PASabreFan Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 Sorry, I'm especially argumentative today. He should have been suspended for the hit. If rule 48 doesn't apply, there are others (e.g., 42) that do. I don't think it was a charge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 Yeah it is blindside. Perron was skating north-south, Thorton came in parallel to the red line from the outside. Perron was looking back over his inside shoulder the entire time Thorton was skating up to him. Thorton was out of Perron's field of vision, aka blindside. This is exactly the kind of hit the league is trying to phase out of the game. Last year the league would have ruled the hit OK. This year, no dice. BTW- That D-man that made the pass needs the sh!t beat out of him by a teammate. That was a suicide pass all the way. So a player can turn his head or put his head "down" to draw a hit to the head penalty? Thornton didn't come from the player's side, he came from the front. I wish the league had spelled this out in more detail in the rule book. Surprise, surprise, again it doesn't help fans figure things out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleven Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 I don't think it was a charge. Well, it was something illegal, because Thornton got 5, a game, and a suspension, and we all know that the NHL and its referees never make arbitrary decisions on things like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 So a player can turn his head or put his head "down" to draw a hit to the head penalty? Thornton didn't come from the player's side, he came from the front. I wish the league had spelled this out in more detail in the rule book. Surprise, surprise, again it doesn't help fans figure things out. No way you watched the same vid I did. #1 Thorton did not come from the front. He was traveling parallel to the red line before the hit and continued parallel to the red line post-hit. Perron was traveling north-south, Thorton was clearly coming from the boards east-west. ETA- at the 5 second mark of that vid Thorton is along the boards at the red line striding towards center ice to make contact. Perron is just past his blue line looking back to recieve the pass. Thorton met Perron at the red line with Thorton still skating parallel to the line. Clearly blind side. No diff than a right defensive end catching a right handed QB from his blind side in the backfield. #2 Perron was looking back for several strides to accept that pass. He didn't have his head down until the puck was in his skates. He didn't put his head down because a hit was coming. He never saw Thorton. And to answer your question, I don't know. I don't know where/if the league will draw a line with whether a player should have prepared for the hit. Again, I'm not saying Thorton deserves a suspension, I'm just saying under the current interpretation he'll get one cuz this hit fits it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nobody Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 Well, it was something illegal, because Thornton got 5, a game, and a suspension, and we all know that the NHL and its referees never make arbitrary decisions on things like this. If I realized he got a game misconduct for that hit then I would have voted for the 2 game suspension. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sterling Archer Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 No way you watched the same vid I did. #1 Thorton did not come from the front. He was traveling parallel to the red line before the hit and continued parallel to the red line post-hit. Perron was traveling north-south, Thorton was clearly coming from the boards east-west. ETA- at the 5 second mark of that vid Thorton is along the boards at the red line striding towards center ice to make contact. Perron is just past his blue line looking back to recieve the pass. Thorton met Perron at the red line with Thorton still skating parallel to the line. Clearly blind side. No diff than a right defensive end catching a right handed QB from his blind side in the backfield. #2 Perron was looking back for several strides to accept that pass. He didn't have his head down until the puck was in his skates. He didn't put his head down because a hit was coming. He never saw Thorton. And to answer your question, I don't know. I don't know where/if the league will draw a line with whether a player should have prepared for the hit. Again, I'm not saying Thorton deserves a suspension, I'm just saying under the current interpretation he'll get one cuz this hit fits it. Thornton is clearly in front of Perron. Where he came from at that point is moot. He's in front of Perron. If Thornton is 5'10", he buries his shoulder in Perron's chest and we aren't even talking about this. It's like if I step in front of you and you are walking with your head down cuz you're texting on your phone. Am I the dick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 Thornton is clearly in front of Perron. Where he came from at that point is moot. He's in front of Perron. If Thornton is 5'10", he buries his shoulder in Perron's chest and we aren't even talking about this. It's like if I step in front of you and you are walking with your head down cuz you're texting on your phone. Am I the dick? Yes. Yes you are. Especially if you step in front of me with the sole intention of laying me out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sterling