Reinhart, The Force Awakens

[Thorny]

The table where he's going to produce at a higher rate offensively than Toews. And Reinhart isn't short on guts. 

[nfreeman]

7 minutes ago, Thorny said:

The table where he's going to produce at a higher rate offensively than Toews. And Reinhart isn't short on guts. 

Reino isn't short on guts, I agree.  But he's not in Toews' class in that regard.  And he's never going to get a sniff of the Canadian Olympic team, let alone win best forward in the tournament.

[Thorny]

4 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

Reino isn't short on guts, I agree.  But he's not in Toews' class in that regard.  And he's never going to get a sniff of the Canadian Olympic team, let alone win best forward in the tournament.

It's like a 5-7 game sample size in a one-off tournament. 

And I wouldn't even rule it out: Sam won best forward at the WJC, following (I think?) in Toews footsteps there, too. 

He probably won't ever get to Toews level consideration, but then again, Toews is one of the most vastly overrated players of his or any generation.

We live in a world where Toews was included in the Top 100 All Time players, and Malkin was not. 

Edited February 8, 2019 by Thorny

[dudacek]

2 hours ago, nfreeman said:

But Skinner's 2 goals in the 3rd were better plays, and more valuable.  (Especially that 1st one on the breakaway -- holy mackerel.)

That goal was a thing of beauty.

I do think Reinhart is a better hockey player than Skinner, but I regret that post.

They are both first-line players who excel in different, complementary areas and could help any team win.

They deserve a better supporting cast.

Edited February 8, 2019 by dudacek

[PerreaultForever]

5 hours ago, jame said:

I don't really see any of this. Reinhart is far more engaged physically than Skinner. That's not to say Skinner doesn't go to the net... he sure does. And it's not to say Eichel isn't the one lugging the puck most of the time. But it's Reinhart who does the dirty work down low, extending possessions with his uniquely elite forechecking skill (Seriously, his stick work, positioning, and leverage down low is the type of tape that will be used to teach).

Correct. Reinhart is a better hockey player. Skinner is a better goal scorer.

Skinner's one on one goal against carolina is a perfect illustration of my point. Reinhart can tap them in when they get to the front of the net and his shot from outside is okay but I have NEVER seen him fight through a guy one on one from outside the slot and out maneuver a guy and simply drive past a defender like that. 

Skinner is by far a much better player and much much much more valuable to this, or any team. 

[jame]

15 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

Skinner's one on one goal against carolina is a perfect illustration of my point. Reinhart can tap them in when they get to the front of the net and his shot from outside is okay but I have NEVER seen him fight through a guy one on one from outside the slot and out maneuver a guy and simply drive past a defender like that. 

Skinner is by far a much better player and much much much more valuable to this, or any team. 

I don’t disagree that Reinhart has not and cannot do what Skinner did on that goal. 

Theres just far more to hockey than that.

 

[PerreaultForever]

1 hour ago, jame said:

I don’t disagree that Reinhart has not and cannot do what Skinner did on that goal. 

Theres just far more to hockey than that.

 

Ya, apparently there's goaltending too :)

[Weave]

5 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

Skinner's one on one goal against carolina is a perfect illustration of my point. Reinhart can tap them in when they get to the front of the net and his shot from outside is okay but I have NEVER seen him fight through a guy one on one from outside the slot and out maneuver a guy and simply drive past a defender like that. 

Skinner is by far a much better player and much much much more valuable to this, or any team. 

I think the word you are looking for is determination.  Sam is a terrific player, but I don’t sense that he has the determination that Skinner has.  He uses short man syndrome to his benefit.

[North Buffalo]

1 hour ago, Weave said:

I think the word you are looking for is determination.  Sam is a terrific player, but I don’t sense that he has the determination that Skinner has.  He uses short man syndrome to his benefit.

Not as consistently agreed, but last night I saw him going into the corners digging pucks out better than any other Sabres forward.

[inkman]

7 hours ago, jame said:

I don’t disagree that Reinhart has not and cannot do what Skinner did on that goal. 

Theres just far more to hockey than that.

 

To be fair, I don't think I've seen any Sabre score a goal like that other than Skinner last night. It's just a situation that doesn't present itself too often. Usually the forward breaks away.  

[jame]

ROR was constantly dogged for the "I've got to be better", "it starts with me", excuses....

Eichel has picked up right where ROR left off... 

