UPDATE: Sam Reinhart signs 2-year extension -- $3.65MM per year

[inkman]

54 minutes ago, Carmel Corn said:

Drury > Reinhart

Not even close.  I'll take leadership vs. a few less points any day.  Drury made those around him better by setting the example. 

***** that New York City loving DBag. I got no love for him. Always spoke of in a lore that should be reserved for Mark Messier, Steve Yzerman or Cam Neely. He was a good player on a great team, a surly mizer that berated teammates, not always for the better. 

[erickompositör72]

Darcy had no intention to re-sign Drury, yet some here blame Drury for leaving? And what's with the NYC hate? Your personal hang-ups weaken your hockey arguments.

[inkman]

1 minute ago, erickompositör72 said:

Darcy had no intention to re-sign Drury, yet some here blame Drury for leaving? And what's with the NYC hate? Your personal hang-ups weaken your hockey arguments.

My personal hang ups are my personal hang ups. I have them for reasons. I didn't blame him for leaving, I blamed him for liking NYC. Sorry, I just don't like the place. 

[Taro T]

6 minutes ago, erickompositör72 said:

Darcy had no intention to re-sign Drury, yet some here blame Drury for leaving? And what's with the NYC hate? Your personal hang-ups weaken your hockey arguments.

How do you explain his having worked out a 5 year deal with Drury in the fall of '06, if he "had no intention to re-sign Drury?"

[SwampD]

Ugh. Please, no.

This thread is about Reinhart,... who is better that Drury.

[Taro T]

45 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

I think our Briere and Drury are going to end up being Skinner and Mitts... although Mitts is still developing.  Remember that when we had them, they were in their prime.  Honestly Reino may be more of a Hecht:  Swiss Army Knife you move around the lineup to fill a need.

Hecht was way better defensively and way worse offensively than Reinhart.

But, who Sam slots in as historically similar to is a great question.  Really not coming up with the answer.  My initial guess is Audette, but that's not quite right.  Maybe Seiling (especially when fan disappointment in his play for factors beyond his control are factored in).

[dudacek]

I don’t “blame” him for leaving. I just think his decision to leave doesn’t match his reputation as a leader.

He whined his way out of Calgary, left the Sabres the first chance he got and stole money from the Rangers with his mediocre performance.

He had two good playoff runs (18 points in 18 games for Buffalo and 11 goals in 23 games for the Avs) but overall basically scored at a 50-point pace in the playoffs. He went pointless in the Olympics, never scored 70 points in the regular season and scored more than 30 goals only once.

And for all his vaunted competitiveness, he finished as a minus player for his career despite playing for two of the best teams of his decade. Who wouldn’t excel on a team with Sakic and Forsberg, or the depth of the 06 Sabres?

Drury was good, but immensely overrated.

Edited December 15, 2018 by dudacek

[dudacek]

2 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Hecht was way better defensively and way worse offensively than Reinhart.

But, who Sam slots in as historically similar to is a great question.  Really not coming up with the answer.  My initial guess is Audette, but that's not quite right.  Maybe Seiling (especially when fan disappointment in his play for factors beyond his control are factored in).

For durability, quiet effectiveness, position and production, Pominville is an excellent comp.

Seiling could never produce like Sam.

[Taro T]

3 minutes ago, dudacek said:

For durability, quiet effectiveness, position and production, Pominville is an excellent comp.

Seiling could never produce like Sam.

Maybe you're too young to remember Seiling prior to the eye injury (which he never fully recovered from).  60 points in his 3rd season.  30 goals and 57 points in his 4th.  22 goals & 47 points in 57 games the year he had that horrific injury.

Never reached 20 goals again & only had 1 season over 40 points after that.

Don't really see Pominville as that direct of a comparable, but maybe.  Pominville has a much harder shot (or did) and was extremely defensively sound.  He also could win 1 on 1 battles (at least against backwards skating forwards ?).  None of these are strengths of Reinhart.