Archer Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 Yes. Yes you are. Especially if you step in front of me with the sole intention of laying me out. Well, I didn't. I was trying to stop you from walking into traffic. You're welcome. Now get off your ###### phone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 Well, I didn't. I was trying to stop you from walking into traffic. You're welcome. Now get off your ###### phone. Look, I get what you are saying about the height thing, but that had nothing to do with this hit. If the rest of Thorton's body followed through and hit him then I would agree (and he probably would not have been injured as badly as well). He only made contact with the head. He deserves to sit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 Thornton is clearly in front of Perron. Where he came from at that point is moot. He's in front of Perron. If Thornton is 5'10", he buries his shoulder in Perron's chest and we aren't even talking about this. It's like if I step in front of you and you are walking with your head down cuz you're texting on your phone. Am I the dick? Where he came from is important. He came from the side. He was only in front of him in terms relative position up ice. The hit clearly came from the side. I agree, if it is a chest hit we aren't talking about it. But that is because the rule specifically addresses head shots. Look, I enjoy hits like these. I wish a few Sabres threw them from time to time instead of recieveing them. I'm just stating how this hit relates to the rule. As a guy who loves a good bone crushing hit I have to admit, this was one of the hits the league was trying to address. It sucks that an instinctive play like the one Thorton saw developing before his very eyes would result in a suspension, but that is the way the rule is interpreted this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sterling Archer Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 48.1 Illegal Check to the Head- A lateral or blind side hit to an opponent where the head is targeted and/or the principle point of contact is not permitted. 48.2 Minor Penalty- There is no provision for a minor penalty for this rule. 48.3 Major Penalty- For a violation of this rule, a major penalty shall be assessed (see 48.4). 48.4 Game Misconduct- An automatic game misconduct penalty shall be assessed whenever a major penalty is assessed under this rule. 48.5 Match Penalty- The Referee, at his discretion, may assess a match penalty if, in his judgment, the player attempted to or deliberately injured his opponent with an illegal check to the head. 48.6 Fines and Suspensions- Any player who incurs a total of two (2) game misconducts under this rule, in either regular League or playoff games, shall be suspended automatically for the next game his team plays. For each subsequent game misconduct penalty the automatic suspension shall be increased by one game If deemed appropriate, supplementary discipline can be applied by the Commissioner at his discretion (refer to Rule 28). http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=538053#&navid=nhl-search Directly in front of you is not a blind side. Directly in front of you is not lateral. The only thing that happened was he made contact with his head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted November 6, 2010 Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 The only thing that happened was he made contact with his head. I guess we are going to have to agree to disagree. Seemed like a pretty obvious hit that came from his left side to me. And the league appears to agree with my observation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sterling Archer Posted November 6, 2010 Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 http://video.nhl.com/videocenter/console?catid=35&id=75548 watch the video again. the hits they give as examples have a glaring difference to the thornton hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted November 6, 2010 Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 http://video.nhl.com/videocenter/console?catid=35&id=75548 watch the video again. the hits they give as examples have a glaring difference to the thornton hit. LOL We are definitely in disagreement. I saw at least 3 examples in their video that were similar enough to Thorton's hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sterling Archer Posted November 6, 2010 Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 None of those hit had the hitter right straight on in the guys face. They all came from the side and half the time from behind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted November 6, 2010 Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 None of those hit had the hitter right straight on in the guys face. They all came from the side and half the time from behind. Right. And my contention is that Thorton came in from the side as well. He came in fully perpendicular to Perron's direction. It's very apparent that I'm not gonna convince you that Thorton came in from Perron's left side, and you aren't gonna convince me that it was a straight in from the front hit. At this point you won't be able to convince me that it was any angle other than 90 degrees. We might as well leave it at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sterling Archer Posted November 6, 2010 Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 I'll admit he came in from the side