago, ... said:

Sorry, disagree.  Trying to instill a sense of urgency in players is near impossible without multiple mushroom or peyote trips in a desert with puppets, music and a light show.

I’m in.

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40 minutes ago, ... said:

Too many people who are too ignorant are creating a false narrative against Phil.  You don't want a guy who is NOT in control of their emotions coaching your team.

Agree. It's old school vs. new school and Phil is in step with the new and where things are going. Critics should look closer at the newer coaches and realize the old gruff types are a dying breed. 

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1 hour ago, PerreaultForever said:

Agree. It's old school vs. new school and Phil is in step with the new and where things are going. Critics should look closer at the newer coaches and realize the old gruff types are a dying breed. 

True, but they need a guy with a deep voice that appropriately can be pissed once in a while by lack of effort. Phil's mealy mouth doesn't appear to get the message across.  Once in a while a two by four is needed to broken on a table if you can no longer use it on the back of their heads to get their attention.

Edited by North Buffalo

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1 hour ago, North Buffalo said:

True, but they need a guy with a deep voice that appropriately can be pissed once in a while by lack of effort. Phil's mealy mouth doesn't appear to get the message across.  Once in a while a two by four is needed to broken on a table if you can no longer use it on the back of their heads to get their attention.

I actually don't see a lot of lack of effort this year. A lack of skill, sure, but the effort is there and they don't quit most nights. It's actually a big change from recent years where the third periods (when we were behind) were often sleep affairs where we would generate absolutely nothing. 

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We need a coach like Barry Trotz. A good experienced coach who can build and lead a team.

I am getting sick of all the green horns not doing their job. I believe that this team can/must be better than this. 

Why should Skinner sign here?

 

I am totally frustrated, because we lost 4 of 7 at home. 

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6 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

I actually don't see a lot of lack of effort this year. A lack of skill, sure, but the effort is there and they don't quit most nights. It's actually a big change from recent years where the third periods (when we were behind) were often sleep affairs where we would generate absolutely nothing. 

I don't see them quit, I just see them make some very dumb mental errors. It seems to happen constantly.  I will give Phil a hair of credit because last night he actually said they weren't good enough. This team needs to grow up. 

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4 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

I don't see them quit, I just see them make some very dumb mental errors. It seems to happen constantly.  I will give Phil a hair of credit because last night he actually said they weren't good enough. This team needs to grow up. 

I've come down this way.  I dunno that some sort of Scotty Bowman/Mike Babcock/Knute Rockne/Dean Smith clone would do better with these guys.  Watching Sheary look at his man going to the far post and Bogo having to almost shove him out of the way so he can try to cover two guys only to give up a goal pretty much epitomizes it.  This group is just really dumb.  Hockey IQ is obviously something that hasn't been either considered or valued for years in building this team (and yes, I know Sheary was JBotts add, but it's just an example).  JBotts needs to fix it, and I'm sure he is and will be working on it, but man...

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1 hour ago, Sabel79 said:

I've come down this way.  I dunno that some sort of Scotty Bowman/Mike Babcock/Knute Rockne/Dean Smith clone would do better with these guys.  Watching Sheary look at his man going to the far post and Bogo having to almost shove him out of the way so he can try to cover two guys only to give up a goal pretty much epitomizes it.  This group is just really dumb.  Hockey IQ is obviously something that hasn't been either considered or valued for years in building this team (and yes, I know Sheary was JBotts add, but it's just an example).  JBotts needs to fix it, and I'm sure he is and will be working on it, but man...

I love this description. I'm not sure it matters if it didn't exactly go down like that. Sheary being ragdolled off the puck in the corner moments before that was almost as juicy.

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In my humble opinion, General Manager Jason Botterill needs to address the fan base on what the plan moving forward is. That includes the tenure of Phil Housley.

To myself in any event, as I watch the games, especially these past 2 months, it is more than clear that whatever strategy and tactics Phil is using are not working. There is something inherently wrong with Housley's inability, unwillingness, refusal, incompetence, call it what you will, to adjust strategies and tactics to fit the abilities and skillsets of his players. This, to me, is a sign of very bad coaching staff or a roster of players who simply are not able to adapt. Now, on this roster, yea, I can 6 to 8 players that may fall in to the latter's category, but 23 of them? Actually more given the replacements from time to time from the press box or Rochester. I'm having a really hard time believing EVERY PLAYER in the Sabres organization is unable to adjust to Housley's system, and yet, night after night, game after game, it appears there is a complete disconnect there.

I'm there now, Housley needs to go, if for no other reason than to try a different strategy.

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11 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

Agree. It's old school vs. new school and Phil is in step with the new and where things are going. Critics should look closer at the newer coaches and realize the old gruff types are a dying breed. 

I don't need him to be gruff I need him to hold this team to a higher standard and enforce consequences when that doesn't happen. 

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