[dudacek]

9 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Maybe you're too young to remember Seiling prior to the eye injury (which he never fully recovered from).  60 points in his 3rd season.  30 goals and 57 points in his 4th.  22 goals & 47 points in 57 games the year he had that horrific injury.

Never reached 20 goals again & only had 1 season over 40 points after that.

Don't really see Pominville as that direct of a comparable, but maybe.  Pominville has a much harder shot (or did) and was extremely defensively sound.  He also could win 1 on 1 battles (at least against backwards skating forwards ?).  None of these are strengths of Reinhart.

Don’t see a huge correlation in their playing styles, other than their smart, penalty free games. It’s more about their stature and reliability.

I might be selling his early play short, but Seiling’s 60 points then correlates to what, 45 to 50 now? Reinhart is going to 65-70 this year.

[GASabresIUFAN]

Seiling's problem is that he was drafted one slot ahead and at the same position as Mike Bossy. 

[dudacek]

4 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Seiling's problem is that he was drafted one slot ahead and at the same position as Mike Bossy. 

Not his fault and doesn’t mean he wasn’t good (Said Taro about Sam and Draisaitl).

[Taro T]

5 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Seiling's problem is that he was drafted one slot ahead and at the same position as Mike Bossy. 

Which is why I'd said perhaps the greatest similarity between him and Reinhart is fan disappointment in their play due to factors far beyond their control.

[Taro T]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

Don’t see a huge correlation in their playing styles, other than their smart, penalty free games. It’s more about their stature and reliability.

I might be selling his early play short, but Seiling’s 60 points then correlates to what, 45 to 50 now? Reinhart is going to 65-70 this year.

Seiling was never the top RW on the Sabres, especially early in his career.  They played Robert on the top line & Gare was better than him (though he typically was the 3rd member of the checking line - what a checking line: Ramsay - Luce - Gare).

And scoring in late '70's / early '80's wasn't like mid/late '80's / early '90's.  (Gretzky's goal explosion didn't happen until Seiling's 5th season.). 60 points was probably like 55 points today.  A smidge higher, but comparable.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

2 hours ago, dudacek said:

I don’t “blame” him for leaving. I just think his decision to leave doesn’t match his reputation as a leader.

He whined his way out of Calgary, left the Sabres the first chance he got and stole money from the Rangers with his mediocre performance.

He had two good playoff runs (18 points in 18 games for Buffalo and 11 goals in 23 games for the Avs) but overall basically scored at a 50-point pace in the playoffs. He went pointless in the Olympics, never scored 70 points in the regular season and scored more than 30 only once.

And for all his vaunted competitiveness, he finished as a minus player for his career despite playing for two of the best teams of his decade. Who wouldn’t excel on a team with Sakic and Forsberg, or the depth of the 06 Sabres.

Drury was good, but immensely overrated.

Not sure why I'm quoting you, but ...

What everybody remembers about Drury is that goal against the Rangers.  That's it.

When Samson scores one like it, or even more clutch, or clinching, or ... all will be forgiven and forgotten.

Samson will be the better overall player, IMO.  Very different styles, but better, if he isn't at this point already.

[Taro T]

30 minutes ago, New Scotland (NS) said:

Not sure why I'm quoting you, but ...

What everybody remembers about Drury is that goal against the Rangers.  That's it.

When Samson scores one like it, or even more clutch, or clinching, or ... all will be forgiven and forgotten.

Samson will be the better overall player, IMO.  Very different styles, but better, if he isn't at this point already.

Funny, my memory was missing the open net in the 1st in game 7 down in Left Turn Land.

Thst, and helping to convince management to dump Satan.

[Doohickie]

5 hours ago, erickompositör72 said:

And what's with the NYC hate?

There's plenty to hate about NYC.  But that's beside the point.

5 hours ago, Taro T said:

Hecht was way better defensively and way worse offensively than Reinhart.