but contact didn't occur until Thornton was standing right in front of him. That's what I'm saying. He didn't initiate contact from the blind side. He hit him dead on in the face. He just arrived in front of him from a 90 degree angle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carpandean Posted November 6, 2010 Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 I'll admit he came in from the side but contact didn't occur until Thornton was standing right in front of him. That's what I'm saying. He didn't initiate contact from the blind side. He hit him dead on in the face. He just arrived in front of him from a 90 degree angle. I'm pretty sure that they talked about that exact case this Summer. Something about lateral approach and primary contact to the head. See Savard, Marc. Matt Cooke was in front of him, too. The play that the league wants there is to go through Perron's shoulder/body, but instead he cuts in front and put his forearm to Perron's head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sterling Archer Posted November 6, 2010 Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 I really have no problem with Thornton's hit. He was in front of him. He's tall so if he's standing straight up, there is going to be head contact. It's all part of the league's knee jerk reaction. Now, the hits that blatantly target the head are something that needs to be addressed. Thornton got 5 and the gate and that was more than enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunomatic Posted November 6, 2010 Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 I really have no problem with Thornton's hit. He was in front of him. He's tall so if he's standing straight up, there is going to be head contact. It's all part of the league's knee jerk reaction. Now, the hits that blatantly target the head are something that needs to be addressed. Thornton got 5 and the gate and that was more than enough. I think someone else mentioned it but fact remains if Thornton was Kaleta he would have got 10 games regardless of our perception of the hits legality and thats whats wrong with the N.H.L's discipline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carpandean Posted November 6, 2010 Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 I really have no problem with Thornton's hit. He was in front of him. He's tall so if he's standing straight up, there is going to be head contact. It's all part of the league's knee jerk reaction. Now, the hits that blatantly target the head are something that needs to be addressed. Thornton got 5 and the gate and that was more than enough. That's the thing, he did blatantly target the head. He's coming from more or less the side, so he could have just as easily cut across the front, gone through his body from the side, or even passed behind him. He chose the first one and basically made contact with his head. If he chooses the second and goes shoulder to shoulder (yes, he would have to go down some to keep from hitting the head), then Perron gets blown out of the play with a legal hit. This is a typical flyby head shot. It's actually easier to do that - just stick your elbow/forearm out as you cut across the front - than to hit the head going in straight from the side - have to go over the top (a little easier for Joe than some, but still.) As I said, the league showed enough examples of players coming from the side, cutting across the front and making primary contact with the head that it should be clear that they want those type of hits out of the game. To me, two games was a gift and, as previously stated, wouldn't have been given to a non-star, especially one with a history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spndnchz Posted November 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 8, 2010 New facebook app One week after passing the 1 million follower mark on Facebook, the NHL is launching its first interactive application for members of the social network. The application, called the BlackBerry All-Access Pregame, allows users to watch video segments from NHL.com’s popular All-Access broadband show and also lets fans rank NHL teams based on performance. http://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/article/67330 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spndnchz Posted November 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 8, 2010 Foligno, one punch knockout. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cIxzboUwsoo&feature=player_embedded Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nobody Posted November 8, 2010 Report Share Posted November 8, 2010 Foligno, one punch knockout. Thing I liked: One punch knockdown (just a TKO since the guy got up pretty quick.) Things I didn't like: Jason Peters style of fight with the arm sticking out there. The grandstanding. I'd like to see a better view of the initial hit on Foligno - seemed a tad late. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted November 8, 2010 Report Share Posted November 8, 2010 Thing I liked: One punch knockdown (just a TKO since the guy got up pretty quick.) Things I didn't like: Jason Peters style of fight with the arm sticking out there. The grandstanding. I'm with you on the grandstanding thing. I'm sure that just falls in the "stupid kid" category though. But hey, I would kind of like to see Jason Peters in an NHL fight. I bet that would be entertaining. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.