 

While calling out goalies is never a good idea... I kinda like that Reinhart called guys in the room out. Watch/Read his full interview, he didn't just call the goalies out, he called out everyone.

“That’s a team we were tied with going into the night,” Reinhart said. “That’s who we’re fighting, so I think we need more fight from the start from a lot of people in this room. That’s got to change very soon here.

“We all need to realize that we’ve got guys who are capable of making plays when we need to offensively. And with that being said, we need more respect for our own end. We need to all come back and pick up guys. If your shift calls for defending their guys, their top guys, that’s what you’re expected to do, and we need more out of everyone in that regard.”

 

https://theathletic.com/807277/2019/02/08/the-learnings-over-you-have-to-defend-frustrations-mount-as-sabres-find-themselves-on-wrong-end-of-yet-another-high-scoring-game/

[Sabres Fan in NS]

2 minutes ago, jame said:

ROR was constantly dogged for the "I've got to be better", "it starts with me", excuses....

Eichel has picked up right where ROR left off... 

 

While calling out goalies is never a good idea... I kinda like that Reinhart called guys in the room out. Watch/Read his full interview, he didn't just call the goalies out, he called out everyone.

“That’s a team we were tied with going into the night,” Reinhart said. “That’s who we’re fighting, so I think we need more fight from the start from a lot of people in this room. That’s got to change very soon here.

“We all need to realize that we’ve got guys who are capable of making plays when we need to offensively. And with that being said, we need more respect for our own end. We need to all come back and pick up guys. If your shift calls for defending their guys, their top guys, that’s what you’re expected to do, and we need more out of everyone in that regard.”

 

https://theathletic.com/807277/2019/02/08/the-learnings-over-you-have-to-defend-frustrations-mount-as-sabres-find-themselves-on-wrong-end-of-yet-another-high-scoring-game/

Not only is Samson becoming a very good NHL player he is growing into a leader of this team, IMO.

When taken in full context, which is always best his post-game interview is pretty much bang on.  I agree, that making it more specific is not good.

[LGR4GM]

8 minutes ago, jame said:

ROR was constantly dogged for the "I've got to be better", "it starts with me", excuses....

Eichel has picked up right where ROR left off... 

 

While calling out goalies is never a good idea... I kinda like that Reinhart called guys in the room out. Watch/Read his full interview, he didn't just call the goalies out, he called out everyone.

“That’s a team we were tied with going into the night,” Reinhart said. “That’s who we’re fighting, so I think we need more fight from the start from a lot of people in this room. That’s got to change very soon here.

“We all need to realize that we’ve got guys who are capable of making plays when we need to offensively. And with that being said, we need more respect for our own end. We need to all come back and pick up guys. If your shift calls for defending their guys, their top guys, that’s what you’re expected to do, and we need more out of everyone in that regard.”

 

https://theathletic.com/807277/2019/02/08/the-learnings-over-you-have-to-defend-frustrations-mount-as-sabres-find-themselves-on-wrong-end-of-yet-another-high-scoring-game/

I mean, he's right. They play sloppy in their own end and spend a lot of time puck watching instead of picking up a guy. They, and I hate saying this, physically do not clear the front of the net. I don't think it is because they aren't physical, I think they aren't playing that way. 

[darksabre]

4 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

I mean, he's right. They play sloppy in their own end and spend a lot of time puck watching instead of picking up a guy. They, and I hate saying this, physically do not clear the front of the net. I don't think it is because they aren't physical, I think they aren't playing that way. 

This is correct.

[dudacek]

8 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

Skinner's one on one goal against carolina is a perfect illustration of my point. Reinhart can tap them in when they get to the front of the net and his shot from outside is okay but I have NEVER seen him fight through a guy one on one from outside the slot and out maneuver a guy and simply drive past a defender like that.

Skinner is by far a much better player and much much much more valuable to this, or any team. 

Some people thought Messier was a better player than Gretzky for exactly the same reason.

The beauty of hockey is that it is two games simultaneously: a game of power and skill where where you try to beat the guy opposite you in a series of one-on-one battles; and a 5-on-5 chess match where you try to find and create the time and space where you or your teammates can "tap them in."

I suppose it's valid to value one skill set over the other, and it better explains your position on Reinhart.

To me they all count the same.

Edited February 8, 2019 by dudacek

[jame]

3 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Some people thought Messier was a better player than Gretzky for exactly the same reason.