But, who Sam slots in as historically similar to is a great question.  Really not coming up with the answer.  My initial guess is Audette, but that's not quite right.  Maybe Seiling (especially when fan disappointment in his play for factors beyond his control are factored in).

Audette might be a better comp.  Hecht was just the best I could come up with.

[Thorny]

7 hours ago, dudacek said:

You know, this is an archaic form of analytics versus eye test.

Reinhart’s goals and assists will never count as much as other guys because of the way he gets them and he will never be “that good” because he wasn’t worth tanking for.

He’s not a star, but that doesn’t mean he’s not a very good player. If he scores 65-70 points this year - which he is pacing for - it will be one of the best statistical seasons by a Sabre in a decade, more than Chris Drury ever scored. 

It doesn’t matter. To some people, he will always be just another Brad Boyes.

Whatchya gonna do...whatchya gonna do when he comes for you.

[Thorny]

7 hours ago, calti said:

we would all--well most of us--take a drury over a reinhardt.

I can not imagine anyone who can't even spell his name correctly at this point would likely be one to take an earnest look into the little things a guy like Sam is doing on the ice, that they might be missing. 

7 hours ago, Carmel Corn said:

Drury > Reinhart

Not even close.  I'll take leadership vs. a few less points any day.  Drury made those around him better by setting the example. 

Not picking on your opinion particularly, just wanted to quote this as a reference point to say that Chris Drury is as overrated a Sabre as Vanek is under.

Edited December 13, 2018 by Thorny

[dudacek]

Here’s another interesting stat on Sam Reinhart’s recent even strength play: +13 in his past 20 games.

Since he broke out of his slump in mid-January? 64 points in 70 games.

Edited December 14, 2018 by dudacek

[GASabresIUFAN]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

Here’s another interesting stat on Sam Reinhart’s recent even strength play: +13 in his past 20 games.

Since he broke out of his slump in mid-January? 64 points in 70 games.

Obviously he clearly stinks.  We should trade him for Sam Bennett immediately.

[JohnRobertEichel]

Reinhart's pass to Eichel on Skinner's goal tonight was a perfect example of what this guy does to make those around him better.

[jsb]

On 12/12/2018 at 5:38 PM, erickompositör72 said:

And what's with the NYC hate? Your personal hang-ups weaken your hockey arguments.

I think it may be the salsa or picante sauce??

 

As for the player comparisons, it always seems to me we remember the best moments or year of a certain player of the past and for get a guy like Samson is still only 23 years old. When the Sabres become a perenial playoff team with an eventual SC, these guys will all be unforgettables. 

Edited December 14, 2018 by jsb

[Samson's Flow]

On 12/12/2018 at 5:13 PM, dudacek said:

You know, this is an archaic form of analytics versus eye test.

Reinhart’s goals and assists will never count as much as other guys because of the way he gets them and he will never be “that good” because he wasn’t worth tanking for.

He’s not a star, but that doesn’t mean he’s not a very good player. If he scores 65-70 points this year - which he is pacing for - it will be one of the best statistical seasons by a Sabre in a decade, more than Chris Drury ever scored. 

It doesn’t matter. To some people, he will always be just another Brad Boyes.

*checks user name history*

*looks at current user name*

That checks out... ?

[erickompositör72]

On 12/12/2018 at 6:46 PM, Taro T said:

How do you explain his having worked out a 5 year deal with Drury in the fall of '06, if he "had no intention to re-sign Drury?"

Yeah, I think I mis-remembered Drury's lack of intention as Darcy's lack of intention. But I still don't think a player's desire to play in a certain location speaks to their leadership. Is Tavares not a good leader? I'd say his moving to TO has no bearing on that.

On 12/13/2018 at 12:13 AM, Doohickie said:

There's plenty to hate about NYC.  But that's beside the point.

There's plenty to hate about Buffalo. Or any city, for that matter.

Do you hate it as a tourist, or have you actually lived there?

Edited December 14, 2018 by erickompositör72