The beauty of hockey is that it is two games simultaneously: a game of power and skill where where you try to beat the guy opposite you in a series of one-on-one battles; and a 5-on-5 chess match where you try to find and create the time and space where you or your teammates can "tap them in."

I suppose it's valid to value one skill set over the other, and its explains your position on Reinhart.

To me they all count the same.

Nailed it.

[dudacek]

22 minutes ago, jame said:

ROR was constantly dogged for the "I've got to be better", "it starts with me", excuses....

Eichel has picked up right where ROR left off... 

 

While calling out goalies is never a good idea... I kinda like that Reinhart called guys in the room out. Watch/Read his full interview, he didn't just call the goalies out, he called out everyone.

“That’s a team we were tied with going into the night,” Reinhart said. “That’s who we’re fighting, so I think we need more fight from the start from a lot of people in this room. That’s got to change very soon here.

“We all need to realize that we’ve got guys who are capable of making plays when we need to offensively. And with that being said, we need more respect for our own end. We need to all come back and pick up guys. If your shift calls for defending their guys, their top guys, that’s what you’re expected to do, and we need more out of everyone in that regard.”

 

https://theathletic.com/807277/2019/02/08/the-learnings-over-you-have-to-defend-frustrations-mount-as-sabres-find-themselves-on-wrong-end-of-yet-another-high-scoring-game/

Wasn't this the big thing coming out of the summer, from all those heart-to-heart soul-searching talks?

That this team had a problem demanding accountability, that this was what they were afraid to do and that they needed more of?

More evidence of the maturation of Sam?

[jame]

24 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Wasn't this the big thing coming out of the summer, from all those heart-to-heart soul-searching talks?

That this team had a problem demanding accountability, that this was what they were afraid to do and that they needed more of?

More evidence of the maturation of Sam?

Yea, the fact that they made such a big stink about ROR's lockerroom style.... and now Jack is basically emulating it ("it starts with me, i wasn't good enough, etc")... not a good sign. 

More evidence that Botts and Housley haven't got a clue.

[Tondas]

14 minutes ago, jame said:

Yea, the fact that they made such a big stink about ROR's lockerroom style.... and now Jack is basically emulating it ("it starts with me, i wasn't good enough, etc")... not a good sign. 

More evidence that Botts and Housley haven't got a clue.

I saw this differently.  ROR used to say he needed to be better after EVERY loss, regardless of how he played.  Jack had a rough game last night, it was a rarity, and we all saw it.  Jack was not placating the reporter, he knows he had a clunker and called himself on it.  I don't hear Jack saying he needs to be better after EVERY loss like ROR.  It just so happened that Jack did need to be better last night, he realized it and told it like it was.

Edited February 8, 2019 by Tondas

[jame]

15 minutes ago, Tondas said:

I saw this differently.  ROR used to say he needed to be better after EVERY loss, regardless of how he played.  Jack had a rough game last night, it was a rarity, and we all saw it.  Jack was not placating the reporter, he knows he had a clunker and called himself on it.  I don't hear Jack saying he needs to be better after EVERY loss like ROR.  It just so happened that Jack did need to be better last night, he realized it and told it like it was.

I don't think it's that rare... 

[#freejame]

10 minutes ago, jame said:

I don't think it's that rare... 

He’s on quite the string of bad performances lately, that’s for sure. 

[LGR4GM]

Reinhart has 49points now in 53 games. He had 50points last year in 82 games.

His 82 game pace is currently: 20g, 56a, for 76 points in 82 games. 

[darksabre]

2 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Reinhart has 49points now in 53 games. He had 50points last year in 82 games.

His 82 game pace is currently: 20g, 56a, for 76 points in 82 games. 

Reinhart is having a great year and I don't think he's getting enough credit for his all around game.

I also think Eichel has been taking Reinhart for granted on his line. I think Sam drives a lot of that line's possession and without Sam there Eichel needs to pick up some of the slack.

[#freejame]

Sam seems to be getting ***** on in every thread less this one for his comments last night. Not sure what it means, but it means something. I’ve got no problems with them and if Carter Hutton (and to a lesser extent, Linus) want to “smash his face into a wall,” maybe they need to do a bit of self-reflecting. 

[jame]

I'm of the opinion that Sam Reinhart has been really damn good for basically the last 100 games... he can say whatever the hell he wants... because whatever the leaders of this team are doing, it's not working.